Consensus on Kidd-Harris Swap (Mav Fans Only)
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Consensus on Kidd-Harris Swap (Mav Fans Only)
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arkuo
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Consensus on Kidd-Harris Swap (Mav Fans Only)
it's been quite some time till this board got back into life... we've been talking bout the kidd-harris swap and like JES said, it's gonna be a long 159 hours till we hear news bout it after the all-star break... i was wondering what this board's feelings toward the swap.. i couldnt really picture out if the majority here is FOR or AGAINST trading for kidd... so please enter your vote so we could find out....
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magnav0x
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dirkules_41
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your_dallas_mavericks
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I was for the trade. I thought it would put us over the hump. But with Stack's comments causing rival owners and GMs to become irate and prevent Stack from being able to re-sign after the trade; I say no way. We can't give up that much and get so little back. No Stack, no trade!
If we could just close games with Luka, Kyrie, Green, Maxi, and Wood that'd be great...
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oldeagle
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catalyst wrote:I have resigned myself that it is going to happen. I now want to see it. It is expensive, and the window is over after next year. I think dirk may actually leave as well given how crappy this team will be after his contract is up. But you gotta go for it.
I agree, we have to go for it. So yes. Do it.
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JES12
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Out of all the players in that trade, Ager and Stack can be kissed good-bye. It's the other ones that I like.
Everyone on this board already knows I wanted george back in the starting lineup. Everyone knows what I like about Harris. They know my support for Diop. And they know I would trade Stack for expiring contracts.
Oh, BTW, with all this Kidd stuff, you know at least half the people who vote on this trade are outsiders. You are nto going to get real results.
Everyone on this board already knows I wanted george back in the starting lineup. Everyone knows what I like about Harris. They know my support for Diop. And they know I would trade Stack for expiring contracts.
Oh, BTW, with all this Kidd stuff, you know at least half the people who vote on this trade are outsiders. You are nto going to get real results.
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Sken
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Against,
but now I am like Cat... it or something of an overhaul in nature has to happen now.
but now I am like Cat... it or something of an overhaul in nature has to happen now.
10:20 (pm, 6/29/06) The Mavs take Maurice Ager at No. 28... Ager walks up to the stage in a triple-breasted, oversized beige suit, goes to shake hands with Stern and immediately gets whistled for a foul on Dwyane Wade.
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mavsfoty
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I'm for the trade for this reason.
The window for a championship for this team is 2-3 years whether Devin or Kidd is manning the point.
Josh Howard and Dirk are going to be at their prime for the next 2 to at most 3 seasons. Why not put an elite point guard with them for the next two and take a shot at winning?
Is Devin good? Hell yeah. Can he be great? Damn straight but it won't be this season and probably not next. When Dirk and Josh are no longer at the top of their game you can't really build around Devin. Kidd has a monster salary that could create cap room in the future.
I will hate to see Devin go but the ring is the thing. I've waited way to long for a Dallas Mavericks championship.
But really I just want all this crap over and done with.
The window for a championship for this team is 2-3 years whether Devin or Kidd is manning the point.
Josh Howard and Dirk are going to be at their prime for the next 2 to at most 3 seasons. Why not put an elite point guard with them for the next two and take a shot at winning?
Is Devin good? Hell yeah. Can he be great? Damn straight but it won't be this season and probably not next. When Dirk and Josh are no longer at the top of their game you can't really build around Devin. Kidd has a monster salary that could create cap room in the future.
I will hate to see Devin go but the ring is the thing. I've waited way to long for a Dallas Mavericks championship.
But really I just want all this crap over and done with.
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hph6203
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I'm torn, because I don't really like the make up of the team as it stands, but then again I'm not sure I'd like the Kidd trade either. Personally I wanted Ron Artest or Corey Maggette. They'd be easier (less expensive at least) to achieve, and would arguably increase the potential of this team just as much.
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from_ro_to_dirk
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My take:
I am for this trade. Here is why:
Yes, I like Devin, I like how he takes it to the hoop and his defense, but I dont think he his a floor leader, can run the offense without Avery's help, or find easy shots for guys on a consistent basis.
Everyone is so worried about Kidd's age, but the guy is about to be 35 and is the closest to averaging a triple double than anyone since Oscar Robertson. The guy is STILL one of the (if not the) top playmaking PGs. I don't see his abilities dropping off like a cliff dive like some people around here seem to think because he reached the (gasp!) age of 35. He will make life much easier for Dirk, JET, JHo and Stackhouse. I think our offense could be lethal again. he could even make Dampier effective offensively. Look what he did for Mikki Moore and Kristic. He is still a nice defender ( i think), and will be able to post up as well. I think he would help remove double teams from Dirk by having a more fluid offense. What we will lose offensively from Devin (mainly his drives) Kidd will make up for by finding many easy baskets for our scorers.
Diop -- Yes, losing Diop would hurt us especially now. But, there are still guys out there to get. We could do something for say Kurt Thomas. I think Kurt Thomas for Diop is a wash, and an upgrade offensively for sure. I don't know if Diop would even sign here after this season, considering he lack of playing time for long stretches and the interest that teams will have for him.
Ager -- If this post is just for Mavs fans, then you know i dont really have to say much here. Antoine Wright is what we'd want Ager to become at this point. Plus, Wright has been playing for the last 2 years regularly and has started for VC during various injuries and did an alright job. I could see him stepping in and being in the rotation.
George -- See Ager comment. **** him. He hasn't done **** for us for the two years we've had him. Don't need him especially if we get Wright and Malik Allen.
Stackhouse -- We were getting him back, so it works out. We would miss him for the 30 days but he could at least get rested and healed and be full strength and well rested for the stretch run and the playoffs. If the NBA sticks their nose in and wants to punish us, eventhough everybody does this sort of deal, then I don't want to lose Stackhouse.
$3 million -- who cares, Cuban has money.
Two draft picks. this year's pick woul be what...25th or so? Besides Josh Howard, what have we ever drafted that low. Hell, outside of the lottery? Hell, for the Mavs, IN the lottery? There's only been a hand full of good draft picks in this team's history. Just because we got lucky once with Howard, lets not act like this pick would have been anything big deal. hell, we probably would have traded out of the first round. Besides, we could get our future PG the following year. I think WAY too much is being made about giving up those two picks.
So, ultimately I see this as a trade of Devin and Diop for Kidd and Wright. Considering, IMO, that we need to try to win now and in the next 2 seasons, Kidd is the man to lead us.
I wouldnt have minded after this trade, then using KVH to get Cassell from the Clips. We'd then have two experienced, veteran PGs who can pass. Cassell would be out shooter. Or maybe we could have gone after Duhon in Chicago as our backup since he's a good defender. Not sure what htey would want; if salary cap relief would be enough. Or KVH for Kurt Thomas and Delonte West or Ridnour. Something like that.
Either way, I wish this trade went through. Or, i wish Cuban could use KVH and make this trade happen. I don't get his sudden fear over luxery dollars. You are so close to (IMO) making yourself a better team, and he's money conscious again.
I am for this trade. Here is why:
Yes, I like Devin, I like how he takes it to the hoop and his defense, but I dont think he his a floor leader, can run the offense without Avery's help, or find easy shots for guys on a consistent basis.
Everyone is so worried about Kidd's age, but the guy is about to be 35 and is the closest to averaging a triple double than anyone since Oscar Robertson. The guy is STILL one of the (if not the) top playmaking PGs. I don't see his abilities dropping off like a cliff dive like some people around here seem to think because he reached the (gasp!) age of 35. He will make life much easier for Dirk, JET, JHo and Stackhouse. I think our offense could be lethal again. he could even make Dampier effective offensively. Look what he did for Mikki Moore and Kristic. He is still a nice defender ( i think), and will be able to post up as well. I think he would help remove double teams from Dirk by having a more fluid offense. What we will lose offensively from Devin (mainly his drives) Kidd will make up for by finding many easy baskets for our scorers.
Diop -- Yes, losing Diop would hurt us especially now. But, there are still guys out there to get. We could do something for say Kurt Thomas. I think Kurt Thomas for Diop is a wash, and an upgrade offensively for sure. I don't know if Diop would even sign here after this season, considering he lack of playing time for long stretches and the interest that teams will have for him.
Ager -- If this post is just for Mavs fans, then you know i dont really have to say much here. Antoine Wright is what we'd want Ager to become at this point. Plus, Wright has been playing for the last 2 years regularly and has started for VC during various injuries and did an alright job. I could see him stepping in and being in the rotation.
George -- See Ager comment. **** him. He hasn't done **** for us for the two years we've had him. Don't need him especially if we get Wright and Malik Allen.
Stackhouse -- We were getting him back, so it works out. We would miss him for the 30 days but he could at least get rested and healed and be full strength and well rested for the stretch run and the playoffs. If the NBA sticks their nose in and wants to punish us, eventhough everybody does this sort of deal, then I don't want to lose Stackhouse.
$3 million -- who cares, Cuban has money.
Two draft picks. this year's pick woul be what...25th or so? Besides Josh Howard, what have we ever drafted that low. Hell, outside of the lottery? Hell, for the Mavs, IN the lottery? There's only been a hand full of good draft picks in this team's history. Just because we got lucky once with Howard, lets not act like this pick would have been anything big deal. hell, we probably would have traded out of the first round. Besides, we could get our future PG the following year. I think WAY too much is being made about giving up those two picks.
So, ultimately I see this as a trade of Devin and Diop for Kidd and Wright. Considering, IMO, that we need to try to win now and in the next 2 seasons, Kidd is the man to lead us.
I wouldnt have minded after this trade, then using KVH to get Cassell from the Clips. We'd then have two experienced, veteran PGs who can pass. Cassell would be out shooter. Or maybe we could have gone after Duhon in Chicago as our backup since he's a good defender. Not sure what htey would want; if salary cap relief would be enough. Or KVH for Kurt Thomas and Delonte West or Ridnour. Something like that.
Either way, I wish this trade went through. Or, i wish Cuban could use KVH and make this trade happen. I don't get his sudden fear over luxery dollars. You are so close to (IMO) making yourself a better team, and he's money conscious again.
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Pointguard01
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Count me against it. I will cheer for Kidd if he is here but I wouldnt support the trade. We are risking too much for something that Im not even sure makes us better than the other top teams.
If this was the only move to make to get better, then I might go for it. However, with guys like Artest, Maggette, Mike Miller, and so on all available, I question if this is the right deal. You give any of those teams 3 million cash, 2 first round picks and some fills and you got them and yet still could keep Devin/Diop.
If this was the only move to make to get better, then I might go for it. However, with guys like Artest, Maggette, Mike Miller, and so on all available, I question if this is the right deal. You give any of those teams 3 million cash, 2 first round picks and some fills and you got them and yet still could keep Devin/Diop.
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arkuo
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considering the mav fans on this board that gave reasons for their vote, and maybe some "outsiders" swaying the poll on their side, i say the consensus for this board is pretty much on the AGAINST side mainly because of the loss of devin harris....
i honestly wanted kidd back because it was because of him that i became a dallas fan in the 90's.... he COULD be the missing piece for the mavs to go over the hump, if cuban is willing to pay the price tag for kidd, then im all for it.... nobody said winning was cheap...
i honestly wanted kidd back because it was because of him that i became a dallas fan in the 90's.... he COULD be the missing piece for the mavs to go over the hump, if cuban is willing to pay the price tag for kidd, then im all for it.... nobody said winning was cheap...
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Teffer10
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My vote is for the trade.
Harris isn't where we need him to be in the development process and I'm not convinced that he ever will be.
I made a comment in the off season that Avery should give Dev an opportunity to run this team and trade him around TDL if it doesn't work out. Although it wasn't the best opportunity imo, Avery did give Dev a chance to quarterback this team for a while but it obviously did not work out for whatever reason. The team just doesn't seem to respond or embrace Dev's leadership as a PG.
That being said, I have to stand by my thoughts and the Mavs FO to make this decision. I do think Dev would have had a better opportunity to lead this team if they would have addressed the real problem with this team in the offseason by shipping out Terry. That is why I was so eager for the Mavs to move Terry and had several debates on possible trades for him in the offseason.
Harris isn't where we need him to be in the development process and I'm not convinced that he ever will be.
I made a comment in the off season that Avery should give Dev an opportunity to run this team and trade him around TDL if it doesn't work out. Although it wasn't the best opportunity imo, Avery did give Dev a chance to quarterback this team for a while but it obviously did not work out for whatever reason. The team just doesn't seem to respond or embrace Dev's leadership as a PG.
That being said, I have to stand by my thoughts and the Mavs FO to make this decision. I do think Dev would have had a better opportunity to lead this team if they would have addressed the real problem with this team in the offseason by shipping out Terry. That is why I was so eager for the Mavs to move Terry and had several debates on possible trades for him in the offseason.