RealGM

First of all, a little introduction. I'm a fan that has followed Kidd throughout his career, from his first stint with the Mavs, to Phoenix, to New Jersey, and now the Mavs (still follow the Nets though).

When the deal to the Mavs was announced, I thought it was a good deal for both teams. I now see that I'm wrong. New Jersey definitely got the better end of it. Kidd is a bad fit in Dallas. He went from one coach who utilized isolation too much (and thus taking away from his playmaking skills) to another that utilizes isolation too much. He went from one coach who doesn't make good in-game adjustments to another who has the same flaw. Watching the Nets with Lawrence Frank at the helm, and the several games I watched of the Mavs since Kidd joining them, the similarity between the two are pretty distinct.

Now on to the team itself. Wow, the Mavs are not the team who I thought they were. Gone was the team that was one of, if not the deepest team in the league a year or so ago (and this was before the trade, and you guys really didn't lose much from the bench aside from Diop, though he is a difference maker...albeit in spurts).

Stackhouse/Terry - I figured Terry would be a good fit in the backcourt with Kidd, since Terry can defend the smaller PGs that gives Kidd fits, and Kidd can defend the SGs. Offensively, Kidd needs a shooter also. Terry is just too inconsistent in that aspect though. Stackhouse appears to be past his prime. He's like Vince Carter lite....VERY VERY VERY lite. He doesn't attack the basket like he used to (at least Vince tries), and settles for jumpshots and fadeaways. His defense is close to non-existent also.

Josh Howard - I was never a big fan of his. Didn't think he is more than a very very good #3 option in the league, but wow, I never realized how dumb he is on the court. So he's not the dumbest player out there, but his BB IQ leaves a lot to be desired. One play that had me shaking my head from yesterday (aside from the 24 sec violations) was the play when Dirk had an open jumper from the three point line, but passed it to Howard, then cut to the basket. Josh got the ball, looked at Dirk for a second, and with a man in front of him, jacked up a three. Ugh. When the best player (and shooter) on your team decides to pass up an open three point shot early in the shotclock, it's probably a good idea not to hoist one up.

Bass - I like him. Given the opportunities, and more experience, I think he can be a starter in the NBA. Not a star, but a solid to good starter in the league. He needs the opportunity though, and I'm not sure Avery is the type of coach who can and will trust him of that role.

To top things off, you guys are well over the salary cap and luxury threshold, and have no first rounders to help add to the core of the team, which limits the way you can improve to trades and signing guys for the MLE (which would make your salary situation even worse, and I'm not sure even Cuban would be willing to spend this much).

As much as I love Kidd, and as much as I hate to say it to you guys, I think the makeup of this team is pretty pretty bad, and it would take an incredible deal/trade/signing for it to change. That being said, I still think a Kidd/Dirk tandem can work...they will just need that third person, or a group of guys who can come and provide support for them on a game-by-game basis.

"Thanks for nothing" comes to mind...

Imo Avery is gone after this season, especially if we lose in the 1st round. Hopefully then we'll see some changes take place. I agree that a Dirk-Kidd lead team can win a title, but we don't have much time left to make it happen.

Rand10 wrote:Imo Avery is gone after this season, especially if we lose in the 1st round. Hopefully then we'll see some changes take place. I agree that a Dirk-Kidd lead team can win a title, but we don't have much time left to make it happen.

I think Howard will have to be traded (along with Avery being gone), seeing as he's the Mavs best trade chip. Aside from him, the Mavs really don't have anyone worth of value.

This team just flat out blows.

pretty much.
Elite guards always burn this team in the playoffs

This team desperately needs a quality SG (and NO the Stackhouses, Georges, Joneses do not work).

Dampier would only be a backup on a championship team b/c every championship team has a dominant low post player.

Instead, this team was constructed around a unique jumpshooting 7 footer by placing streaky and one-dimensional jumpshooters around him. LOL.

This team's problem has always been its level of consistency, particularly among the players who surround Dirk (though Dirk's certainly had his moments as well). The difference between a great team/player and a good one is usually a matter of consistency. That's why we've been a good team, but not a great one.

Anyway, I think front office philosophy has been that if you can get enough inconsistently great players, there will always be someone who's "on fire" at the right time. Thus, Dirk will always have that "go to" teammate...we just won't know who it is night in and night out. One night it might be JET, the next Stack, and the next Josh.

Unfortunately, that won't win a championship unless the inconsistent guys get hot at the right times, which they almost did two years ago. I don't think you can build a team that way. Great talent that's inconsistent isn't great talent...it's mediocre talent. And that's what we've had around Dirk for three years.


Boy, looking at it that way, I have to ask: am I the only one who sees Don Nelson's fingerprints all over this team even today? Tell me Donnie hasn't taken his dad's coaching mindset and applied it to management.

^that's the problem, a finals run and 67 win season clouded their judgment.

What the Mavs should have done in the 06 offseason was go after an SG or post player hard...not sign Terry, Stackhouse to fat contracts. Same thing last offseason. Not reload the team with over the hill spares.

They are a good team, they just arent disciplined... That should always fall on the coach. You have to be able to keep your team focused.

dirkforpres wrote:They are a good team, they just arent disciplined... That should always fall on the coach. You have to be able to keep your team focused.

Mavs do not have the talent level to go all the way. I think we can thank Avery for motivating this team to play over their heads in the 06 POs and last year's regular season but his style isn't going to work with this group now. I'm beginning to get on the "fire Avery" bandwagon but there needs to be some player personnel changes as well for this team to have a legit opportunity next season.

you're right on there teffer.
we just dont have enough talent on the roster. there need to be some major changes, only problem is we dont have good trade chips.
avery needs to go, I think a new coach with a new philosophy could at least bring some positive energy to this team

what do u guys think bass could fetch in a trade?

Not enough to close the hole at the 2 or to even consider two big holes at the center and powerforward position. Bass will stay a Mav for a long time.

I just had a discussion with a bulls fan on the bulls board and theyre considering swapping Stack for Nocioni and his massiv contract. Nocioni would be a very nice player here if he could find back to his toughness. If we trade Josh for an Allstar SG, bring Reyshawn along George back, dump Juwan in the desert of Gobi and split the MLE between Diop and Obryant... we might look at a younger and more talented team post-playoffs.
Just saying its possible.

Captain_Obvious wrote:Not enough to close the hole at the 2 or to even consider two big holes at the center and powerforward position. Bass will stay a Mav for a long time.

I just had a discussion with a bulls fan on the bulls board and theyre considering swapping Stack for Nocioni and his massiv contract. Nocioni would be a very nice player here if he could find back to his toughness. If we trade Josh for an Allstar SG, bring Reyshawn along George back, dump Juwan in the desert of Gobi and split the MLE between Diop and Obryant... we might look at a younger and more talented team post-playoffs.
Just saying its possible.

Nocioni would be a good fit IMO, but then Josh will have to be dealt for a SG. I also don't think less than MLE would be enough to bring Diop back.

SpeedyG wrote:-= original quote snipped =-



Nocioni would be a good fit IMO, but then Josh will have to be dealt for a SG. I also don't think less than MLE would be enough to bring Diop back.

Theres also the possibility of Josh switching to the SG position, but idk. Its kind of sad, you look at JHo and see his incredible talent, his perfect body for basketball (very long arms!) and then he kind of disappears when it really counts. Disappear is a kindly word, he hurts you. I feel almost the same about Stack.
I think we need to get rid of both players, Josh needs a change of scenery, Stack well his career is almost over anyways.

I think Josh will fetch you great talent and we have to do it next season. Problem is that the numbers dont match with the majority of top SGs in this league, so we might have to include JET and that will lower the value of the package. Still i want a top SG back, we desperatly need another No 1 option on offense.(Maybe TMac if rockets get swept?)
If Diop commands the MLE, well we need a backup C no matter what. But there are more Cs available this offseason, i cant imagine everyone of them getting a big payday. OBryant is just a young prospect, he may come for the minimum and we go from there.

Captain_Obvious wrote:-= original quote snipped =-


Theres also the possibility of Josh switching to the SG position, but idk. Its kind of sad, you look at JHo and see his incredible talent, his perfect body for basketball (very long arms!) and then he kind of disappears when it really counts. Disappear is a kindly word, he hurts you. I feel almost the same about Stack.
I think we need to get rid of both players, Josh needs a change of scenery, Stack well his career is almost over anyways.

I think Josh will fetch you great talent and we have to do it next season. Problem is that the numbers dont match with the majority of top SGs in this league, so we might have to include JET and that will lower the value of the package. Still i want a top SG back, we desperatly need another No 1 option on offense.(Maybe TMac if rockets get swept?)
If Diop commands the MLE, well we need a backup C no matter what. But there are more Cs available this offseason, i cant imagine everyone of them getting a big payday. OBryant is just a young prospect, he may come for the minimum and we go from there.

It really wouldn't make sense to have Josh play SG. What's the #1 problem that most fans have with him now? Too many jumpshots. Considering he's not a very good jumpshooter, then you already know he'll fail in that role (or be less than adequate, fail is a tough word). So a year from now, you'll be talking about the same thing as far as his game.

His contract makes it a problem though, I agree. I think the Mavs will have to settle for a decent SG but is a better fit + depth.

Rand10 wrote:Imo Avery is gone after this season, especially if we lose in the 1st round. Hopefully then we'll see some changes take place. I agree that a Dirk-Kidd lead team can win a title, but we don't have much time left to make it happen.

Agreed.

studcrackers wrote:what do u guys think bass could fetch in a trade?

Mavs wouldnt do it.

studcrackers wrote:what do u guys think bass could fetch in a trade?

Trading Bass would come back to haunt the Mavs. We haven't had this kind of inside presence since (GAWK!) Roy Tarpley... Keep this kid and trade the stoner Josh Howard instead.

studcrackers wrote:what do u guys think bass could fetch in a trade?

Not as much as you may think. I believe a late first round or more role players. At this point, I hope we keep Bass around, because it'd be hard to replace his energy off the bench.