RealGM

http://realgm.com/src_checktrade.php?tradeid=4632921

I saw this trade idea somewhere on a message board and wanted to see
your thoughts. I believe this is a good trade for all teams involved
if the mavs are looking to blow it up some. I usually don't like three
team deals but this looks to work out for all three involved. The
problem with this trade is it really hurts the mavs bench.Although they will only have to find role players through free agency instead of trying to find players that will have significant playing time.


Mavs Trade:
Josh Howard
Jason Terry
Jerry Stackhouse
Eddie Jones
Brandon Bass

Mavs Get:
Michael Redd
Ron Artest
Dan Gadzuric

Milwaukee Trades:
Michael Redd
Ramon Sessions
Dan Gadzuric

Milwaukee Gets:
Josh Howard
Jason Terry
Jerry Stackhouse

Sacramento Trades:
Ron Artest

Sacramento Gets:
Brandon Bass
Ramon Sessions
Eddie Jones


Mavs Lineup:
Jason Kidd
Michael Redd
Ron Artest
Dirk Nowitzki
Erick Dampier

Looks good on paper but I don't know about in an actual game.

This one is going to get mixed results. Artest and Redd are both half court players and Kidd is not.

But regardless, Redd is a taller, less effecient Jason Terry. And I would not do Artest for Howard either unless Sacramento sweetened it. Together...if that (or that + Stack) was it, I'd do it, but there is no way that warrants Brandon Bass or Gadzuric. If Bass is required, take Howard and Gadzuric out..

BTW, Terry is not going to a team with Mo Williams

Not a bad trade, I would definately do it from a Mavs perspective.

JES12 wrote:Redd is a taller, less effecient Jason Terry.

JES12 wrote:This one is going to get mixed results. Artest and Redd are both half court players and Kidd is not.

Agreed. I'd take one or the other but both would be a poor fit with Kidd. I'd rather have Marion and Redd.

RingtheBell wrote:

Over the past 4 seasons Terry has had a higher FG%, 3PT%, TS%, and eFG% than Redd.

Rand10 wrote:-= original quote snipped =-


Over the past 4 seasons Terry has had a higher FG%, 3PT%, TS%, and eFG% than Redd.

I assume there is alot more to that just numbers. For one, Redd has played on a horrible team for a while now. That being the case, I assume they would be playing from behind. Redd being the best player and shooter, probably took alot of shots. He takes all the shots cause he has too. Terry has never had as much responsibility as Redd. He has better size and can get to the basket. Maybe under Rick, he plays better D. Anyway to slice it, this is a great trade for Dallas.

P.S. I say all this being a Terry fan as well.

A-Town Connection wrote:I assume there is alot more to that just numbers. For one, Redd has played on a horrible team for a while now. That being the case, I assume they would be playing from behind. Redd being the best player and shooter, probably took alot of shots. He takes all the shots cause he has too. Terry has never had as much responsibility as Redd. He has better size and can get to the basket. Maybe under Rick, he plays better D. Anyway to slice it, this is a great trade for Dallas.

P.S. I say all this being a Terry fan as well.

I agree with you that Redd is better than Terry. I was just pointing out that the in response to Terry being more efficient is way off.

More shot attempts definitely have a lot to do with it, but I think most Bucks fans will tell you that Redd is a chucker even with the load he has to carry offensively. If he only took as many attempts as Terry their shooting %'s would be pretty close. In no way would Redd blow Terry out of the water though.

Milwaukee wouldnt want Terry with having Moe Williams on board.

I would do it for Dallas. Redd >>> Terry & Howard/Artest is close.

Remember that we are absorbing Gadzuric and giving up Bass.

Red and Artest? Terry + one of Bass/Howard + salary filler (Stack) to match Redd's huge contract. Giving all 3 would be insane as Redd is a volume shooter and Artest is a complete headcase.

JES12 wrote:Remember that we are absorbing Gadzuric and giving up Bass.

Redd and Artest? Terry + one of Bass/Howard + salary filler (Stack) to match Redd's huge contract. Giving all 3 would be insane as Redd is a volume shooter and Artest is a complete headcase.

Still, we should do it if this happen.

Remember our offseason goal.
1. Trade Josh Howard for a swingman who can help us succeed in playoff.
Ron Artest is one of those guys. He's not even an one-way player.
2. Trade Terry for a taller shooter. Michael Redd is the best example.
We miss some fast breaks and lane towards a traditional team, though.

Brandon Bass is a good role player. Don't fool yourself. His ceiling is quite limited. Malik Allen can offer his shooting. Never him or Allen is a good rebounder, though.

Jerry Stackhouse is never the same. Dan Gadzuric is a reasonable pickup as backup C. Per 48 mintues, he's a quite good rebounder and shot-blocker a couple of years ago.

We can still spend the MLE on Diop and Eddie. The roster is solid.
C - Damp / Diop* / Gadz
PF - Dirk / Najera* / Allen*
SF - Artest / DG* / RAT*
SG - Redd / AW* / Giddens*
PG - Kidd / JJB* / Seibutis*

Re-sign DG, AW, and JJB at Bird's right.
Sign Giddens (#51), RAT, and Seibutis for rookie contract.
Sign Eddie & Diop. Or we can sign Diop with bird's right next year.

We are a step closer to Lakers and Celtics' matchup. We're a little bit weak at PG. We should lobby Lue to stay also.

Watch....mark my words.

Everything I said about Harris last year.....other Mavs not realizing what they have til it's gone. Underestimating their potential.

It will be Bass this year.

I would not mind trading Bass to a team wanting young players (Bass + filler like Stack for Artest), but Howard + Bass for Artest? Outright Crazy. Howard OR Bass, not both. And if it is Howard, Sac needs to add an incentive. Upgrading Terry to Redd with some incentive would be fine as well. Howard + Terry for Artest + Redd (of course, Stack as salary filler) fine. All 3? You outright CRAZY!


Mark my words!!!!!!!

I have to agree with Darren on Bass.

He is a good player but I see very little upside to his game.
I think he would be good trade bait this off-season to address our starting SG or backup center (or starting center) needs.

An outstanding backup for Dirk is a luxury for this team but not a necessity. If we can fill those 2 huge holes in our sinking ship without giving up Bass, I would love to keep him as long as we don't create other large holes in the process.

JES12 thinks he will be another Harris situation. I think he will become another M. Daniels, Terry, LaFrentz, Bradley, Dampier, Finley, and Stack overpaid situation if we don't trade him.

If we can fill those 2 huge holes in our sinking ship without giving up Bass, I would love to keep him as long as we don't create other large holes in the process.

Yes, if we can fill those two holes.

I don't see where trading all of Terry, Bass and Howard for Artest and Redd fills those holes. Like I said before, I'm not opposed to Bass + filler (Stack) for Artest. I'm not opposed to Howard for Artest + sweetner. I am totally opposed to trading all 3 of them for a trigger happy, less effecient (compared to Terry) shooting guard and a complete nut.

That's all I am saying.

Once again, Bass + Stack for Miller, Maggette, Artest, Redd, Marion (+ George to match salary of Marion and Redd), fine because it fills a need.

But comparing Bass to any of those other players that we all agreed were overpaid at the time of the signing is ludicrous.

JES12 wrote:

But comparing Bass to any of those other players that we all agreed were overpaid at the time of the signing is ludicrous.

Bass is a backup for our best player. Unless the Mavs trade Dirk, there is no need to give Bass a big contract.
By the time Bass is in his prime this team will be horrible.

I think there is a good chance that Bass will be traded this off-season.

I think Bass gets traded during the season, heightening his value. Bass would get us more if we traded him during the season near the trade deadline.

If we trade Bass in the offseason, it needs to be a draft day trade for a 1st round pick in this year's draft. That would make the most sense for us.

your_dallas_mavericks wrote:I think Bass gets traded during the season, heightening his value. Bass would get us more if we traded him during the season near the trade deadline.

If we trade Bass in the offseason, it needs to be a draft day trade for a 1st round pick in this year's draft. That would make the most sense for us.

Your first paragraph makes sense but I don't agree with the second.
Bass' value does probably go up in the first half of the season but if we trade him at TDL we will hear all of the excuses again about not having enough time to work together when the POs get here. Also, if Bass is getting sufficient playing time to showcase his talents, that means he will be playing center again which is something that I never want to see unless we are playing GS.

If this team is going with Dirk (which is most likely the case), they need veteran players around him. A mid round draft pick (at best) would not give us a player that would have an impact during our short window of opportunity. If this team does go with Dirk for the next 2-3 years, we have no business drafting guys for our future when those assets should be used to acquire better veteran players around Dirk and Kidd.

The only reason to keep Bass is if we trade Dirk. I'm not even sure it would make sense to keep Bass in the rebuilding process.

IF Bass made 3-6 million this year trading him at the TDL would make sense. Since he makes less than a million all you can get is a player making a million that has a 3 year contract some team doesn't like.

Bass' value is going to be the sweetener to a team that takes a bad contract from us (JET) or feels that they need him to balance a trade.

I could see something along the lines of a Howard + Bass for Redd + Villanueva IF Dallas were willing to throw picks OR take on one more bad contract (Bobby Simmons) for Stack and Jones.

Sken wrote:IF Bass made 3-6 million this year trading him at the TDL would make sense. Since he makes less than a million all you can get is a player making a million that has a 3 year contract some team doesn't like.

Bass' value is going to be the sweetener to a team that takes a bad contract from us (JET) or feels that they need him to balance a trade.

I could see something along the lines of a Howard + Bass for Redd + Villanueva IF Dallas were willing to throw picks OR take on one more bad contract (Bobby Simmons) for Stack and Jones.

I tend to agree...trading Bass during this off-season makes more sense than TDL. I can see Bass being packaged with Stack, Terry, or Howard but I would not trade Howard and Bass for Villanueva and Redd. That would create a huge hole at SF.
If we could get a 3rd team involved like Sac to net Redd and Artest then I wouldn't mind seeing something like that happen.

The bottom line in trading Bass and Howard is to upgrade the SG position without compromising too much at SF. I'm okay with a hole at backup PF
if we can make those things happen.