RealGM

There was an article the other day how Donnie Nelson said the mavs need to get creative with their roster and I believe there is a trade that can benefit both sides and give the mavs the financial relief they are looking for.

Mavs Trade:
Josh Howard
Jerry Stackhouse

Lakers Trade:
Lamar Odom
Trevor Ariza

This trade gives the lakers a solid SF and another role player in Stackhouse, who also will bring more toughness to their team. For the mavs, we get one of the better rebounders in the NBA as well as an above average defender. Ariza is a young SF who has a lot of upside. He was injured for most of this season, but in the past when he has gotten more minutes he is a good player who is very athletic. He could be a player the mavs would want to hold on to for their future.

Also this trade gives them immediate cap relief. More than likely the mavs will extend Jason Kidds contract but if they don't, the only players under contract next season would be Dirk, Terry, Dampier which would equal around $40 mil. This gives them room to resign Bass, Ariza, and possibly Odom depending on his play. If not they could use the cap room to go after a free agent then resign their players after the free agent signing. I'm not sure who is up next year but I'm sure there will be a few players out there the mavs would like to have.

No thanks.

The whole cap flexibility is crap to me. The only way I want that is if we are rebuilding. There is no point to making the team worse but gaining cap flexibility for the sake of it, because you are in a worse spot than before. Plus, Howard's value hasnt dropped that much. Any team in the league would trade him for expiring's++. That's not an issue.

Odom just doesnt fit this team. His talent level is close to Howard, though I think Howard, but he just doesnt fit in with Kidd/Dirk, and unfortunately, both are probably on this team next year.

Just because you don't like your Camaro anymore doesn't mean you'll sell it for $200.

Odom has to be one of the most overrated players in the league. I would rather take my chances with Josh in the future than sell him low for Lamar Odom

Pointguard01 wrote:The whole cap flexibility is crap to me. The only way I want that is if we are rebuilding. There is no point to making the team worse but gaining cap flexibility for the sake of it, because you are in a worse spot than before. Plus, Howard's value hasnt dropped that much. Any team in the league would trade him for expiring's++. That's not an issue.

I would normally agree with you on the cap flexibilty thing, mainly because if you get under the cap, other teams can still pay their guy more than you can, so often you can't bring in anyone real great anyway. But, I'm concerned that Brandon Bass continues to improve and looks like he could be a real nice piece of the puzzle, and then some other team with cap room comes along and offers him more than the Mavs are able to. Bass is the only young guy on the team with any promise, and to lose him for nothing would be a big blow.

I certainly wouldn't trade Howard for just expiring deals. He definitely still has more value than that. I would have to consider dealing him for expiring plus a nice draft pick, say Milwaukee's. Draft someone like Eric Gordon, Joe Alexander, or Brook Lopez. Maybe some would look at this as a step back, but when you consider how bad Josh was post-Kidd, not sure it really would be.

Pointguard01 wrote:Odom just doesnt fit this team. His talent level is close to Howard, though I think Howard, but he just doesnt fit in with Kidd/Dirk, and unfortunately, both are probably on this team next year.

You may be right in that Odom wouldn't fit in with Dirk and Kidd. I would speculate he'd just about have to fit better on the offensive end. Defense might be a problem as they likely have trouble finding someone to defend the quick SF with a Dirk, Damp, Odom front line. We have a decent amount of evidence to suggest Howard doesn't fit, so I really hope they go in some other direction and Josh Howard is not on the team. His playoff antics were rather disgusting to me, and I just can't imagine he'll ever be a player you can trust in that situation. He seems to have decided he's a jump shooter rather than a slasher, regardless of whether the ball's going in ('cause of course he has no control over what that ball does???). He's nothing special with regards to defense. If his value in fact has not slipped much around the league, then hopefully they deal him soon before it does, which I have a feeling it surely will. They may not be able to put him in the program due to his comments, but I would highly expect to see him coming up for a few "random" tests soon.

SaintofKillers wrote:Just because you don't like your Camaro anymore doesn't mean you'll sell it for $200.

or trade it for a Fiero...

Oh, how I wanted this to be a good trade. I think not. Try again

mrmreg wrote: I would normally agree with you on the cap flexibilty thing, mainly because if you get under the cap, other teams can still pay their guy more than you can, so often you can't bring in anyone real great anyway. But, I'm concerned that Brandon Bass continues to improve and looks like he could be a real nice piece of the puzzle, and then some other team with cap room comes along and offers him more than the Mavs are able to. Bass is the only young guy on the team with any promise, and to lose him for nothing would be a big blow.

Trading our starting small forward for an expiring so we can re-sign (and overpay) a backup to the best player on the team is about the worst move we could possibly make. Bass is a nice player, but he'll never start as long as Dirk is here, and even if we trade Dirk and rebuild, Bass isn't a guy you can build the team around.

Rand10 wrote:

mrmreg wrote: I would normally agree with you on the cap flexibilty thing, mainly because if you get under the cap, other teams can still pay their guy more than you can, so often you can't bring in anyone real great anyway. But, I'm concerned that Brandon Bass continues to improve and looks like he could be a real nice piece of the puzzle, and then some other team with cap room comes along and offers him more than the Mavs are able to. Bass is the only young guy on the team with any promise, and to lose him for nothing would be a big blow.

Trading our starting small forward for an expiring so we can re-sign (and overpay) a backup to the best player on the team is about the worst move we could possibly make. Bass is a nice player, but he'll never start as long as Dirk is here, and even if we trade Dirk and rebuild, Bass isn't a guy you can build the team around.

In the playoffs, Bass was a far better player than Josh. Small sample I'll grant, but one is on the upswing the other is not. One was out there giving about the most effort of anyone in a Mavs jersey, while the other was far more concerned about who was coming to his birthday party. Maybe it causes me to not look at the picture rationally, but I have to say as a fan it's awfully tough for me to stomache watching a player who clearly cares less about whether his team wins than I do. I have to guess it doesn't sit real well with some teammates either.

Whether Bass ever starts of not, if he can continue to develop, he should be a very useful player and there will be no problem getting him minutes.

Also, in my scenario they'd get a high draft pick, not just dump Josh.

You may disagree but IMO when the '09 season rolls around if they have on their roster either a) Josh H, or b) Eric Grodon (or Westbrook or Alexander) and Brandon Bass, give me option b all day long.

jwa1107 wrote:

SaintofKillers wrote:Just because you don't like your Camaro anymore doesn't mean you'll sell it for $200.

or trade it for a Fiero...

If you notice the engine mounts are getting all rusty and you're afraid the enigne is just going to fall out of that Camaro in the next year or so, maybe trading it for a Monte Carlo wouldn't be so bad.

mrmreg wrote:I would normally agree with you on the cap flexibilty thing, mainly because if you get under the cap, other teams can still pay their guy more than you can, so often you can't bring in anyone real great anyway. But, I'm concerned that Brandon Bass continues to improve and looks like he could be a real nice piece of the puzzle, and then some other team with cap room comes along and offers him more than the Mavs are able to. Bass is the only young guy on the team with any promise, and to lose him for nothing would be a big blow.

I certainly wouldn't trade Howard for just expiring deals. He definitely still has more value than that. I would have to consider dealing him for expiring plus a nice draft pick, say Milwaukee's. Draft someone like Eric Gordon, Joe Alexander, or Brook Lopez. Maybe some would look at this as a step back, but when you consider how bad Josh was post-Kidd, not sure it really would be.

I just fail to see how dropping our salary about 7 million for next offseason helps us sign Bass. We would still be over the cap & we'd still have the same standards to sign Bass for correct? It would come down to whether Cuban is willing to do so, and I cant imagine he wouldnt considering the other players he's signed before, not to mention Dampier's 12 million would come off the books the following year.

Though Im not totally against trading Howard for a player/pick under certain circumstances, I wouldnt do it for the cap flexibility towards Bass.

Pointguard01 wrote:You may be right in that Odom wouldn't fit in with Dirk and Kidd. I would speculate he'd just about have to fit better on the offensive end. Defense might be a problem as they likely have trouble finding someone to defend the quick SF with a Dirk, Damp, Odom front line. We have a decent amount of evidence to suggest Howard doesn't fit, so I really hope they go in some other direction and Josh Howard is not on the team. His playoff antics were rather disgusting to me, and I just can't imagine he'll ever be a player you can trust in that situation. He seems to have decided he's a jump shooter rather than a slasher, regardless of whether the ball's going in ('cause of course he has no control over what that ball does???). He's nothing special with regards to defense. If his value in fact has not slipped much around the league, then hopefully they deal him soon before it does, which I have a feeling it surely will. They may not be able to put him in the program due to his comments, but I would highly expect to see him coming up for a few "random" tests soon.

I think we'll have Howard on the roster come this offseason in most circumstances due to his vaue dropping a bit. Back in December, his value was sky rocketing and he was becoming overrated. Now, in terms of trade value, he probably is underrated. He is still a great great great 3rd option and he's paid like it, which is good. Most teams would love to have him. Most teams dont have a 3rd option like him either.

I think if we did a trade like above, where its trading Howard for a pick + extras, something will get done in the offseason, but if we are looking to get an upgrade type of player that's already proved themself in this league, we will have to wait until mid season and hope Howard's back to form.

Rand10 wrote:

mrmreg wrote: I would normally agree with you on the cap flexibilty thing, mainly because if you get under the cap, other teams can still pay their guy more than you can, so often you can't bring in anyone real great anyway. But, I'm concerned that Brandon Bass continues to improve and looks like he could be a real nice piece of the puzzle, and then some other team with cap room comes along and offers him more than the Mavs are able to. Bass is the only young guy on the team with any promise, and to lose him for nothing would be a big blow.

Trading our starting small forward for an expiring so we can re-sign (and overpay) a backup to the best player on the team is about the worst move we could possibly make. Bass is a nice player, but he'll never start as long as Dirk is here, and even if we trade Dirk and rebuild, Bass isn't a guy you can build the team around.

Agree with Rand10...it makes no sense to keep Bass if we are going to try to win with Dirk. This team has much greater needs than a backup PF. I like Bass as a PF but not Center or SF.
If we were to rebuild, I'd rather trade him for a mid round draft pick if possible. Bass is a nice player but I see very little upside to his game. No sense giving him a huge contract.

The Mavs should use Howard, Bass, Stack, Jones, and George (any combinations) to signficantly upgrade the SG and SF positions if possible. All of the backup positions can be filled with MLE and vet min players.
If we can't improve the starting lineup, this team needs to seriously think about rebuilding.