Toronto - Dominican Republic connection

[denny]

I wonder how much consideration AA gave to the cultural aspect of the off-season moves. Adding 3 more DR players to the field...and Izturius is Venezualen. Our batting order starts with 4 DR players now. I think we have 10 in total mostly skewed to the top of the depth chart. I'm pretty sure that the Jays have always had alot of players from the DR and I specifically remember hearing that TO kinda spearheaded alot of scouting and recruiting there back in the 80's. Not something you really hear mentioned that much now. Anyone else think that AA was conscientous in signing more DR players?

You can see how the Raptors have intended to cash in on recruiting/signing/drafting European players. I think there's some of the same things in both cases. For one, there's always going to be some American-born players that simply don't want to move to Canada. European basketball players and West Indian baseball players are ALREADY leaving their home country. So it can even out an inherited disadvantage that Toronto has in competing in US dominated leagues. And with our city having so many different communities in it....there's individual cases where it can become an advantage for us in negotiating for non-US players.

It also has the potential of creating a sense of identity on the team. And that can become a re-inforcing advantage....If the Jays have success....it might become enticing for other DR players to want to play here. Cheaper contracts and cooperative agents. There's also the consideration that players from the same baseball culture will have better chemistry on the field....comeraderie...team spirit.

Thoughts?

[Redeemer]

I wonder how much consideration AA gave to the cultural aspect of the off-season moves. Adding 3 more DR players to the field...and Izturius is Venezualen. Our batting order starts with 4 DR players now. I think we have 10 in total mostly skewed to the top of the depth chart. I'm pretty sure that the Jays have always had alot of players from the DR and I specifically remember hearing that TO kinda spearheaded alot of scouting and recruiting there back in the 80's. Not something you really hear mentioned that much now. Anyone else think that AA was conscientous in signing more DR players?

You can see how the Raptors have intended to cash in on recruiting/signing/drafting European players. I think there's some of the same things in both cases. For one, there's always going to be some American-born players that simply don't want to move to Canada. European basketball players and West Indian baseball players are ALREADY leaving their home country. So it can even out an inherited disadvantage that Toronto has in competing in US dominated leagues. And with our city having so many different communities in it....there's individual cases where it can become an advantage for us in negotiating for non-US players.

It also has the potential of creating a sense of identity on the team. And that can become a re-inforcing advantage....If the Jays have success....it might become enticing for other DR players to want to play here. Cheaper contracts and cooperative agents. There's also the consideration that players from the same baseball culture will have better chemistry on the field....comeraderie...team spirit.

Thoughts?

[mini]

Would have been nice to add David Ortiz to our collection. I wonder if he has regrets signing back with Boston so early instead of seeing how the off-season played out. I guess we'll just have to sign Cano next year.

[TreyTone]

This smells like a fan coming over the Raptors board. While most of us know B. Colangelo hearts Euros because he feels they fit the culture of Toronto, I find it hard to believe A.A has the same plan.
First of all, baseball players are a different breed than basketball players.
All the superstars in basketball want to play with each other in a big market because image is everything to those guys. In baseball, money will almost always be the deciding factor.
Second, when we picked up Bautista and Encarnacion they weren't the same players we see today. They've made huge improvements and we've been fortunate enough to have them both at the top of their game. Reyes was someone who A.A always liked and Melky just happened to be the best left fielder on the market at that price.
All coincidence I think. Not planned.

[9er_4life]

I don't think that AA has intentionally gone after players due to their citizenship, I just think they happen to have more Dominican players now because that country has an insane ability to produce top-notch ball players. AA does have more of an emphasis on toolsy, all-round talents, and often times these types of players come from the Caribbean. I remember boycotting the Star for a few years after Cox's ridiculous article on the 'White Jays' that made the front cover of their newspaper. His journalistic prowess was on full-display as he pointed out that the Jays roster at the time only had one or two non-white players on it (V Wells was one, I can't remember the other). He neglected to mention JP's penchant for drafting low-ceiling college players - a demographic heavily skewed towards people of the caucasian persuasion. He was looking for some conspiracy in order to get his own name out there, and I still can't stand the guy for it, or for about 99% of his so-called reporting.

So I would distance myself from a Coxian argument. But, it does raise a potentially interesting consequence of AA's recent acquisitions. A few years ago they decided to invest heavily in scouting the Caribbean again (they were one of the leaders in this region in the 80's) and that's born fruit in their international free agent signings. I do think that the emergence of Joey Bats, Eddy E, and acquiring guys like Reyes, Cabrera, and even Boni, can't hurt their chances of convincing young Caribbean kids to sign with the Jays. It would give the kids instant mentors and players to emulate. Remember, a lot of these countries are dirt-poor, and the baseball circles are fairly small at the highest levels. They'd have a chance to rub shoulders with guys in their own organizations, on their own home turf. While money is the biggest signing factor, it couldn't hurt to have a roster full of Dominican stars as we continue to look to sign the top young free agents from that area.

[tecumseh18]

I remember boycotting the Star for a few years after Cox's ridiculous article on the 'White Jays' that made the front cover of their newspaper.

What I remember is that the Jays were actually riding high at the time that article came out, and immediately went into a tailspin.

I don't mind people reporting facts, as uncomfortable as they be. But that's easy. The hard part of being a journalist is presenting the entire context of the facts in a detached, objective way. The entire context was that North American blacks have turned away from baseball in a big way over the last 20 years. It has been much discussed, and 60 Minutes in the US devoted a segment to the phenomenon. So the changing demographic makeup of the Jays could easily have been seen as a microcosm of the secular trend. Not to say there weren't some other factors at work in the Jays case, including as you say our refusal to pay overslot/commitment to college players.

And maybe other reasons, too. I'll always remember a few years ago the Jays promoting their upcoming season with three white faces. It bugged me, because I remember Damasco Garcia, George Bell, Tony F et al. Our leadership in opening up the DR to player exploitation helped establish a, uh, "winning culture" in Toronto in the mid-80s that was self-reinforcing and carried over to the championship generation of stars in the early 90s.

The changes under AA, beginning with the strong attempt to win the Chapman sweepstakes and success in getting Hech, were quick and dramatically different from moves of the JP regime. But here's a theory - management decided that on top of his bat prowess, Jose Bautista was such a natural leader that they could count on him to ensure that DR or other Latin players bought into the system. So they started bringing them.

[Randle McMurphy]

I remember boycotting the Star for a few years after Cox's ridiculous article on the 'White Jays' that made the front cover of their newspaper. His journalistic prowess was on full-display as he pointed out that the Jays roster at the time only had one or two non-white players on it (V Wells was one, I can't remember the other). He neglected to mention JP's penchant for drafting low-ceiling college players - a demographic heavily skewed towards people of the caucasian persuasion. He was looking for some conspiracy in order to get his own name out there, and I still can't stand the guy for it, or for about 99% of his so-called reporting.

You might want to revise the way you think about him because Damien Cox didn't write any such article (which isn't to say I like him as a journalist anyway). The name you're looking for is Geoff Baker.

[denny]

Well, the DR producing tons of players doesn't explain why the Jays have 10. The tigers come second in DR representation with 7 and those players aren't nearly as vital to their team as ours. There's a couple more teams with 6. But no other team comes close to having 4 DR players at the top of their batting order.

I suppose it could be a coincidence....but that seems pretty unlikely to me. I think the previous poster might be onto something with J Bautista's emergence here and how that might have changed AA's strategy. JB seems to be a likeable guy with his countrymen....so why not exploit that?

If Boni ends up playing second base we'll have 5 DR bats in our starting lineup. Has that ever even happened before?

And again, if we have success the first half of the season....I can see how players from the DR might be more likely to come here via trade just for the fun of it. We could end up being the DR all-star team.