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The psychological failings of the Jays

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The psychological failings of the Jays 

Post#1 » by dagger » Sat Aug 10, 2013 4:50 am

If you are religious in your devotion to stat-driven analysis, don't read this, you won't believe a thing:

http://www.thestar.com/news/insight/201 ... _2013.html
Jackson’s observation is especially germane to this year’s Blue Jays, who appeared, for most of the season, to be a team with a fragile psyche and without much of a soul.

The former Notre Dame football coach Lou Holtz once said, “I have seen teams short on talent win famous victories simply because they were better prepared, more focused than their opposition.”

This summer, Toronto has seen a team long on talent lose for want of the same virtues.
“Fundamentals,” said Holtz. “Ignore them at your peril.”

Too often, the Jays appeared to put more energy into celebratory dance routines than mastering the fundamentals of hitting a cut-off.

Worse, it was a lineup studded with hyper-sensitive players of easy distractability, players whose Twitter accounts were their own worst enemies.

One of the best meditations on what creates great teams was produced 30 years ago by former NHL goaltender Ken Dryden. In his book The Game, Dryden said that “while a team needs all kinds of players with all kinds of skills to win, it needs prototypes, strong dependable prototypes, as examples of what you want your team to be.”

“The attitude of a team depends so much on its best player,” Dryden wrote. “He must have the character and personality to match his skills.”
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Re: The psychological failings of the Jays 

Post#2 » by C Court » Sat Aug 10, 2013 5:04 am

Very good (and in my opinion) an accurate assessment of the reasons behind the disappointing Jays season. Very early in the season, Richard Griffin was on with Jeff Blair and he shared those same concerns, while most others insisted the Jays had plenty of time to right the ship.

Chemistry, defense and pieces that play well together cannot be measured by stats. But it's something that savvy baseball execs understand. Which is why guys like Pat Gillick build winners in a few years, wherever they go.
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Re: The psychological failings of the Jays 

Post#3 » by Randle McMurphy » Sat Aug 10, 2013 5:19 am

That certainly does sound like a lot of overly clichéd bull **** that reasonable people should know better than to buy into. I guess that's what happens when an old political reporter tries to write about baseball.

I do wish it was this easy, though. If the solution was as simple as fixing the team's "psyche," we wouldn't have to face the fact that the team simply wasn't good enough and that its fatal flaw was actually its awful starting pitching.
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Re: The psychological failings of the Jays 

Post#4 » by Avenger » Sat Aug 10, 2013 5:55 am

wow, that was awful, it doesn't even deserve a serious response. I can't find a single section or even sentence in that article that actually deals in substance, just unbelievable.
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Re: The psychological failings of the Jays 

Post#5 » by brwnman » Sat Aug 10, 2013 7:31 am

Avenger wrote:wow, that was awful, it doesn't even deserve a serious response. I can't find a single section or even sentence in that article that actually deals in substance, just unbelievable.


I would agree to the part where it says that this team lacks fundamentals. Early on in the season, any groundball in the infield was an adventure (it hasn't really gone away). I'm a firm believer that anyone in the lineup from 1-9 should know how to bunt. It doesn't necessarily mean that they should be bunting, but that they should at least have the fundamentals of bunting down. Of course I'm not suggesting Bautista and Edwin being out there to bunt, that would be silly.

Also, doing the little things is another thing we lack as a team. Moving the runner from 2nd to 3rd with 0 outs. Being in cutoff position. Getting the sure out. I think the tough thing is that everyone needs/wants to point fingers at someone, but it's really not that easy. In the end, I still put it on the players. They are not up to the task (ie. they're not good enough). Also, with mentioning the little things, I feel like I should mention that the range up the middle defensively is SO bad. Izturis and Reyes combined; I have no idea on range factor for them, but when I see some of those slow rollers make it through, I feel like I could have made those play. I just pray that for Reyes' sake, it's the ankle still bothering him. Otherwise that's gonna be a killer defensively (you lose close games like that).
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Re: The psychological failings of the Jays 

Post#6 » by C Court » Sat Aug 10, 2013 2:28 pm

Dismiss team chemistry, mental toughness and other intangibles if you wish. That said, you'll end up with year after year of teams that look good on paper, but can't win on the field.
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Re: The psychological failings of the Jays 

Post#7 » by jalenrose#5 » Sat Aug 10, 2013 2:44 pm

I've always said this...power can win you games, but pitching and defence wins you championships.

The Jays starters have been outright right awful outside of Mark Buehrle (who hasn't been great either), and the defence has looked almost slo-pitch-like out there.

The A's are a classic example of how you win ball games. They have half the payroll the Jays have, yet they continue to use great pitching, timely hitting, and solid defence to win games with a minimal payroll.

What the Jays need to do is focus less on hitting and far more on starting pitching. It's time to get four-pitch pitchers who go 190+ innings a year. Buehrle was a good start, but they need to stock the cupboard some more before this team can be declared a winner.
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Re: The psychological failings of the Jays 

Post#8 » by Fairview4Life » Sat Aug 10, 2013 11:55 pm

jalenrose#5 wrote:I've always said this...power can win you games, but pitching and defence wins you championships.

The Jays starters have been outright right awful outside of Mark Buehrle (who hasn't been great either), and the defence has looked almost slo-pitch-like out there.

The A's are a classic example of how you win ball games. They have half the payroll the Jays have, yet they continue to use great pitching, timely hitting, and solid defence to win games with a minimal payroll.

What the Jays need to do is focus less on hitting and far more on starting pitching. It's time to get four-pitch pitchers who go 190+ innings a year. Buehrle was a good start, but they need to stock the cupboard some more before this team can be declared a winner.


The Jays revamped their bullpen and traded for 3 starters, not just Buehrle, this season. Buerhle was basically considered one of the teams worst starters at the beginning of the year. They brought in last years NL Cy Young winner. They DID focus on pitching, but the starters have **** the bed.
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Re: The psychological failings of the Jays 

Post#9 » by Michael Bradley » Sun Aug 11, 2013 1:52 am

The Yankees won the World Series in 2009 after signing the three biggest free agents on the market (CC, Tex, AJ) and trading for an expensive Nick Swisher. Teams win by adding impact talent.

The Jays added impact talent, unfortunately one of them was the biggest bust in 2013 (Johnson), another missed two months (Reyes), and another has declined (Dickey). You can say the Dickey decline was inevitable, but no one could have predicted Johnson **** the bed as badly as he has. Then you factor Happ getting hit in the head with a line drive, and Morrow having a mysterious season ending injury, and there was no way the Jays were going to overcome that.

They will be better equipped to handle injuries next season, assuming Hutchison, Drabek, Nolin, and Stroman are in the minors to start the year (figuring the big league rotation is Dickey, Morrow, Buehrle, Happ, and maybe a free agent or trade acquisition), but ultimately, the talent has to play to potential.
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Re: The psychological failings of the Jays 

Post#10 » by Raps_Swingman » Mon Aug 12, 2013 4:00 pm

Randle McMurphy wrote:That certainly does sound like a lot of overly clichéd bull **** that reasonable people should know better than to buy into. I guess that's what happens when an old political reporter tries to write about baseball.

I do wish it was this easy, though. If the solution was as simple as fixing the team's "psyche," we wouldn't have to face the fact that the team simply wasn't good enough and that its fatal flaw was actually its awful starting pitching.


I know we've battled back and forth on this issue. But even I find this article to be a sham and agree its a lot of bs. If anything I'd say the psyche issue was pressure of expectations more then anything and some leadership flaws.
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