Is Stroman really an "ace"?

[c3luong]

I wouldn't describe him as an ace yet. He's certainly our best pitcher, and maybe he proves to be an ace this season...

What makes an ace is a harder question. As a subjective term, I think while maybe wins is an outdated stat, there is certainly an element to an ace "that means he gets results you stupid chief!" ( And 1s for catching that reference).

An ace is someone you expect to take care of his role every time out. I think quality starts = 6 ip+ / less than 3 runs.

Its not just the predictive stats, its results - including consistency.

A true ace gives you more than 6 + less than 3 runs. He's the guy that can give your bullpen rest when needed, stop a losing streak, get a few complete games, a couple shutouts...

Stroman is not really an ace (there are only 5-10 in baseball). He is a solid #2 if he can pitch 180 innings. Sanchez has the potential to become an ace, but that may never happen. Good news - this team doesn't need an ace because their offence and defence are soooo good.

I have no idea how anyone can make this kind of conclusion at this point. Dude has played ~one season in the MLB. He could be a HOF pitcher, or he could be out of the league five years from now.

[The_Hater]

I have no idea how anyone can make this kind of conclusion at this point. Dude has played ~one season in the MLB. He could be a HOF pitcher, or he could be out of the league five years from now.

Using this criteria one could make the same wide conclusion on just about any MLB player or prospect under the age of 30. You've dumbed down the challenge of projecting players into one category, a pointless crapshoot.

[c3luong]

I have no idea how anyone can make this kind of conclusion at this point. Dude has played ~one season in the MLB. He could be a HOF pitcher, or he could be out of the league five years from now.

Using this criteria one could make the same wide conclusion on just about any MLB player or prospect under the age of 30. You've dumbed down the challenge of projecting players into one category, a pointless crapshoot.

Yeah, I 100% think that it's dumb to say that any player that's doing reasonably well with < 3 years of experience in the MLB is absolutely not going to be an ace.

Yeah, you can say they don't project to being an ace. But that's not that same thing at all.

[The_Hater]

I have no idea how anyone can make this kind of conclusion at this point. Dude has played ~one season in the MLB. He could be a HOF pitcher, or he could be out of the league five years from now.

Using this criteria one could make the same wide conclusion on just about any MLB player or prospect under the age of 30. You've dumbed down the challenge of projecting players into one category, a pointless crapshoot.

Yeah, I 100% think that it's dumb to say that any player that's doing reasonably well with < 3 years of experience in the MLB is absolutely not going to be an ace.

The person your quoted did not make any such claim.

But you still came back with the worst rebuttal of them all, the 'it's all a crapshoot' argument.

[c3luong]

Using this criteria one could make the same wide conclusion on just about any MLB player or prospect under the age of 30. You've dumbed down the challenge of projecting players into one category, a pointless crapshoot.

Yeah, I 100% think that it's dumb to say that any player that's doing reasonably well with < 3 years of experience in the MLB is absolutely not going to be an ace.

The person your quoted did not make any such claim.

But you still came back with the worst rebuttal of them all, the 'it's all a crapshoot' argument.

And I didn't mention anything about a crapshoot. Nice try though.

[The_Hater]

Yeah, I 100% think that it's dumb to say that any player that's doing reasonably well with < 3 years of experience in the MLB is absolutely not going to be an ace.

The person your quoted did not make any such claim.

But you still came back with the worst rebuttal of them all, the 'it's all a crapshoot' argument.

And I didn't mention anything about a crapshoot. Nice try though.

If you say so. Too funny.

[torontoaces04]

This team has a potential Ace...his name is Aaron Sanchez.

http://www.bluebirdbanter.com/2016/3/16/11225548/aaron-sanchez-should-be-a-starter

[Rapsfan151]

This team has a potential Ace...his name is Aaron Sanchez.

http://www.bluebirdbanter.com/2016/3/16/11225548/aaron-sanchez-should-be-a-starter

I hate these potential Ace tags thrown around on Sanchez. Nothing we have seen from him suggests he can ever be an ace. He throws hard, thats it. Perhaps he can turn into a mid rotation starter which I think would be fantastic but he is going to have to really cut down on the walks for that to happen. I don't think he will ever strike out enough guys to become a top of the rotation pitcher.

[Rapsfan151]

I wouldn't describe him as an ace yet. He's certainly our best pitcher, and maybe he proves to be an ace this season...

What makes an ace is a harder question. As a subjective term, I think while maybe wins is an outdated stat, there is certainly an element to an ace "that means he gets results you stupid chief!" ( And 1s for catching that reference).

An ace is someone you expect to take care of his role every time out. I think quality starts = 6 ip+ / less than 3 runs.

Its not just the predictive stats, its results - including consistency.

A true ace gives you more than 6 + less than 3 runs. He's the guy that can give your bullpen rest when needed, stop a losing streak, get a few complete games, a couple shutouts...

Stroman is not really an ace (there are only 5-10 in baseball). He is a solid #2 if he can pitch 180 innings. Sanchez has the potential to become an ace, but that may never happen. Good news - this team doesn't need an ace because their offence and defence are soooo good.

I have no idea how anyone can make this kind of conclusion at this point. Dude has played ~one season in the MLB. He could be a HOF pitcher, or he could be out of the league five years from now.

This is dumb. Thats like saying Carlos Correa has a good chance of being out of MLB in 5 years which would be a really stupid thing to say.

[torontoaces04]

This team has a potential Ace...his name is Aaron Sanchez.

http://www.bluebirdbanter.com/2016/3/16/11225548/aaron-sanchez-should-be-a-starter

I hate these potential Ace tags thrown around on Sanchez. Nothing we have seen from him suggests he can ever be an ace. He throws hard, thats it. Perhaps he can turn into a mid rotation starter which I think would be fantastic but he is going to have to really cut down on the walks for that to happen. I don't think he will ever strike out enough guys to become a top of the rotation pitcher.

It doesn't really matter how you feel about labeling of prospects/young players, it's a fact of life that they're going to happen. My suggestion to you is learn to deal with it, or risk popping the vein in your eye. They aren't going away any time soon.

[Rapsfan151]

This team has a potential Ace...his name is Aaron Sanchez.

http://www.bluebirdbanter.com/2016/3/16/11225548/aaron-sanchez-should-be-a-starter

I hate these potential Ace tags thrown around on Sanchez. Nothing we have seen from him suggests he can ever be an ace. He throws hard, thats it. Perhaps he can turn into a mid rotation starter which I think would be fantastic but he is going to have to really cut down on the walks for that to happen. I don't think he will ever strike out enough guys to become a top of the rotation pitcher.

It doesn't really matter how you feel about labeling of prospects/young players, it's a fact of life that they're going to happen. My suggestion to you is learn to deal with it, or risk popping the vein in your eye. They aren't going away any time soon.

I'm fine with throwing the term potential ace around on players just not Sanchez. Stroman looks like he has a good chance of becoming an ace because of the talent and the results we have seen. Sanchez has demonstrated he throws hard, thats it.

[sule]

An Ace should be able to string together multiple excellent seasons with no loss of confidence from season-to-season. Should be able to go the distance whenever he's having a terrific game (which should be every 10 games or so), should have the teams confidence that he can break up a losing streak with his pitching alone, and should be able to dominate other teams such that he's never really figured out. At least IMO.

And for Stroman, he might have all those other qualities i've described, but you'd have to wait a few seasons before you can even call him an Ace. He could be a Halladay, but could just as easily be a Juan Guzman, or Ricky Romero, or Gustavo Chacin.

The key is that we have to wait a few seasons to really see what we have here.

He did look good last year, and the numbers were good, but the whole team was clicking on a historic basis. This year will be a much better indicator of his long-term projection than last year. Thus, i'll be waiting before I throw my full confidence behind him as the next great Blue Jay pitcher.

[The Duke]

My Ace definition = Top 5 Player
Stroman = not a top 5 Player
Stroman = not an ace

I will give Stroman Top 10 AL.

[Rapsfan151]

An Ace should be able to string together multiple excellent seasons with no loss of confidence from season-to-season. Should be able to go the distance whenever he's having a terrific game (which should be every 10 games or so), should have the teams confidence that he can break up a losing streak with his pitching alone, and should be able to dominate other teams such that he's never really figured out. At least IMO.

And for Stroman, he might have all those other qualities i've described, but you'd have to wait a few seasons before you can even call him an Ace. He could be a Halladay, but could just as easily be a Juan Guzman, or Ricky Romero, or Gustavo Chacin.

The key is that we have to wait a few seasons to really see what we have here.

He did look good last year, and the numbers were good, but the whole team was clicking on a historic basis. This year will be a much better indicator of his long-term projection than last year. Thus, i'll be waiting before I throw my full confidence behind him as the next great Blue Jay pitcher.

I think people forget how good Stroman was in 2014. He had the 13th best FIP in MLB among SP. I would agree that he isn't an ace yet though. He could be poised for a Dallas Keuchel like breakout though.