American League Division Series | Game 3: Texas (Lewis) @ Toronto (Sanchez) | Sunday October 9 | 7:30PM

[Parataxis]

I think you need to set it up to have Estrada going to game 7.

I'd rather have him more likely to pitch two games than pitch game 7. I'd rather not get to a game 7 at all, and Estrada pitching games 1 and 5 makes that more likely.

[BramptonYute]

I think you need to set it up to have Estrada going to game 7.

I'd rather have him more likely to pitch two games than pitch game 7. I'd rather not get to a game 7 at all, and Estrada pitching games 1 and 5 makes that more likely.

Thats true too.

Will be interesting to see how that Jays set the rotation up.

[Rapcity_11]

Did you guys learn nothing from Showalter? You don't plan around a situation that may never come up.

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yeah I don't see Stro going all the way to game 4.

Gibby loves him, I see him going game 2

Really depends. Right now I think he knows he has to get Marco out there twice and possibly Happ as well, I'd keep Estrada for Game 1 because you're trying to get them in a funk quickly, maybe do Estrada/Stroman/Happ/Sanchez/Estrada/Stroman/Happ. Or move Happ to Game 6 and pitch Sanchez in a Game 7 if you feel like you can. Rest isn't really an issue with several off-days so you can just keep the rotation the same as it was in the ALDS.

Setting up your well rested ace to pitch once over 7 games seems kind of foolish to me. Just can't see that happening.

And Gibby might love Stro but I'm sure he loves his 3 most relaible pitchers this season even more.

Letting Stroman sit for 15 days is even more foolish. Kid has to play, he's been solid down the stretch and is especially good vs Cleveland.

I see him going either game 1 or 2

[The_Hater]

And Gibby might love Stro but I'm sure he loves his 3 most relaible pitchers this season even more.

Are you going to be like this all playoffs about Stroman pitching? Stoman is fine as a starter. In 14 innings against Cleveland this year he's given up 2 runs. The Jays lost both of those games because they didn't score more than 1 run in each game, and despite your sarcastic comments about the Jays winning when they allow 0 runs, that's not a realistic option that can be planned for. Stroman has actually been very good since August.

he guy I'm probably most nervous about at this point is Sanchez. I like him fine, he certainly doesn't make me David Price nervous, but that who innings discussion that happened back when nobody wanted to see him move to the pen does bear considering now. He's still been good, but he's been worse overall since August than he was to start the season, and I think Stroman has been a touch better since August. And to be honest, Stroman has also been better than Estrada since August. The only real attachment to Estrada is that he seems to be borderline unhittable in the playoffs. If you want to go with who's been the best, Happ is probably the guy to get the call, but as it is, things have been relatively close over the past couple months, that I don't really have an issue with Stroman getting the call - particularly if it means Sanchez goes 4th.

I mean, I get that you're using the entire season totals, but the reality is that Stroman was decidedly bad from April through June (and abjectly awful in June) and they drop his season totals accordingly. If you want to let those numbers from early on in the season guide you, which you clearly do, by all means, continue doing so. But don't act as if this is a no-brainer against Stroman, because it really isn't - particularly not if you're willing to weight how these guys have pitched in the 2nd half of the season more than how they pitched in the 1st half. Personally, I like the order from the WC and 1st round continuing, which is Stroman, Estrada, Happ and then Sanchez. And no need to try and push for a guy to pitch 3 times in the series. These guys are all good pitchers and the difference between them isn't so huge as to gain some sort of benefit larger than giving these guys a bit more rest (particularly when the health of the BP is a bit up in the air).

Am i going to be 'like this'? And then you go into a rant?

I didn't realize that calling Stro our 4th best starter was some sort of insult that required defending. We had 2 others in the allstar game and a 3rd is on the short list for the Cy young. None of this makes Stroman a bad pitcher but IMO we have 3 better starters and i'm willing to bet that this is the majority opinion of most fans.

[Hoopstarr]

And Gibby might love Stro but I'm sure he loves his 3 most relaible pitchers this season even more.

Are you going to be like this all playoffs about Stroman pitching? Stoman is fine as a starter. In 14 innings against Cleveland this year he's given up 2 runs. The Jays lost both of those games because they didn't score more than 1 run in each game, and despite your sarcastic comments about the Jays winning when they allow 0 runs, that's not a realistic option that can be planned for. Stroman has actually been very good since August.

he guy I'm probably most nervous about at this point is Sanchez. I like him fine, he certainly doesn't make me David Price nervous, but that who innings discussion that happened back when nobody wanted to see him move to the pen does bear considering now. He's still been good, but he's been worse overall since August than he was to start the season, and I think Stroman has been a touch better since August. And to be honest, Stroman has also been better than Estrada since August. The only real attachment to Estrada is that he seems to be borderline unhittable in the playoffs. If you want to go with who's been the best, Happ is probably the guy to get the call, but as it is, things have been relatively close over the past couple months, that I don't really have an issue with Stroman getting the call - particularly if it means Sanchez goes 4th.

I mean, I get that you're using the entire season totals, but the reality is that Stroman was decidedly bad from April through June (and abjectly awful in June) and they drop his season totals accordingly. If you want to let those numbers from early on in the season guide you, which you clearly do, by all means, continue doing so. But don't act as if this is a no-brainer against Stroman, because it really isn't - particularly not if you're willing to weight how these guys have pitched in the 2nd half of the season more than how they pitched in the 1st half. Personally, I like the order from the WC and 1st round continuing, which is Stroman, Estrada, Happ and then Sanchez. And no need to try and push for a guy to pitch 3 times in the series. These guys are all good pitchers and the difference between them isn't so huge as to gain some sort of benefit larger than giving these guys a bit more rest (particularly when the health of the BP is a bit up in the air).

Am i going to be 'like this'? And then you go into a rant?

I didn't realize that calling Stro our 4th best starter was some sort of insult that required defending. We had 2 others in the allstar game and a 3rd is on the short list for the Cy young. None of this makes Stroman a bad pitcher but IMO we have 3 better starters and i'm willing to bet that this is the majority opinion of most fans.

In general, yes, but you don't think matchups matter at all? Stroman has two great starts against this group of hitters this year, one home and one away. He made a fly ball hitting team hit a lot of ground balls. That stuff warrants consideration.

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[vaff87]

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If it goes to Game 7, I wonder if he'll be available out of the pen?

[Parataxis]

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If it goes to Game 7, I wonder if he'll be available out of the pen?

If it goes to Game 7, and goes long enough, everybody is available.

[TR50]

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If it goes to Game 7, I wonder if he'll be available out of the pen?

I would think so. If the game is on the line and you need someone to come in and give a couple shutdown innings, I think we could definitely see Sanchez in that role.

Hate to toot my own horn, but this is exactly what I thought they would do. I see Stroman starting game 2 and Happ getting game 3 at home (where he has actually been better). Now...just cause I said this...it probably will be reversed

[I_Like_Dirt]

Am i going to be 'like this'? And then you go into a rant?

Rant? I made one comment, and then went into my post discussing the topic. As for "like this," basically every time I see Stroman get brought up you're right there posting cautionary tales about how he shouldn't pitch and should be moved back to make way for the other guys. I got your point the first time. The 2nd, 3rd, 4th and 5th make me raise an eyebrow, particularly when you're so quick to jump on the topic.

Now moving on towards the rest of my post, feel free to characterize this as a rant rather than discussion if it makes you feel better.

As for Stroman being the 4th best pitcher, again, I'd say it's highly debatable. Sometimes you can clearly see which pitchers are better than others, but that's not nearly so easy in this case. If you're talking about who has, on average, built up the better numbers over the course of the entire season, sure. But that's not the same thing as being the 4th best pitcher at any given point. For the past 2+ months, Stroman has been the Jays' 2nd best pitcher, and it's very close with Happ. During that same stretch, Estrada has been the Jays' 4th best pitcher.

But more to the point, we aren't looking for some arbitrary way of ranking the pitchers at this stage, we're looking for ways that best help the Blue Jays win 4 of the next 7 games. With that in mind:

(1) It's best not to let one of the pitchers rest 2 weeks between starts.

(2) Using the first 2-3 months of the season as the determining factor in who is the best pitcher to help the Jays win games in October is pretty short-sighted, and that's exactly what you're doing here by using the entire year's numbers, because Estrada's numbers were so bad at the start that they skew the numbers across the board. Take those out of the equation and, as mentioned already, Stroman looks quite a bit better by comparison.

(3) Trying to rush into Estrada, who has never been great at handling 200+ innings and carrying that kind of workload, or rushing into Sanchez, who looked shaky against Texas, has concerns about how many innings he's pitching, when both guys have been arguably worse than Stroman for the past 2-3 months also seems like an odd choice.

[The_Hater]

Am i going to be 'like this'? And then you go into a rant?

Rant? I made one comment, and then went into my post discussing the topic. As for "like this," basically every time I see Stroman get brought up you're right there posting cautionary tales about how he shouldn't pitch and should be moved back to make way for the other guys. I got your point the first time. The 2nd, 3rd, 4th and 5th make me raise an eyebrow, particularly when you're so quick to jump on the topic.

Now moving on towards the rest of my post, feel free to characterize this as a rant rather than discussion if it makes you feel better.

As for Stroman being the 4th best pitcher, again, I'd say it's highly debatable. Sometimes you can clearly see which pitchers are better than others, but that's not nearly so easy in this case. If you're talking about who has, on average, built up the better numbers over the course of the entire season, sure. But that's not the same thing as being the 4th best pitcher at any given point. For the past 2+ months, Stroman has been the Jays' 2nd best pitcher, and it's very close with Happ. During that same stretch, Estrada has been the Jays' 4th best pitcher.

But more to the point, we aren't looking for some arbitrary way of ranking the pitchers at this stage, we're looking for ways that best help the Blue Jays win 4 of the next 7 games. With that in mind:

(1) It's best not to let one of the pitchers rest 2 weeks between starts.

(2) Using the first 2-3 months of the season as the determining factor in who is the best pitcher to help the Jays win games in October is pretty short-sighted, and that's exactly what you're doing here by using the entire year's numbers, because Estrada's numbers were so bad at the start that they skew the numbers across the board. Take those out of the equation and, as mentioned already, Stroman looks quite a bit better by comparison.

(3) Trying to rush into Estrada, who has never been great at handling 200+ innings and carrying that kind of workload, or rushing into Sanchez, who looked shaky against Texas, has concerns about how many innings he's pitching, when both guys have been arguably worse than Stroman for the past 2-3 months also seems like an odd choice.

I like Stroman but I still think he's our 4th best pitcher. Our starting staff if deep so our 4th best pitcher is still very good. Don't get your panties in a bunch about it next time.

[Sifu]

What a great problem this have. This staff is very good and any of these guys you can argue for as game one starter. Rather have this problem than debating a Dickey start

[Hero Ball]

It's kinda funny re-reading things a few months later. Lots of Rangers fans crying foul when their team was called a fluke back in June.

[The_Hater]

I think you need to set it up to have Estrada going to game 7.

If you lose the series in 6 games, how good does this strategy look?

[BramptonYute]

I think you need to set it up to have Estrada going to game 7.

If you lose the series in 6 games, how good does this strategy look?

Yeah, I wasnt fully thinking everything out.

I was pulling a Buck Showalter lol