Vladdy Triple Crown Watch

[Randle McMurphy]

i do think ohtani's the MVP, clearly, over vlad. but this isn't an outlier season for ohtani either. this is who he is and who he was pegged to be, so unless he can't stay healthy or either his hitting or pitching falls off suddenly, i just hope everyone in baseball is prepared for a 5-6 year run with him taking that award home every year. what he does is kind of novel, but it would only be fair to vlad (and let's say mike trout were he healthy) if ohtani won every year from here on out if he performs as expected and people don't say "ah well he's won the last 3, time to give it to someone else".

LeBron James only won 4 MVPs in his 18 year career, mostly because people just got bored and wanted to give it to someone else (although there was probably some of it being the not letting him pass MJ thing). Give it a year or two and people will get tired of Shohei too. Vlad will win his fair share.

[JTT]

i do think ohtani's the MVP, clearly, over vlad. but this isn't an outlier season for ohtani either. this is who he is and who he was pegged to be, so unless he can't stay healthy or either his hitting or pitching falls off suddenly, i just hope everyone in baseball is prepared for a 5-6 year run with him taking that award home every year. what he does is kind of novel, but it would only be fair to vlad (and let's say mike trout were he healthy) if ohtani won every year from here on out if he performs as expected and people don't say "ah well he's won the last 3, time to give it to someone else".

LeBron James only won 4 MVPs in his 18 year career, mostly because people just got bored and wanted to give it to someone else (although there was probably some of it being the not letting him pass MJ thing). Give it a year or two and people will get tired of Shohei too. Vlad will win his fair share.

This. It’s a strange phenomenon when voters actively look for ways to vote for others rather than the obvious choice

[Vampirate]

Yeah it's crazy to suggest Vlad has a chance at this point. Ohtani is barely worse as a hitter and is also a top 20 starting pitcher. Triple crown mattered in the 90's but I think we're past that now. Nobody in an MLB front office rates players based on their RBI or AVG.

Ohtani is clearly a worse [b]hitter than Vlad, it's not close this year.[/b]

There are also pitchers that are clearly better than him.

There is however, no pitcher that has anywhere close than has his value of a bat, and also none of the top tier hitters can pitch.

Ohtani is second in the league in wRC+ and is a top 20 base runner. Let's not get carried away with the difference in their offense. While it's technically correct that no pitcher has anywhere close to his batting value, that's an absurd way to frame it since 99% of the hitters aren't close to his batting value either.

You said hitter though.

Vlad has 50 more hits (yes batting average is overrated unless you mix it with power and patience which is the difference between Miguel Cabrera and Adam Dunn), gets on base 5 percent more (those 50 extra hits), walks about the same, strikes out significantly less and has the higher SLG and OPS.

This year Ohtani's bat reminds me somewhere in the lines of a prime Bautista and this years Vlad is like Miguel Cabrera with more HR power with less double hitting ability.

Anyways, while Ohtani isn't generational in any one thing, it's the fact that he's prototypically elite in both hitting and pitching which sets him apart.

If he can keep it up for 5 years of being an Ace while having an OPS over .900 and not have too much of a fall off after, he might have a shot at the HOF.

[Skin Blues]

Ohtani is clearly a worse [b]hitter than Vlad, it's not close this year.[/b]

There are also pitchers that are clearly better than him.

There is however, no pitcher that has anywhere close than has his value of a bat, and also none of the top tier hitters can pitch.

Ohtani is second in the league in wRC+ and is a top 20 base runner. Let's not get carried away with the difference in their offense. While it's technically correct that no pitcher has anywhere close to his batting value, that's an absurd way to frame it since 99% of the hitters aren't close to his batting value either.

You said hitter though.

Vlad has 50 more hits (yes batting average is overrated unless you mix it with power and patience which is the difference between Miguel Cabrera and Adam Dunn), gets on base 5 percent more (those 50 extra hits), walks about the same, strikes out significantly less and has the higher SLG and OPS.

This year Ohtani's bat reminds me somewhere in the lines of a prime Bautista and this years Vlad is like Miguel Cabrera with more HR power with less double hitting ability.

Anyways, while Ohtani isn't generational in any one thing, it's the fact that he's prototypically elite in both hitting and pitching which sets him apart.

If he can keep it up for 5 years of being an Ace while having an OPS over .900 and not have too much of a fall off after, he might have a shot at the HOF.

That's a long way to say Ohtani is the second best hitter in the league. Vlad isn't a generational hitter this year, either. And he's a negative on defense. As amazing as he's been, his season doesn't crack the top 50 in WAR over the past decade.

[Parataxis]

My gosh. Over the last 30 games, Vladdy has 10 HR, but only 16 RBIs (and 6 HR/7 RBIs in the last 15 games). That's just such an absurdly low ratio.

[GordanFreeman]

My gosh. Over the last 30 games, Vladdy has 10 HR, but only 16 RBIs (and 6 HR/7 RBIs in the last 15 games). That's just such an absurdly low ratio.

My knowledge of baseball is pretty rudimentary but shouldn't he he hitting cleanup? I read that he was hitting in the 2nd spot for a little bit too. What's the reason he isn't locked in as the 4th hitter every game?

[Vampirate]

Ohtani is second in the league in wRC+ and is a top 20 base runner. Let's not get carried away with the difference in their offense. While it's technically correct that no pitcher has anywhere close to his batting value, that's an absurd way to frame it since 99% of the hitters aren't close to his batting value either.

You said hitter though.

Vlad has 50 more hits (yes batting average is overrated unless you mix it with power and patience which is the difference between Miguel Cabrera and Adam Dunn), gets on base 5 percent more (those 50 extra hits), walks about the same, strikes out significantly less and has the higher SLG and OPS.

This year Ohtani's bat reminds me somewhere in the lines of a prime Bautista and this years Vlad is like Miguel Cabrera with more HR power with less double hitting ability.

Anyways, while Ohtani isn't generational in any one thing, it's the fact that he's prototypically elite in both hitting and pitching which sets him apart.

If he can keep it up for 5 years of being an Ace while having an OPS over .900 and not have too much of a fall off after, he might have a shot at the HOF.

That's a long way to say Ohtani is the second best hitter in the league. Vlad isn't a generational hitter this year, either. And he's a negative on defense. As amazing as he's been, his season doesn't crack the top 50 in WAR over the past decade.

Being generational means you are in the mix for being thought of as being the best at what you do over a long period of time like Kershaw is.

For hitting specifically moving forwards, aside from Vlad i'd rather have Soto, Harper, Trout (if healthy), Tatis (if healthy), possibly Aaron Judge (longer track record)

I don't think Ohtanti is going to be thought of as the best pitcher or hitter in any one season.

His generational value will be to be a top 5-10 pitcher/hitter consistently over the long period of time if he can do it.

[Vampirate]

My gosh. Over the last 30 games, Vladdy has 10 HR, but only 16 RBIs (and 6 HR/7 RBIs in the last 15 games). That's just such an absurdly low ratio.

Vlad has more runs than RBI this year.