Game 159 - New York Yankees @ Toronto Blue Jays, September 30, 7:07pm

[Death Knight]

We already went through this when I said we all acknowledge that the AL East is more difficult than the 2 other American League divisions, and that it's the reality of the situation, and it's not going to change unless there are expansions or relocations.

If you're going to discredit every single time a non AL East team makes the postseason, you're in for eternity. Every season there are going to be 2 other division winners besides the AL East whether you like it or not, and 2 wild card teams that can go to anyone else remaining. You're discrediting the Astros, and White Sox this season along with the Mariners if they were to make it in. Have fun complaining about other teams from other divisions having easier schedule every single year for life and that they don't deserve anything ever.

No, I'm just discrediting the Mariners. The Astros are actually good. The White Sox are good enough. The Mariners are not good. They are very lucky.

You don't get to pick and choose which team the easier schedule applies to, and which don't. The Astros are good, no questions, but based on your criteria you have to take them a peg down because of their easier schedule compared to the teams from the AL East.

[The_Hater]

It's hard to be lucky in an entire 162 games as opposed to other sports that play much fewer games.

You guys worry too much about how the Mariners are doing it.

Another bad take on your part.

Baseball as more luck involved in the outcome of games then just about any other sport.

The Mariners have been outscored by 48 runs. The Jays have outscored their opponents by 166 runs. 224 run difference which is more than a run per game and they have the same record. 224 runs! The Jays have a expected win total of 96 right now and the Mariners only 75 wins. That’s the difference between a very good team and a bad team. Replay the 2021 season 100 times is its probable that the Mariners don’t win as many 89 games in any of those outcomes. They have been one of the luckiest teams in many, many years. And the Jays probably win >89 games in 90-95% of those outcomes. Extreme luck involved here.

[Fairview4Life]

It's hard to be lucky in an entire 162 games as opposed to other sports that play much fewer games.

You guys worry too much about how the Mariners are doing it.

The only reason the Mariners are still being discussed is because you are saying they are a better team because they were in a playoff spot. They were in a playoff spot because they played a lot more games against a lot worse teams than the blue Jays.

[Death Knight]

It's hard to be lucky in an entire 162 games as opposed to other sports that play much fewer games.

You guys worry too much about how the Mariners are doing it.

The only reason the Mariners are still being discussed is because you are saying they are a better team because they were in a playoff spot. They were in a playoff spot because they played a lot more games against a lot worse teams than the blue Jays.

Way to put words in my mouth. Quote me where I said the Mariners are a better team than the Jays. All I said was that the Mariners were making a stronger push to the postseason down this stretch of games and would be well deserved if they pulled it off. This as opposed to the Red Sox and Jays who were floundering and hoping to limp their way in. Had the Red Sox and Jays been playing better and kept pace, the Mariners would never have caught up to them.

[The_Hater]

It's hard to be lucky in an entire 162 games as opposed to other sports that play much fewer games.

You guys worry too much about how the Mariners are doing it.

The only reason the Mariners are still being discussed is because you are saying they are a better team because they were in a playoff spot. They were in a playoff spot because they played a lot more games against a lot worse teams than the blue Jays.

Way to put words in my mouth. Quote me where I said the Mariners are a better team than the Jays. All I said was that the Mariners were making a stronger push to the postseason down this stretch of games and would be well deserved if they pulled it off. This as opposed to the Red Sox and Jays who were floundering and hoping to limp their way in. Had the Red Sox and Jays been playing better and kept pace, the Mariners would never have caught up to them.

The Jays are 21-9 since September 1st, and you call that floundering? Seattle is 18-9 over the same period btw.

Time to give it up bud. You’re making too many bad takes to count at this point.

[Death Knight]

It's hard to be lucky in an entire 162 games as opposed to other sports that play much fewer games.

You guys worry too much about how the Mariners are doing it.

Another bad take on your part.

Baseball as more luck involved in the outcome of games then just about any other sport.

The Mariners have been outscored by 48 runs. The Jays have outscored their opponents by 166 runs. 224 run difference which is more than a run per game and they have the same record. 224 runs! The Jays have a expected win total of 96 right now and the !a timers only 75 wins. That’s the difference between a very good team and a bad team. Replay the 2021 season 100 times is its probable that the Mariners don’t win as many 89 games in any of those outcomes. They have been one of the luckiest teams in many, many years. And the Jays probably win >89 games in 90-95% of those outcomes. Extreme luck involved here.

Give me the larger sample of size, 162 games.

Just like I said, some of you are unwilling to accept reality. The reality is that the run differential and strength of schedule doesn't matter, because at the end of the day the standings are based on the first two colums, wins and loses. The other columns to the right don't matter.

[Death Knight]

The only reason the Mariners are still being discussed is because you are saying they are a better team because they were in a playoff spot. They were in a playoff spot because they played a lot more games against a lot worse teams than the blue Jays.

Way to put words in my mouth. Quote me where I said the Mariners are a better team than the Jays. All I said was that the Mariners were making a stronger push to the postseason down this stretch of games and would be well deserved if they pulled it off. This as opposed to the Red Sox and Jays who were floundering and hoping to limp their way in. Had the Red Sox and Jays been playing better and kept pace, the Mariners would never have caught up to them.

The Jays are 21-9 since September 1st, and you call that floundering? Seattle is 18-9 over the same period btw.

Time to give it up bud. You’re making too many bad takes to count at this point.

Just like Schad, you picked and chose where to start the stretch of games in order to support your argument. You give me 21-9, 18-9, and I give you 5-5, and 8-2 over the last 10 to support my argument.

[The_Hater]

It's hard to be lucky in an entire 162 games as opposed to other sports that play much fewer games.

You guys worry too much about how the Mariners are doing it.

Another bad take on your part.

Baseball as more luck involved in the outcome of games then just about any other sport.

The Mariners have been outscored by 48 runs. The Jays have outscored their opponents by 166 runs. 224 run difference which is more than a run per game and they have the same record. 224 runs! The Jays have a expected win total of 96 right now and the !a timers only 75 wins. That’s the difference between a very good team and a bad team. Replay the 2021 season 100 times is its probable that the Mariners don’t win as many 89 games in any of those outcomes. They have been one of the luckiest teams in many, many years. And the Jays probably win >89 games in 90-95% of those outcomes. Extreme luck involved here.

Give me the larger sample of size, 162 games.

Just like I said, some of you are unwilling to accept reality. The reality is that the run differential and strength of schedule doesn't matter, because at the end of the day the standings are based on the first two colums, wins and loses. The other columns to the right don't matter.

Lol, yes, we know, except that would actually be you.

You just keeping throwing one severely flawed argument out after another against the wall and they’re all very easy to counter and disprove. You suddenly showed up here with 2 games left in the season and pretend that you’re the expert on baseball and fail to realize that you’re out of your league here. You’ve provided a flawed opinion with absolutely no factual basis to back any of it up. That’s reality.

[The_Hater]

Way to put words in my mouth. Quote me where I said the Mariners are a better team than the Jays. All I said was that the Mariners were making a stronger push to the postseason down this stretch of games and would be well deserved if they pulled it off. This as opposed to the Red Sox and Jays who were floundering and hoping to limp their way in. Had the Red Sox and Jays been playing better and kept pace, the Mariners would never have caught up to them.

The Jays are 21-9 since September 1st, and you call that floundering? Seattle is 18-9 over the same period btw.

Time to give it up bud. You’re making too many bad takes to count at this point.

Just like Schad, you picked and chose where to start the stretch of games in order to support your argument. You give me 21-9, 18-9, and I give you 5-5, and 8-2 over the last 10 to support my argument.

Didn’t you just pick a stretch of games yourself that best fit your narrative? Hypocrite. Lol. Goodbye

[Death Knight]

Another bad take on your part.

Baseball as more luck involved in the outcome of games then just about any other sport.

The Mariners have been outscored by 48 runs. The Jays have outscored their opponents by 166 runs. 224 run difference which is more than a run per game and they have the same record. 224 runs! The Jays have a expected win total of 96 right now and the !a timers only 75 wins. That’s the difference between a very good team and a bad team. Replay the 2021 season 100 times is its probable that the Mariners don’t win as many 89 games in any of those outcomes. They have been one of the luckiest teams in many, many years. And the Jays probably win >89 games in 90-95% of those outcomes. Extreme luck involved here.

Give me the larger sample of size, 162 games.

Just like I said, some of you are unwilling to accept reality. The reality is that the run differential and strength of schedule doesn't matter, because at the end of the day the standings are based on the first two colums, wins and loses. The other columns to the right don't matter.

Lol, yes, we know, except that would actually be you.

You just keeping throwing one severely flawed argument out after another against the wall and they’re all very easy to counter and disprove. You suddenly showed up here with 2 games left in the season and pretend that you’re the expert on baseball and fail to realize that you’re out of your league here. You’ve provided a flawed opinion with absolutely no factual basis to back any of it up. That’s reality. Goodbye.

So it's not based on wins and loses? LOL.

[Death Knight]

You guys would be the ones to say a half court shot in basketball counts more than the minimum distance of a 3 points shot. Except, it counts the same, 3 points. Now............is the half court shot more impressive? Absolutely. Just like the Jays are the more impressive team from top to bottom than the Mariners. But the wins and loses still count the same.

[Asianiac_24]

You guys would be the ones to say a half court shot in basketball counts more than the minimum distance of a 3 points shot. Except, it counts the same, 3 points. Now............is the half court shot more impressive? Absolutely. Just like the Jays are the more impressive team from top to bottom than the Mariners. But the wins and loses still count the same.

That’s not remotely the same comparison. They are both worth 3. In every stat measureable they are the same.

A better comparison would be if a +7 SRS team somehow has the same record as a -0.1 SRS team. Very unlikely to happen in basketball as the variance is much smaller, but that’s more in line with what’s happening here

[I_Like_Dirt]

My frustration on how they got a CY Young year out of Robbie Ray for 8 Million, and an All Star season out of Semien for 18 million, along with the Run Differential this team had will be all for not. 29 other managers would not have had Lamb, Dyson, and McGuire starting with less than two weeks to go in Tampa, along with the other foolish moves this man has made.

Oh, no doubt. But it's hard to get mad at management for the fact that those two guys, who they signed, produced 10.5 fWAR for $26m. We were in a position to compete in an unbelievably difficult environment because, despite some flops in the bullpen and Springer's injuries, they still probably had the best offseason of any management team in baseball.

And people were thinking Matz was a bad move and the team should have paid Bauer instead of Semien as an SP instead. Springer's health is a major problem but the offseason worked out pretty amazingly other than that.

[Death Knight]

You guys would be the ones to say a half court shot in basketball counts more than the minimum distance of a 3 points shot. Except, it counts the same, 3 points. Now............is the half court shot more impressive? Absolutely. Just like the Jays are the more impressive team from top to bottom than the Mariners. But the wins and loses still count the same.

That’s not remotely the same comparison. They are both worth 3. In every stat measureable they are the same.

A better comparison would be if a +7 SRS team somehow has the same record as a -0.1 SRS team. Very unlikely to happen in basketball as the variance is much smaller, but that’s more in line with what’s happening here

You're not making a comparison at all. SRS is what has already been part of the discussion here with the run differential and strength of schedule.

[The_Hater]

You guys would be the ones to say a half court shot in basketball counts more than the minimum distance of a 3 points shot. Except, it counts the same, 3 points. Now............is the half court shot more impressive? Absolutely. Just like the Jays are the more impressive team from top to bottom than the Mariners. But the wins and loses still count the same.

That’s not remotely the same comparison. They are both worth 3. In every stat measureable they are the same.

A better comparison would be if a +7 SRS team somehow has the same record as a -0.1 SRS team. Very unlikely to happen in basketball as the variance is much smaller, but that’s more in line with what’s happening here

No point in bringing up SRS, this guy thinks that the massive run differential that has been presented to him is completely irrelevant to the discussion. Which is among the many reasons why nobody here takes him seriously.

[Death Knight]

You guys would be the ones to say a half court shot in basketball counts more than the minimum distance of a 3 points shot. Except, it counts the same, 3 points. Now............is the half court shot more impressive? Absolutely. Just like the Jays are the more impressive team from top to bottom than the Mariners. But the wins and loses still count the same.

That’s not remotely the same comparison. They are both worth 3. In every stat measureable they are the same.

A better comparison would be if a +7 SRS team somehow has the same record as a -0.1 SRS team. Very unlikely to happen in basketball as the variance is much smaller, but that’s more in line with what’s happening here

No point in bringing up SRS, this guy thinks that the massive run differential that has been presented to him is completely irrelevant to the discussion. Which is among the many reasons why nobody here takes him seriously.

What's relevant is wins and loses. You guys still can't wrap your heads around why the Mariners are in the position that they're in as none of your stats support it, and therefore you choose to disregard them.

[Schad]

As the Mariners finished with fewer wins than the Red Sox, Yankees and Jays, I suppose it's now safe to say that they were the least deserving team of a playoff spot, just as we had suggested?