Jays acquire Jose Berrios from Twins for Austin Martin, Simeon Woods-Richardson

[-MetA4-]

All granted. So, let's not assume either will become superstars. We're still going to need good pieces under years of cheap control to trot out beside our billion dollar roster. Guys who can contribute to us for cheap (or who could actually bloom into something special) become super-valuable in trades (the Whit Merrifield contract was brought up on TV yesterday) or could even allow us to move off some of the higher-salary-guys as a contingency. We have not only really locked into 2021 and 2022, but we have also given ourselves fewer outs in the years beyond. Unless we just intend to spend like the Dodgers.

But that's the point: we haven't locked ourselves into anything with this trade, nor have we given ourselves "fewer outs" in the years beyond. How so? Because trading Martin yesterday occurred in the same vacuum wherein Kevin Smith, Otto Lopez, and Samad Taylor have ALL been big up-arrow guys in 2021. On top of Jordan Groshans and Orelvis Martinez stepping up significantly in the past month or so, while Santiago Espinal is currently running a 1.2 WAR season at the major league level.

That is a LOT of controllable talent at that SS/2B/3B/CF spot, and apart from Orelvis Martinez, all of those guys are at AA or above, with Kevin Smith and Santiago Espinal being essentially MLB ready right now.

To me, the fact that they didn't "sell high" on someone like Kevin Smith, or some of those other AA bats who were all hitting better than Austin Martin, implies that they actually believe that those are real prospects. I'm not implying that they chose any of those guys over Martin (or that the Twins would trade Berrios for a package that had Otto Lopez in it over Austin Martin for example), but the fact that Martin carried more "prospect luster" by way of his draft position a year ago seems to be jading some people in terms of actually evaluating what we have as a whole.

[VanWest82]

I mean, good on Shatkins for getting something decent if indeed we’re souring on Martin and SWR but at the same time we acquired both those players at substantial cost so maybe we deserve a little criticism for picking guys that weren’t working out.

Hopefully we can at least make a WC run.

[Schad]

But that's the point: we haven't locked ourselves into anything with this trade, nor have we given ourselves "fewer outs" in the years beyond. How so? Because trading Martin yesterday occurred in the same vacuum wherein Kevin Smith, Otto Lopez, and Samad Taylor have ALL been big up-arrow guys in 2021. On top of Jordan Groshans and Orelvis Martinez stepping up significantly in the past month or so, while Santiago Espinal is currently running a 1.2 WAR season at the major league level.

That is a LOT of controllable talent at that SS/2B/3B/CF spot, and apart from Orelvis Martinez, all of those guys are at AA or above, with Kevin Smith and Santiago Espinal being essentially MLB ready right now.

To me, the fact that they didn't "sell high" on someone like Kevin Smith, or some of those other AA bats who were all hitting better than Austin Martin, implies that they actually believe that those are real prospects. I'm not implying that they chose any of those guys over Martin (or that the Twins would trade Berrios for a package that had Otto Lopez in it over Austin Martin for example), but the fact that Martin carried more "prospect luster" by way of his draft position a year ago seems to be jading some people in terms of actually evaluating what we have as a whole.

It's extremely difficult to keep all those guys, though. We're in something of a 40-man crunch already, and if we believe that Smith and Taylor are real prospects, we'll need to roster them end of the year. We also likely have to roster Miguel Hiraldo, though I'm presuming at this point that Pardinho is no threat to get Rule 5'd...we're running out of roster spots for actual major leaguers unless we get much more aggressive in promoting those kids to the bigs. Martin and SWR happened to be two of the guys that didn't need to be rostered.

And again, the issue isn't that they were traded. The issue is that they were traded for a player who is rather close to free agency, in order to make a pretty low-percentage playoff push. I don't think anyone would have batted an eye had they formed the basis of a trade for Marquez or Alcantara or another pitcher with several years under control, even if it cost more.

[vaff87]

People keep mentioning Walker, but fail to mention any of the other 2 dozen starting pitchers that Jays fans on this forum wanted to bring in, and they’re all struggled with command or injuries. So you’re basically asking why the Jays didn’t thread the needle in the off season because he’s literally one of the only few agent SP’s who isn’t shitin’ the bed. So getting someone who is actually effective and much better than Walker at the deadline was likely always the plan.

Anyways, the SP hasn’t been the problem the past 2 months, just the bullpen. Even stripling has been quite good. I just hope they don’t screw this up and just send Matz to the pen instead of Stripling. He gives us an extra effective arm down there too.

So from the get go, I have heard your argument about Walker not being the only free agent the Jays could have targeted. That is not a completely sound argument for more than one reason.

One, Walker, being on the Jays, was at least more likely than average to be targeted by the Jays relative to other FA starters. Walker himself was open to coming back. Also, the Jays had access to him, knew what he brought and possibly what to expect from him. Meaning they were more likely to bring him back relative to someone else had the desire been there to address the pitching problems through FA. I am not saying 100% but just more likely.

2, some of the FA starters are doing well. Bauer and Kluber are two such names. Hill is also doing decently. I grant you that many are not but at least those three are. It would not have been impossible through another name to avoid this trade had good judgement been exercised.

3, if the Jays got a pitcher through FA and he bombed and then needed Berrios, I wouldn't have been as perturbed. In this case, they didn't even try to fill the pitching hole earlier and instead relied on reclamation projects. They truly believed that the SP lineup wasn't bad enough because of their good offense to win. And because of that belief, here we are. Hopefully Martin and SWR don't turn out that good but I have a feeling Martin at least will.

4) Berrios may also not work out just like a FA pitcher. For some reason, you neglect to mention this. There is always a risk bringing someone in. My argument was to use money to bring someone in not top prospects.


And just one more thing, I agree that the BP is worse than the SP and has accounted for the Jays losses more than the starters. Really, any pitching would look better next to the BP. But starting pitching was still a deficit on this team due to the plan you speak of, which I argue, is a terrible plan.

Bauer and Kluber? One an overpaid d-bag who’s season just ended in July and the other made 10 mostly solid starts before being put on the 60 day DL. I’m not sure those are good hindsight examples of signings we should have made.

And of course Berrios might not work out, why is it up to me to mention that nothing is 100%? But I will look at things like age, health, salary and track record to conclude that he’s a better bet then anyone we could have signed this past off-season. I’m more worried that our 2 prospects work out really well for the Twins.

Bauer and Kluber might be the two worst hindsight examples of anything, I’ve ever heard

[Randle McMurphy]

Unable to make his professional debut until 2021, the Blue Jays challenged Martin with an initial assignment to Double-A New Hampshire, and the results have been both good and confusing. On paper, his .281/.424/.383 line has Martin meeting that challenge with aplomb. But evaluators have left their looks this summer scratching their heads a bit. After striking out just twice in 69 plate appearances during Vanderbilt’s shortened 2020 season, Martin has racked up a 21.2% strikeout rate this year, while some feel his propensity for drawing walks (14.8%) also frequently puts him into bad counts he can’t fight his way out of. Data-minded evaluators also point to a loss of power, and while a dip would be expected during a transition from metal to wood bats, Martin’s exit velocities are down a whopping 8 mph from his college days.

The questions surrounding Martin’s defense also haven’t been answered, and if anything, they’ve become more pronounced. Martin has split time between shortstop and center field for the Fisher Cats, and scouts have not been impressed with him at either position. He’s been error prone on the dirt, with 10 miscues in just 26 games, while in the outfield, his arm is below average and merely average speed limits his range in center.

https://blogs.fangraphs.com/twins-get-bounty-for-berrios-but-its-one-thats-not-without-risk/

Looks like the Jays may have had several reasons to start doubting Martin.

[PowerPlant1]

So from the get go, I have heard your argument about Walker not being the only free agent the Jays could have targeted. That is not a completely sound argument for more than one reason.

One, Walker, being on the Jays, was at least more likely than average to be targeted by the Jays relative to other FA starters. Walker himself was open to coming back. Also, the Jays had access to him, knew what he brought and possibly what to expect from him. Meaning they were more likely to bring him back relative to someone else had the desire been there to address the pitching problems through FA. I am not saying 100% but just more likely.

2, some of the FA starters are doing well. Bauer and Kluber are two such names. Hill is also doing decently. I grant you that many are not but at least those three are. It would not have been impossible through another name to avoid this trade had good judgement been exercised.

3, if the Jays got a pitcher through FA and he bombed and then needed Berrios, I wouldn't have been as perturbed. In this case, they didn't even try to fill the pitching hole earlier and instead relied on reclamation projects. They truly believed that the SP lineup wasn't bad enough because of their good offense to win. And because of that belief, here we are. Hopefully Martin and SWR don't turn out that good but I have a feeling Martin at least will.

4) Berrios may also not work out just like a FA pitcher. For some reason, you neglect to mention this. There is always a risk bringing someone in. My argument was to use money to bring someone in not top prospects.


And just one more thing, I agree that the BP is worse than the SP and has accounted for the Jays losses more than the starters. Really, any pitching would look better next to the BP. But starting pitching was still a deficit on this team due to the plan you speak of, which I argue, is a terrible plan.

Bauer and Kluber? One an overpaid d-bag who’s season just ended in July and the other made 10 mostly solid starts before being put on the 60 day DL. I’m not sure those are good hindsight examples of signings we should have made.

And of course Berrios might not work out, why is it up to me to mention that nothing is 100%? But I will look at things like age, health, salary and track record to conclude that he’s a better bet then anyone we could have signed this past off-season. I’m more worried that our 2 prospects work out really well for the Twins.

Bauer and Kluber might be the two worst hindsight examples of anything, I’ve ever heard

Yes, LOL. Except I didn't say to go after them specifically.

Injuries cannot really be predicted. I used those two as examples of FA SP that were performing well by the stats. If Bauer and Kluber are thought to be horrible moves in hindsight because they got injured, what does that make Springer? All these players could have had more overall potential value if healthy. If Berrios gets injured, does that invalidate the Jays plan? No.

The plan just sucks. We lost top prospects and didn't do anything significant to try to avoid what became a necessary deal. No one including those with crystal balls who claim to have known the entire FA class was going to bomb and also, now, claim that my plan sucks because of injuries of certain FAs has said anything to support a crazy plan of featuring reclamation starters in order to likely need a real starter down the road.

Really, those reclamation starters have done better than expected. And I might credit some of the judgement of management for that. Matz is the suckiest. Stripling a bit better. Ray has been good. Nonetheless, all 3 of them + Roark + hope in Pearson's development was simply madness. Manoah was good fortune or we'd be in more trouble.

If we had gone after Bauer or Kluber we may have been in the same position to need Berrios. However, I would be more at peace with the fact that management tried to avoid losing top prospects by getting what they hoped to be a quality FA SP.

Nonetheless, the other problem is that I don't believe in the Jays BP acquisitions either. Hand and Soria aren't doing that well this season. I hope at least one of them pitches well.

[PowerPlant1]

This trade is a direct result of the reclamation product starting rotation we featured from the season's beginning. The unwillingness to sign a SP like Taijuan Walker caused the need for this deal.

One can theorize that they might have still made this trade anyway even had they had Walker to bolster the SP rotation even more but I doubt it because we may not have been as desperate as we clearly were now.

I am a Walker fan. Berrios is better, but I'd rather have Walker and the prospect capital than Berrios. I am not convinced that they will extend Berrios either and that will really sting. It seemed pretty clear to me that they ran out of money at the end of the off-season and that is on management.

This trade is also about next off-season when they will likely be outbid for Ray. Pearson's lack of development also factors here. They probably projected him to be a #2 by now.

Exactly. 14 months for two top prospects. They deprioritized the starting rotation in the off season and here we are. They thought: our offense can win us games the starters would have lost. That hasn't happened. BP being terrible along with injuries have added to that problem.

Manoah has compensated for Pearson's spot unless they factored him in here as well alongside Pearson.

[vaff87]

Bauer and Kluber? One an overpaid d-bag who’s season just ended in July and the other made 10 mostly solid starts before being put on the 60 day DL. I’m not sure those are good hindsight examples of signings we should have made.

And of course Berrios might not work out, why is it up to me to mention that nothing is 100%? But I will look at things like age, health, salary and track record to conclude that he’s a better bet then anyone we could have signed this past off-season. I’m more worried that our 2 prospects work out really well for the Twins.

Bauer and Kluber might be the two worst hindsight examples of anything, I’ve ever heard

Yes, LOL. Except I didn't say to go after them specifically.

Injuries cannot really be predicted. I used those two as examples of FA SP that were performing well by the stats. If Bauer and Kluber are thought to be horrible moves in hindsight because they got injured, what does that make Springer? All these players could have had more overall potential value if healthy. If Berrios gets injured, does that invalidate the Jays plan? No.

The plan just sucks. We lost top prospects and didn't do anything significant to try to avoid what became a necessary deal. No one including those with crystal balls who claim to have known the entire FA class was going to bomb and also, now, claim that my plan sucks because of injuries of certain FAs has said anything to support a crazy plan of featuring reclamation starters in order to likely need a real starter down the road.

Really, those reclamation starters have done better than expected. And I might credit some of the judgement of management for that. Matz is the suckiest. Stripling a bit better. Ray has been good. Nonetheless, all 3 of them + Roark + hope in Pearson's development was simply madness. Manoah was good fortune or we'd be in more trouble.

If we had gone after Bauer or Kluber we may have been in the same position to need Berrios. However, I would be more at peace with the fact that management tried to avoid losing top prospects by getting what they hoped to be a quality FA SP.

Nonetheless, the other problem is that I don't believe in the Jays BP acquisitions either. Hand and Soria aren't doing that well this season. I hope at least one of them pitches well.

Corey Kluber was a reclamation project that got hurt… just like Kirby Yates.

Bauer signed the largest AAV salary in baseball history and has basically been banished from the league. That could go down as the worst signing in MLB history.

[polo007]

Scott Mitchell: Pivot from stockpiling prospects to peddling them arrives for Blue Jays - TSN.ca

In trading away 2020 fifth-overall pick Austin Martin and Simeon Woods Richardson, the main piece in the return for Marcus Stroman at the 2019 deadline, GM Ross Atkins sent two top 100 prospects to the Minnesota Twins in exchange for two-plus months of Berríos this season and a full 2022 campaign that’s really the key to the whole thing.

If you think it’s too much to give up, that’s not outlandish.

But when you start to factor in how fleeting opportunities to acquire impact rotation pieces are, combined with the fact prices at this trade deadline were much higher than previous years, and you start to see how the chance to acquire the 27-year-old right-hander was too good to pass up.

Even if it meant dealing Martin, a very good prospect who’s faces significant questions about not only his defensive home, but his power, as well, something that was a concern for evaluators during the draft process.

That’s not to say Martin isn’t a very good prospect. He is.

But there’s a chance the Blue Jays sold high. There’s also the chance, of course, he alters his swing, taps into the power and becomes the star many have envisioned.

This trade, however, is all about what the Jays needed most to take the next step in their hopeful evolution into a World Series contender.

It’s impact pitching, and Berríos may just be the start.

The Jays are fully expected to be in on names like Noah Syndergaard and Kevin Gausman in free agency this winter, as well as whatever other trade opportunities present themselves.

Many will look at Berríos’ career 4.08 ERA and feel underwhelmed.

It’s more about the stuff, the track record of health and durability, and the touch of upside he could possess at an age when pitchers are usually just starting to figure things out.

After being drafted by the Twins with the 32nd pick in the 2012 draft, a new organizational message and a different voice in veteran pitching coach Pete Walker could unlock another level in the 6-foot Puerto Rican.

It’s a thought that has crossed Atkins’ mind, but they didn’t make the deal banking on it.

The current version of Berríos, with a career-best 3.48 ERA through 20 starts thus far this season, is well worth the price in his opinion.

“I think it is really interesting as young he is, as athletic and how hard-working as he is, it’s easy to think about him just continuing on a positive trend,” Atkins said. “Whether that is in more just how he’s deploying his work and how he’s learning how to attack different teams and learning how to reshape certain pitches or make adjustments, he has the ability and all of the attributes to do all of those things. We’ll see. Time will tell on that front, but the current version in the current form was obviously exciting enough for us.”

Once it was clear to the Jays that Berríos was available this week and the Twins were motivated to move him a year-and-a-half out from free agency, he became the clear target.

Not only does it give Atkins’ club a chance to catch lightning in a bottle this season and climb over a number of clubs to claim a wild-card spot, it gives them a full season of Berríos paired with Hyun Jin Ryu — and potentially free-agent-to-be Robbie Ray, who absolutely needs to be re-upped with a lucrative new deal — atop the Jays rotation in 2022.

“In my discussions with (Twins president of baseball operations) Derek (Falvey), we knew the potential was there,” Atkins said of the deal coming together. “We also knew that it was going to be a very steep price. They want to continue to try to win and they could’ve very easily just had him pitch for them tonight."

“Over the last probably 48 hours, it felt as though we were one of the teams that had a real chance at him,” Atkins added. “So we spent a little bit more time on that and spent a little bit more time with that organization, not just myself, but other individuals talking to them. Today, the offers became more concrete and it was a decision point for us.”

With Berríos now added to a rotation that includes the aforementioned Ryu and Ray, rookie Alek Manoah, who will start Saturday at Rogers Centre, as well as Steven Matz and Ross Stripling, the Jays are likely to roll with a six-man rotation for the time being.

The depth is nice, but it is Berríos’ ability to consistently pitch deep into games that will really help.

“This moves helps not only protect others starters and the reliance on Hyun Jin Ryu and Robbie Ray to each time out really be the stoppers for us, but it’ll also impact our relievers because Berríos is someone who has gotten deep into games pretty routinely and that takes some stress off,” Atkins said. “It was important for us to acquire pitching in some way if it were possible and it wasn’t the best market to be in for starting pitching but we were fortunate to have the talent to be able to acquire Jose.”

Durability is a major factor, as well.

[bluerap23]

I am starting to come around on this trade, but only IF he is resigned. Still having a hard time with giving up high prospects that are close to MLB ready with so many years of control.

But the pitching does look pretty nice on the depth chart now.

On a side note: is there any reason why Pete Walker should not be considered for Manager next year?

[PowerPlant1]

Bauer and Kluber might be the two worst hindsight examples of anything, I’ve ever heard

Yes, LOL. Except I didn't say to go after them specifically.

Injuries cannot really be predicted. I used those two as examples of FA SP that were performing well by the stats. If Bauer and Kluber are thought to be horrible moves in hindsight because they got injured, what does that make Springer? All these players could have had more overall potential value if healthy. If Berrios gets injured, does that invalidate the Jays plan? No.

The plan just sucks. We lost top prospects and didn't do anything significant to try to avoid what became a necessary deal. No one including those with crystal balls who claim to have known the entire FA class was going to bomb and also, now, claim that my plan sucks because of injuries of certain FAs has said anything to support a crazy plan of featuring reclamation starters in order to likely need a real starter down the road.

Really, those reclamation starters have done better than expected. And I might credit some of the judgement of management for that. Matz is the suckiest. Stripling a bit better. Ray has been good. Nonetheless, all 3 of them + Roark + hope in Pearson's development was simply madness. Manoah was good fortune or we'd be in more trouble.

If we had gone after Bauer or Kluber we may have been in the same position to need Berrios. However, I would be more at peace with the fact that management tried to avoid losing top prospects by getting what they hoped to be a quality FA SP.

Nonetheless, the other problem is that I don't believe in the Jays BP acquisitions either. Hand and Soria aren't doing that well this season. I hope at least one of them pitches well.

Corey Kluber was a reclamation project that got hurt… just like Kirby Yates.

Bauer signed the largest AAV salary in baseball history and has basically been banished from the league. That could go down as the worst signing in MLB history.

Well, the Bauer signing cannot be faulted to LA management unless they knew about a future criminal investigation. There is a difference between taking a risk on something you know could blow up and then something that comes out of nowhere to impact the signing. Even if the results are the same, putting responsibility on management has to be determined by what they knew or didn't know.

If the Dodgers knew nothing about Bauer's history/actions, I would call it a signing with the worst results. A signing that went bad. Again, no reason to not go after FAs.

As for Kluber being a reclamation project, yeah you could say that. He was injured the two previous seasons.

Still, there are two types of reclamation projects. There are reclamation projects who were performing at a high level and then got injured to come back.

And then there are reclamation projects like Matz and Stripling and even Ray with poor results while being healthy. Didn't Matz have an ERA around 9ish?

There is less optimism with the latter group. They have lost their way as pitchers while healthy.

Kluber had past success. If he avoids injury, why could he not have future success? Still, I concede in Kluber's case, there is risk in the signing. Just like Yates.

[JaysRule15]

Well, what's done is done and we've all had some time to digest the trade. Could it backfire on us and become the Shapkins' version of the Dickey trade? Absolutely. Martin can add some muscle, adjust his swing, etc. this offseason and hit for more power next season. He would give the Twins an elite leadoff hitter for years to come. SWR is still really young and has no.2 starter upside.

But I think the front office owed it to this team to make a move. Our run differential doesn't align with our record and I'm sure the front office is banking on eventually seeing a correction where we start winning more close games. Revamping our pitching is the best way to do that. And now we have a strong looking rotation headlined by Ray, Ryu, Berrios and Manoah. The pen is looking pretty deep too and will get an upgrade soon when Pearson comes up as a reliever.

The fact that we have Berrios next year too helps as well, especially with Ray being a FA at the end of this season. We will have money available this winter or next to attempt to re-sign Berrios if we wish.

Lastly, remember that there's still a really deep class of infielders available in free agency this offseason. So that also likely played a factor in us deeming Martin expendable.

[Parataxis]

Yes, LOL. Except I didn't say to go after them specifically.

Injuries cannot really be predicted. I used those two as examples of FA SP that were performing well by the stats. If Bauer and Kluber are thought to be horrible moves in hindsight because they got injured, what does that make Springer? All these players could have had more overall potential value if healthy. If Berrios gets injured, does that invalidate the Jays plan? No.

The plan just sucks. We lost top prospects and didn't do anything significant to try to avoid what became a necessary deal. No one including those with crystal balls who claim to have known the entire FA class was going to bomb and also, now, claim that my plan sucks because of injuries of certain FAs has said anything to support a crazy plan of featuring reclamation starters in order to likely need a real starter down the road.

Really, those reclamation starters have done better than expected. And I might credit some of the judgement of management for that. Matz is the suckiest. Stripling a bit better. Ray has been good. Nonetheless, all 3 of them + Roark + hope in Pearson's development was simply madness. Manoah was good fortune or we'd be in more trouble.

If we had gone after Bauer or Kluber we may have been in the same position to need Berrios. However, I would be more at peace with the fact that management tried to avoid losing top prospects by getting what they hoped to be a quality FA SP.

Nonetheless, the other problem is that I don't believe in the Jays BP acquisitions either. Hand and Soria aren't doing that well this season. I hope at least one of them pitches well.

Corey Kluber was a reclamation project that got hurt… just like Kirby Yates.

Bauer signed the largest AAV salary in baseball history and has basically been banished from the league. That could go down as the worst signing in MLB history.

Well, the Bauer signing cannot be faulted to LA management unless they knew about a future criminal investigation. There is a difference between taking a risk on something you know could blow up and then something that comes out of nowhere to impact the signing. Even if the results are the same, putting responsibility on management has to be determined by what they knew or didn't know.

If the Dodgers knew nothing about Bauer's history/actions, I would call it a signing with the worst results. A signing that went bad. Again, no reason to not go after FAs.

They knew (or should have known) that he'd been previously implicated in harrassing women. It's not like this is completely out of left field or unexpected.

[PowerPlant1]

Well, what's done is done and we've all had some time to digest the trade. Could it backfire on us and become the Shapkins' version of the Dickey trade? Absolutely. Martin can add some muscle, adjust his swing, etc. this offseason and hit for more power next season. He would give the Twins an elite leadoff hitter for years to come. SWR is still really young and has no.2 starter upside.

But I think the front office owed it to this team to make a move. Our run differential doesn't align with our record and I'm sure the front office is banking on eventually seeing a correction where we start winning more close games. Revamping our pitching is the best way to do that. And now we have a strong looking rotation headlined by Ray, Ryu, Berrios and Manoah. The pen is looking pretty deep too and will get an upgrade soon when Pearson comes up as a reliever.

The fact that we have Berrios next year too helps as well, especially with Ray being a FA at the end of this season. We will have money available this winter or next to attempt to re-sign Berrios if we wish.

Lastly, remember that there's still a really deep class of infielders available in free agency this offseason. So that also likely played a factor in us deeming Martin expendable.

Sure, they have other IF prospects. You just don't want to give one up ranked so high. I don't even hate the trade just the way it went down and for how long Berrios is controlled.

The pen has more names. That is all I will say. The last two they acquired were struggling. Cimber is off to a good start. Richards not so much. Banking on anything from Pearson this year is something I would not do.

[polo007]

Bowden: MLB trade deadline grades for all 30 teams, from the Dodgers (A+) to the Rockies (F) - The Athletic

Toronto Blue Jays

Grade: A

Trades: Acquired RHP José Berríos from Twins for INF/OF Austin Martin and RHP Simeon Woods Richardson. Acquired LHP Brad Hand from Nationals for C Riley Adams. Traded 1B Rowdy Tellez to Brewers for RHP Trevor Richards and RHP Bowden Francis. Acquired OF Corey Dickerson and RHP Adam Cimber from Marlins for INF Joe Panik and RHP Andrew McInvale (June 29). Traded RHP Joel Payamps to Royals for cash. Acquired RHP Joakim Soria from Diamondbacks for two PTBNL.

The Blue Jays’ biggest needs at the trade deadline were to improve their starting rotation and the back end of their bullpen, which had blown 12 of 29 saves entering Friday’s action. Landing Berríos, a 27-year-old two-time All-Star who has the ability to start Game 1 or 2 of any postseason series, was their best trade, even if it came at a steep price of two high-end prospects (Martin, Woods Richardson). The Blue Jays also acquired closer Brad Hand from the Nationals, and they did it by taking advantage of their catching depth, trading the fifth-best catcher in their organization (Adams) to get the deal done. Hand posted a 3.59 ERA in 42 2/3 innings this season for Washington, with 21 saves in 26 opportunities. The Blue Jays are now poised to make a serious run at one of the AL wild-card berths (and more).

[vaff87]

Corey Kluber was a reclamation project that got hurt… just like Kirby Yates.

Bauer signed the largest AAV salary in baseball history and has basically been banished from the league. That could go down as the worst signing in MLB history.

Well, the Bauer signing cannot be faulted to LA management unless they knew about a future criminal investigation. There is a difference between taking a risk on something you know could blow up and then something that comes out of nowhere to impact the signing. Even if the results are the same, putting responsibility on management has to be determined by what they knew or didn't know.

If the Dodgers knew nothing about Bauer's history/actions, I would call it a signing with the worst results. A signing that went bad. Again, no reason to not go after FAs.

They knew (or should have known) that he'd been previously implicated in harrassing women. It's not like this is completely out of left field or unexpected.

Exactly. There were red flags galore with Bauer. There’s a reason why most people didn’t want him.

[agkagk]

Well, the Bauer signing cannot be faulted to LA management unless they knew about a future criminal investigation. There is a difference between taking a risk on something you know could blow up and then something that comes out of nowhere to impact the signing. Even if the results are the same, putting responsibility on management has to be determined by what they knew or didn't know.

If the Dodgers knew nothing about Bauer's history/actions, I would call it a signing with the worst results. A signing that went bad. Again, no reason to not go after FAs.

They knew (or should have known) that he'd been previously implicated in harrassing women. It's not like this is completely out of left field or unexpected.

Exactly. There were red flags galore with Bauer. There’s a reason why most people didn’t want him.

Ya but who knew he was an antisocial violent predator.

Whenever I hear about famous people being charged with domestic violence, I preach waiting until we hear all the facts before casting judgement.

But there’s already more than enough info to confirm that this guy belongs in jail.

Bloody sicko.

Didn’t mean to take it sideways, just trying to emphasis that this is an extreme case and how could the dodgers have known? — there’s a reason he earned the salary he did. Obviously he was in demand.

[GoRapstheoriginal]

After 1 start this is the right move

[The_Hater]

I am starting to come around on this trade, but only IF he is resigned. Still having a hard time with giving up high prospects that are close to MLB ready with so many years of control.

But the pitching does look pretty nice on the depth chart now.

On a side note: is there any reason why Pete Walker should not be considered for Manager next year?

We’ve sat on these highly rated prospects before only to watch them completely flake out just around AAA. Drabek, Alford, Snider and Tellez all come to mind. Trading them before they get to that point can be important too. But we’ve had such a good run lately it’s easy to think that they’re all going to work out and become stars.

Historically, Shapiro has been very, very good at identifying undervalued prospects and overvalued propects and acting accordingly. We’re not as privy to all the information he has so we tend to marry ourselves to the top prospect lists.

[The_Hater]

After 1 start this is the right move

He didn’t even pitch that great, got hit early, had some control issues. That’s how good this guys stuff is.

I have no problem with this trade. You can’t hold onto all your prospects and if you’re going to trade good ones, do it for quality starting pitching.