Around the MLB 2018

BigLeagueChew · Post #261 » by **BigLeagueChew** » Tue Aug 30, 2016 9:26 pm

Puig has been claimed on waivers by an unkown team.

Skin Blues · Post #262 » by **Skin Blues** » Tue Aug 30, 2016 10:00 pm

Main difference is they use different defensive metrics. It's interesting to look at WPA, too. Mike Trout is #1, and Donaldson is #2. Then after a huuuuge gap, David Ortiz is 3rd. Trout and Donaldson are completely on a different level in terms of WPA. Trout should be MVP, he is clearly the best player in the league for the 5th year in a row, and has provided more value to the Angels than any player has provided to his team. If you want to ding him for having bad teammates, then next up should be Donaldson IMO.

vaff87 · Post #263 » by **vaff87** » Tue Aug 30, 2016 10:07 pm

The_Hater wrote:
EastBayBoy wrote:
The_Hater wrote:
I've got Betts WaR at 7.6. Altuve at 7.3 and JD at 7.0

Ive read/heard about more people picking Altuve then any of them. Machado has also been great.

Fan graphs has JD at 7.0 WAR while Betts and Altuve are both sitting at 6.7 WAR.

Jose Altuve and JD are both right there. At this point Altuve is slashing .354/.414/.569/.411 wRC+ 164 / 6.7 WAR. Don't think Altuve will get much consideration IF Houston doesn't make the playoffs

Machado is playing well but his line puts him behind the other 3 .306/.358/.560/.382 wRC+ 139/ 5.9 WAR

My WAR numbers are from baseball reference. Not sure what the difference is?

I've always been more of an fWAR fan for position players, but I think their pitching WAR needs adjustments.

I don't see how Mookie has a WAR 0.6 ahead of JD. JD is a much better hitter. Mookie is a better baserunner. But I assume they're saying his defense in RF is that much more valuable than JD's at third? That seems absurd.

Raps in 4 · Post #264 » by **Raps in 4** » Tue Aug 30, 2016 10:11 pm

The_Hater wrote:
EastBayBoy wrote:
The_Hater wrote:
I've got Betts WaR at 7.6. Altuve at 7.3 and JD at 7.0

Ive read/heard about more people picking Altuve then any of them. Machado has also been great.

Fan graphs has JD at 7.0 WAR while Betts and Altuve are both sitting at 6.7 WAR.

Jose Altuve and JD are both right there. At this point Altuve is slashing .354/.414/.569/.411 wRC+ 164 / 6.7 WAR. Don't think Altuve will get much consideration IF Houston doesn't make the playoffs

Machado is playing well but his line puts him behind the other 3 .306/.358/.560/.382 wRC+ 139/ 5.9 WAR

My WAR numbers are from baseball reference. Not sure what the difference is?

http://www.fangraphs.com/library/war/differences-fwar-rwar/

Most stat heads say fwar is the most accurate (I think it uses the better defensive stat) so I just use that one.

vaff87 · Post #265 » by **vaff87** » Tue Aug 30, 2016 10:16 pm

Skin Blues wrote:Main difference is they use different defensive metrics. It's interesting to look at WPA, too. Mike Trout is #1, and Donaldson is #2. Then after a huuuuge gap, David Ortiz is 3rd. Trout and Donaldson are completely on a different level in terms of WPA. Trout should be MVP, he is clearly the best player in the league for the 5th year in a row, and has provided more value to the Angels than any player has provided to his team. If you want to ding him for having bad teammates, then next up should be Donaldson IMO.

Trout is the best player. But the problem is all his value doesn't get the Angels anywhere. They'd be last place, with or without him. When there are guys having comparable seasons on playoff teams, the MVP will go to one of them.

The_Hater · Post #266 » by **The_Hater** » Tue Aug 30, 2016 10:23 pm

vaff87 wrote:
Skin Blues wrote:Main difference is they use different defensive metrics. It's interesting to look at WPA, too. Mike Trout is #1, and Donaldson is #2. Then after a huuuuge gap, David Ortiz is 3rd. Trout and Donaldson are completely on a different level in terms of WPA. Trout should be MVP, he is clearly the best player in the league for the 5th year in a row, and has provided more value to the Angels than any player has provided to his team. If you want to ding him for having bad teammates, then next up should be Donaldson IMO.

Trout is the best player. But the problem is all his value doesn't get the Angels anywhere. They'd be last place, with or without him. When there are guys having comparable seasons on playoff teams, the MVP will go to one of them.

If the award was called 'player of the year' instead of MVP all these years then there would likely be far less voting mistakes as sportswriters would be less likely to put their own interpretation on exactly what makes a player valuable.

We've still got a month to play and a few deserving winners so I still see a lot of jockeying going on. It would be interesting to see if a Houston fade towards .500 costs Altuve the award or if Machado has a huge month and Baltimore steals the division if he doesn't vault up the ladder. I would imagine either Toronto or Boston missing the playoffs would be a death blow to JD and Betts.

pilkoids · Post #267 » by **pilkoids** » Wed Aug 31, 2016 2:24 am

Thank you Tampa

Sent from my SM-G920W8 using Tapatalk

zilby · Post #268 » by **zilby** » Wed Aug 31, 2016 4:38 am

How annoying is it that Texas is 25 games over .500 with a +6 run differential? I mean jeez, talk about winneryness. 40 comeback wins leads the MLB

The_Hater · Post #269 » by **The_Hater** » Wed Aug 31, 2016 1:31 pm

BigLeagueChew wrote:Puig has been claimed on waivers by an unkown team.

I guess the Dodgers weren't able to slide him through waivers and trade him. Probably lucky for them. I wouldn't be surprised if he ripped the cover off the ball for them in September.

jaymeister15 · Post #270 » by **jaymeister15** » Wed Aug 31, 2016 1:52 pm

zilby wrote:How annoying is it that Texas is 25 games over .500 with a +6 run differential? I mean jeez, talk about winneryness. 40 comeback wins leads the MLB

I wouldn't be too upset if variance started to correct itself during the playoffs and they got swept out of the first round in 3 one run games.

Skin Blues · Post #271 » by **Skin Blues** » Wed Aug 31, 2016 2:07 pm

vaff87 wrote:
Skin Blues wrote:Main difference is they use different defensive metrics. It's interesting to look at WPA, too. Mike Trout is #1, and Donaldson is #2. Then after a huuuuge gap, David Ortiz is 3rd. Trout and Donaldson are completely on a different level in terms of WPA. Trout should be MVP, he is clearly the best player in the league for the 5th year in a row, and has provided more value to the Angels than any player has provided to his team. If you want to ding him for having bad teammates, then next up should be Donaldson IMO.

Trout is the best player. But the problem is all his value doesn't get the Angels anywhere. They'd be last place, with or without him. When there are guys having comparable seasons on playoff teams, the MVP will go to one of them.

I know how people vote, that's why I put the caveat at the end. It just seems silly to me to only consider players on the playoff bubble rather than how many games they helped their team win. Should we rule out Kris Bryant from winning the MVP since the Cubs would have easily won the division without him? The award loses meaning if you only consider players from a handful of teams.

EastBayBoy · Post #272 » by **EastBayBoy** » Wed Aug 31, 2016 3:37 pm

Skin Blues wrote:
vaff87 wrote:
Skin Blues wrote:Main difference is they use different defensive metrics. It's interesting to look at WPA, too. Mike Trout is #1, and Donaldson is #2. Then after a huuuuge gap, David Ortiz is 3rd. Trout and Donaldson are completely on a different level in terms of WPA. Trout should be MVP, he is clearly the best player in the league for the 5th year in a row, and has provided more value to the Angels than any player has provided to his team. If you want to ding him for having bad teammates, then next up should be Donaldson IMO.

Trout is the best player. But the problem is all his value doesn't get the Angels anywhere. They'd be last place, with or without him. When there are guys having comparable seasons on playoff teams, the MVP will go to one of them.

I know how people vote, that's why I put the caveat at the end. It just seems silly to me to only consider players on the playoff bubble rather than how many games they helped their team win. Should we rule out Kris Bryant from winning the MVP since the Cubs would have easily won the division without him? The award loses meaning if you only consider players from a handful of teams.

Not always the case. Harper won the NL MVP last year when the Nats didn't make the playoffs. Trout was in the AL MVP conversation last year when his team team didn't make the playoffs as well. Yes, Trout is the best player in the league, but him not being in the conversation is more so to do with the Angels being one of the worst teams in the Majors.

The_Hater · Post #273 » by **The_Hater** » Wed Aug 31, 2016 4:04 pm

EastBayBoy wrote:
Skin Blues wrote:
vaff87 wrote:
Trout is the best player. But the problem is all his value doesn't get the Angels anywhere. They'd be last place, with or without him. When there are guys having comparable seasons on playoff teams, the MVP will go to one of them.

I know how people vote, that's why I put the caveat at the end. It just seems silly to me to only consider players on the playoff bubble rather than how many games they helped their team win. Should we rule out Kris Bryant from winning the MVP since the Cubs would have easily won the division without him? The award loses meaning if you only consider players from a handful of teams.

Not always the case. Harper won the NL MVP last year when the Nats didn't make the playoffs. Trout was in the AL MVP conversation last year when his team team didn't make the playoffs as well. Yes, Trout is the best player in the league, but him not being in the conversation is more so to do with the Angels being one of the worst teams in the Majors.

It's that and the fact that Trout's numbers are jumping off the page. Harper's numbers were so much above everyone else last season they couldn't be ignored. Trout is actually having a down season by his standards and his numbers don't look much different than the rest of the top players. It is incredible though that in a game of variance he once again leads the AL in War. 5 straight seasons I think?

BigLeagueChew · Post #274 » by **BigLeagueChew** » Wed Aug 31, 2016 4:27 pm

The_Hater wrote:
BigLeagueChew wrote:Puig has been claimed on waivers by an unkown team.

I guess the Dodgers weren't able to slide him through waivers and trade him. Probably lucky for them. I wouldn't be surprised if he ripped the cover off the ball for them in September.

Apparently he didn't make it to the any of the top teams waivers list, not surprising. Partly thought he might get the Rios treatment who was anywhere from a 2 WAR player to 5-6 WAR player with us and the Jays said get the frig out' out of here.

Raps in 4 · Post #275 » by **Raps in 4** » Wed Aug 31, 2016 4:34 pm

The_Hater wrote:
EastBayBoy wrote:
Skin Blues wrote:I know how people vote, that's why I put the caveat at the end. It just seems silly to me to only consider players on the playoff bubble rather than how many games they helped their team win. Should we rule out Kris Bryant from winning the MVP since the Cubs would have easily won the division without him? The award loses meaning if you only consider players from a handful of teams.

Not always the case. Harper won the NL MVP last year when the Nats didn't make the playoffs. Trout was in the AL MVP conversation last year when his team team didn't make the playoffs as well. Yes, Trout is the best player in the league, but him not being in the conversation is more so to do with the Angels being one of the worst teams in the Majors.

It's that and the fact that Trout's numbers are jumping off the page. Harper's numbers were so much above everyone else last season they couldn't be ignored. Trout is actually having a down season by his standards and his numbers don't look much different than the rest of the top players. It is incredible though that in a game of variance he once again leads the AL in War. 5 straight seasons I think?

His offensive production is right around his career average (its actually a bit higher). His defensive stats are down this year, but this wouldn't be the first time they've fluctuated. He's having a very productive season and will no doubt end up at 8+ fWAR again. Sure it's not the 10+ WAR he hit 3 seasons ago, but this season isn't a down-year year either (it would be in line with his past 2 seasons).

The_Hater · Post #276 » by **The_Hater** » Wed Aug 31, 2016 7:22 pm

Raps in 4 wrote:
The_Hater wrote:
EastBayBoy wrote:

Not always the case. Harper won the NL MVP last year when the Nats didn't make the playoffs. Trout was in the AL MVP conversation last year when his team team didn't make the playoffs as well. Yes, Trout is the best player in the league, but him not being in the conversation is more so to do with the Angels being one of the worst teams in the Majors.

It's that and the fact that Trout's numbers are jumping off the page. Harper's numbers were so much above everyone else last season they couldn't be ignored. Trout is actually having a down season by his standards and his numbers don't look much different than the rest of the top players. It is incredible though that in a game of variance he once again leads the AL in War. 5 straight seasons I think?

His offensive production is right around his career average (its actually a bit higher). His defensive stats are down this year, but this wouldn't be the first time they've fluctuated. He's having a very productive season and will no doubt end up at 8+ fWAR again. Sure it's not the 10+ WAR he hit 3 seasons ago, but this season isn't a down-year year either (it would be in line with his past 2 seasons).

I wasn't thinking specifically his WAR, I was looking at his counting stats being down a bit. Yes they aren't as important as WAR but we can still bet that a number of voters look at them above all else. Hence the reason Cabrara stole 2 MVP's from him. And of course the WaR of many of the other MVP candidates are higher than usual as well.

whysoserious · Post #277 » by **whysoserious** » Thu Sep 1, 2016 1:59 pm

So I'm a bit behind but I see Texas had a walk-off, Odor gently flipped his bat, stared the pitcher down while walking slowly to first and Jeff Bannister was jumping around like they won the World Series. What a bunch of hypocrites.

Post #278 » by **King of Canada** » Thu Sep 1, 2016 3:02 pm

whysoserious wrote:So I'm a bit behind but I see Texas had a walk-off, Odor gently flipped his bat, stared the pitcher down while walking slowly to first and Jeff Bannister was jumping around like they won the World Series. What a bunch of hypocrites.

Did you see Sid's rant about it? God I hope we play the Rangers in the post season.

Wally West · Post #279 » by **Wally West** » Thu Sep 1, 2016 3:38 pm

King of Canada wrote:
whysoserious wrote:So I'm a bit behind but I see Texas had a walk-off, Odor gently flipped his bat, stared the pitcher down while walking slowly to first and Jeff Bannister was jumping around like they won the World Series. What a bunch of hypocrites.

Did you see Sid's rant about it? God I hope we play the Rangers in the post season.

http://www.sportsnet.ca/shows/tim-and-sid-show/sid-seixeiro-strong-message-rougned-odor-rangers/
:lol:

I_Like_Dirt · Post #280 » by **I_Like_Dirt** » Thu Sep 1, 2016 6:55 pm

zilby wrote:How annoying is it that Texas is 25 games over .500 with a +6 run differential? I mean jeez, talk about winneryness. 40 comeback wins leads the MLB

I think the team that has the most to be annoyed about right now is the Red Sox. Seeing the Rangers ahead of them in the standings while barely outscoring their opponents on a night-in night-out basis, while they blow teams out regularly and have the 2nd biggest run differential in the AL and are poised for a 1-game wild-card lottery ticket.