2019-20 Offseason Thread

[Wo1verine]

Read on Twitter

I am stupidly hanging onto this dream!

[TR50]

As much as I want the Jays to make a big splash and sign someone like Ryu...is 5 years at like 20 mil/year a wise spend on him? Would he still be returning value in his age 36 and 37 seasons? Or will he be a very expensive relief option?

[Schad]

5/$100m seems unlikely given his injury history. 3/$65m was what I'd thought might get it done prior to the sudden revitalization of the free agent market, but something in the 4/$80m range is probably the max.

[polo007]

Read on Twitter

Read on Twitter

Read on Twitter

Read on Twitter

Read on Twitter

Read on Twitter

Read on Twitter

[Brinbe]

bumgarner is a dback 5/85/ 15 deferred, so that's 5/70? that's not too bad

Read on Twitter

looks like keuchel and ryu are really gonna get paid now. we need to go all in

[Schad]

The AAV isn't high, but that's a lot of years for a guy with some injury risk.

That's a very cheap deal for Kluber. Even coming off an injury-plagued season and with just one year + a vesting option (needs 160 IP in 2020) remaining, a good relief prospect and a fringy fourth OF is nothing.

[agkagk]

His medicals must stink.

[Schad]

Perhaps, though his injury history lacks the usual concerns for a pitcher...got his arm fractured by a liner, and then pulled a muscle rehabbing, but he has otherwise been a very durable starter. With only one guaranteed year there isn't a tonne of risk; I'm surprised that a few bad starts on his return seems to have left him with more red flags than, I dunno, Bumgarner.

[Brinbe]

Read on Twitter

[polo007]

Read on Twitter

[polo007]

Blue Jays are facing 'difficult realities' so far this offseason

Rogers Sportsnet MLB insider Shi Davidi joins Lead Off to discuss a disappointing offseason so far for Toronto Blue Jays fans, especially since it seems GM Ross Atkins is actively trying to engage, but free agents are choosing other destinations.

[polo007]

Read on Twitter

[polo007]

Read on Twitter

Read on Twitter

Read on Twitter

[SharoneWright]

I, for one, admire the judicious approach. We still need to shed AA's hiring of Tulo's contract.

We also need to move early to sign our young core for any discount we can get.

Then we need to either trade for pitching or over-pay for pitching based on past performance. But not first.

Hopefully, we can identify a few of our younger and cheaper pitching assets this year to soften the blow.

[polo007]

Blue Jays' financial flexibility both a blessing and a challenge - Sportsnet.ca

Roster inefficiency is one reason why the Boston Red Sox, beyond avoiding the Competitive Balance Tax, are looking to shed payroll through the likes of David Price, Jackie Bradley Jr., and J.D. Martinez, and have floated the idea of trading pending free-agent Mookie Betts.

Every club, even the Red Sox, New York Yankees and Los Angeles Dodgers, has “parameters” or “boundaries,” to borrow other terms from the Blue Jays lexicon, when it comes to payroll spending. Once money is on the books, it removes a club from options down the road.

So, no biggie if you’re paying Mike Trout or Max Scherzer, but major problem if you’re carrying Robinson Cano or Jason Heyward. The phenomenon is typically exacerbated when a player is toward the back end of his contract, the way Miguel Cabrera or Albert Pujols are, and the production declines while the salary doesn’t.

That’s all part of the deal with free agents, and why the Blue Jays are being justifiably cautious about their flexibility. Right now, even with the four years and $40 million still owed to Randal Grichuk, their roster is nearly at peak efficiency.

Shapiro wasn’t exaggerating last week when he said, “The combination of young talent along with the lack of future commitments, it will never be this again. It’s just for this moment.”

Of course, none of it will matter if that flexibility never gets used, and that’s why the Blue Jays are in this weird place in the public discourse right now.

A desire to protect that flexibility isn’t an excuse for inaction, and not wanting to cut themselves off from some fantasy Gerrit Cole scenario is a bad reason to miss out on Jake Odorizzi, who was theirs for the taking.

As I’ve said ad nauseam, while not perfect, Odorizzi would have offered more upside stability than Tanner Roark or Chase Anderson, and he would have cost less than Hyun-Jin Ryu or perhaps Dallas Keuchel will when all is said and done.

And, importantly, he would have said yes, while the other two may very well not, even if the Blue Jays are right there with the high bid, since recruiting is hard right now for GM Ross Atkins.

Aside from having the money piece, he also needs a player to be convinced that a young core led by Vladimir Guerrero Jr., and Bo Bichette is for real, to want to play for manager Charlie Montoyo, to feel the environment suits his needs, and to trust the overall plan is going to work.

Then, the player must also embrace the challenge of knocking off the Yankees, Red Sox and should-be-good-for-a-while Tampa Bay Rays in the American League East.

All of which puts extra pressure on the flexibility the Blue Jays have now. At a time when they need to add, but aren’t in the best position to do so from a free-agent standpoint, the Blue Jays may want to think twice before relieving someone else’s roster problems via trade.

Landing Ryu will feel good in the moment, but do you really want him at $16-$20 million a season for three or four years, cutting you off from other opportunities down the road, when the team should be better and the options more appealing? What about Price? Or, to a lesser degree, J.A Happ?

Maybe yes, maybe no. Wait, what do the computers say?

Seriously though, this is really where the Blue Jays’ mettle will be tested.

[polo007]

Read on Twitter

Read on Twitter

[Cyrus]

The AAV isn't high, but that's a lot of years for a guy with some injury risk.

That's a very cheap deal for Kluber. Even coming off an injury-plagued season and with just one year + a vesting option (needs 160 IP in 2020) remaining, a good relief prospect and a fringy fourth OF is nothing.

I'm with you, not sure why we didn't go after him over say Tanner or in addition to him. The prospects seem marginal...and and any everyday outfielder, some like Hernandez and some b/c level prospect for a potential ace for 2years seems like good deal to me, and if he doesn't pan out, well the costs of 2 seasons isn't that much.

Vs. Say going after Price for 5 more years or whatever he has remaining on his contract, even if Boston eats a significant amount.

[polo007]

Read on Twitter

[BigLeagueChew]

The last playoff teams rotation wasn't really elite.

JA Happ trade from Astros, managed to fix him and give up very little.

Estrada for Lind.

Buerhle most durable pitcher at average numbers.

Dickey - coming off cy young in his mid 30s, ate innings but didn't return to "cy young" form

Johnson - damaged goods

Stroman/Sanchez - above average for the most part when healthy

[The_Hater]

The last playoff teams rotation wasn't really elite.

JA Happ trade from Astros, managed to fix him and give up very little.

Estrada for Lind.

Buerhle most durable pitcher at average numbers.

Dickey - coming off cy young in his mid 30s, ate innings but didn't return to "cy young" form

Johnson - damaged goods

Stroman/Sanchez - above average for the most part when healthy

Buerhle was on the 1st playoff team with Price, who did pitch like an ace for the 2 months we had him. Not to mention he replaced Drew Hutchison in the rotation, who was awful.

The 2nd team traded for Liriano which gave us Estrada, Happ, Sanchez, Liriano, Stroman and Dickey. Stroman and Dickey were around league average SP’s and the other 4 were well above that level. Even without an ace, as a group they were quite strong which of course if great for the regular season but not as ideal in the playoffs.