Blue Jays @ Dodgers Aug 8-10 - Tonight Bassitt vs Snell @ 9pm

[JCP11]

Man that Dodgers squad is loaded, when you can send Glasgow, Snell, Yamamoto, Kershaw and Othani to the mound you're living right. Then on offense you send all stars after all stars in Othani, Betts, Freeman, Smith and Teo it's almost not fair. Oh and Tanner Scott was injured. I wanted to be mad after the first 2 loses but let's be real blue Jays are a good team but not on Dodgers level. To beat these guys in the WS we would need Vladdy, Bo, springer and Santander (somehow) on fire vs the best pitching staff in the majors, tough task. I'm not sure we have the pitching staff to go toe to toe with then. Kudos for not quitting and fighting vs the champs, this is all we can ask for.

This is not the nba. Dodgers will probably not even make it to the world series.

It doesn't take away from the amount of talent they have. We saw it in display in this series. They're not having the season they had last year but I don't see why they couldn't make it back to the WS. They're in the mix with Phillies, Brewers and Cubs. NL is loaded this year

[dagger]

Duran, bednar, mason miller, Helsley it’s okay no need we got Jeff Hoffman.

The guy I wish we really could have had is Duran. I heard the Jays were close on him, but it did not transpire in the end. You look at the two prospects the Phillies gave up for Duran, and you shake your head why the Jays could not have matched that. They were not even the Phillies two top prospects. I seen Duran a couple of times this past week closing games for the Phillies, and the guy has been Lights Out. Confident, and looks and acts like a Closer. He has a swagger on the mound and has poise. He does not look like a nervous wreck like Hoffman, who likes to play around and hope the opposing hitter chases his bad pitches.

Nervous Wreck Hoffman is inclined to put runners on base and walk them, when things get dicey. Duran is the opposite of Hoffman. You see how Duran has re-energized the Phillies fanbase, and the confidence he gives the whole team when he comes on the mound. The opposite of Nervous Wreck Hoffman, who gives me Romano vibes after his great April. Right now, I have no faith in Hoffman closing games in October. Maybe it is the work load, but the Phillies GM was not wrong when he said earlier in the year he was not willing to meet the price tag of Hoffman who has never been a full-time closer before this year. Duran is also making only about 4 million this year and still has two more years of control left, compared to the 11 million a year for Hoffman. Brilliant move by Philadelphia, which I had hoped the Jays would have made. Hoffman then could have been a 7th or 8th inning guy again like he was last year in Philadelphia, and also occasionally closing when Duran was unavailable. But the brilliant front office thought they did not need another Closer like Duran.

They were still top 100 prospects. You also don't know how the Twins valued each teams' prospects. The ask very likely would have been at least one of Yesavage or Nimmala possibly even both depending on how the Twins viewed them.

While the Jays' farm system is better than last year, it's fair to say that it has fewer impact prospects than some other contenders, and so a lower pain threshold when it comes to trading high end arms and bats for the best talent on the trade market.

[-MetA4-]

Duran, bednar, mason miller, Helsley it’s okay no need we got Jeff Hoffman.

Are you ever not whining or crying?

Helsley hasn't even been good since the trade LMFAO (5 runs surrendered, 3 of which were earned in just 4 innings). Bednar has been OK, but has already blown one game.

Next time at least spend 2 minutes and look up what the players you are trying to reference are doing. Don't be lazy.

[Boogie!]

Duran, bednar, mason miller, Helsley it’s okay no need we got Jeff Hoffman.

Are you ever not whining or crying?

Helsley hasn't even been good since the trade LMFAO (5 runs surrendered, 3 of which were earned in just 4 innings). Bednar has been OK, but has already blown one game.

Next time at least spend 2 minutes and look up what the players you are trying to reference are doing. Don't be lazy.

You talk a lot of **** for someone that is barely here. Do you even watch jays games? Are you another one of these number cruncher fans. Seems like you know nothing about baseball other than stats.

[-MetA4-]

Duran, bednar, mason miller, Helsley it’s okay no need we got Jeff Hoffman.

The guy I wish we really could have had is Duran. I heard the Jays were close on him, but it did not transpire in the end. You look at the two prospects the Phillies gave up for Duran, and you shake your head why the Jays could not have matched that. They were not even the Phillies two top prospects. I seen Duran a couple of times this past week closing games for the Phillies, and the guy has been Lights Out. Confident, and looks and acts like a Closer. He has a swagger on the mound and has poise. He does not look like a nervous wreck like Hoffman, who likes to play around and hope the opposing hitter chases his bad pitches.

Nervous Wreck Hoffman is inclined to put runners on base and walk them, when things get dicey. Duran is the opposite of Hoffman. You see how Duran has re-energized the Phillies fanbase, and the confidence he gives the whole team when he comes on the mound. The opposite of Nervous Wreck Hoffman, who gives me Romano vibes after his great April. Right now, I have no faith in Hoffman closing games in October. Maybe it is the work load, but the Phillies GM was not wrong when he said earlier in the year he was not willing to meet the price tag of Hoffman who has never been a full-time closer before this year. Duran is also making only about 4 million this year and still has two more years of control left, compared to the 11 million a year for Hoffman. Brilliant move by Philadelphia, which I had hoped the Jays would have made. Hoffman then could have been a 7th or 8th inning guy again like he was last year in Philadelphia, and also occasionally closing when Duran was unavailable. But the brilliant front office thought they did not need another Closer like Duran.

Homie, Duran has pitched 4 innings for the Phillies. He is a very good pitcher, but 4 innings is 4 innings.

In his final 6 appearances with the Twins he allowed a run in 3 of them and had a 5.14 ERA over those 7 innings. If this was his stat-line with the Jays, you would be on here waxing poetic about how he shouldn't be closing and how he can't be trusted.

So this is not some perfect pitcher that will throw shutout after shutout for the remainder of the season. If he was so perfect and infallible, he wouldn't have sucked over his final 6 appearances with the Twins, now would he?

I love these grand conclusions over small sample sizes. Do you guys want to see a really fun one?

Ty France post trade: 161 wRC+
Eugenio Suarez post trade: -1 wRC+

What 4D Chess by our amazing, magnanimous front office to not trade for overrated Eugenio Suarez who is a nervous wreck and can't handle pressure, and to instead acquirer Ty "Cobb" France!

[-MetA4-]

You talk a lot of **** for someone that is barely here. Do you even watch jays games? Are you another one of these number cruncher fans. Seems like you know nothing about baseball other than stats.

Well, at least you tried

I've been posting on here longer than you have, boy. I should get an honorary PhD given how much free baseball schooling I've provided to you bozos. You are hopeless.

Have you done your homework yet and looked up Helsley's performances with the Mets?

[Boogie!]

You talk a lot of **** for someone that is barely here. Do you even watch jays games? Are you another one of these number cruncher fans. Seems like you know nothing about baseball other than stats.

Well, at least you tried

I've been posting on here longer than you have, boy. I should get an honorary PhD given how much free baseball schooling I've provided to you bozos. You are hopeless.

Have you done your homework yet and looked up Helsley's performances with the Mets?

I don’t need baseball schooling. I’m not your boy and you better at least be over 40 to be getting away with talking like that.

[PushDaRock]

You talk a lot of **** for someone that is barely here. Do you even watch jays games? Are you another one of these number cruncher fans. Seems like you know nothing about baseball other than stats.

Well, at least you tried

I've been posting on here longer than you have, boy. I should get an honorary PhD given how much free baseball schooling I've provided to you bozos. You are hopeless.

Have you done your homework yet and looked up Helsley's performances with the Mets?

I don’t need baseball schooling. I’m not your boy and you better at least be over 40 to be getting away with talking like that.

damn, both of you must have broke out the keyboards for this!!!

[Mehar]

Duran, bednar, mason miller, Helsley it’s okay no need we got Jeff Hoffman.

The guy I wish we really could have had is Duran. I heard the Jays were close on him, but it did not transpire in the end. You look at the two prospects the Phillies gave up for Duran, and you shake your head why the Jays could not have matched that. They were not even the Phillies two top prospects. I seen Duran a couple of times this past week closing games for the Phillies, and the guy has been Lights Out. Confident, and looks and acts like a Closer. He has a swagger on the mound and has poise. He does not look like a nervous wreck like Hoffman, who likes to play around and hope the opposing hitter chases his bad pitches.

Nervous Wreck Hoffman is inclined to put runners on base and walk them, when things get dicey. Duran is the opposite of Hoffman. You see how Duran has re-energized the Phillies fanbase, and the confidence he gives the whole team when he comes on the mound. The opposite of Nervous Wreck Hoffman, who gives me Romano vibes after his great April. Right now, I have no faith in Hoffman closing games in October. Maybe it is the work load, but the Phillies GM was not wrong when he said earlier in the year he was not willing to meet the price tag of Hoffman who has never been a full-time closer before this year. Duran is also making only about 4 million this year and still has two more years of control left, compared to the 11 million a year for Hoffman. Brilliant move by Philadelphia, which I had hoped the Jays would have made. Hoffman then could have been a 7th or 8th inning guy again like he was last year in Philadelphia, and also occasionally closing when Duran was unavailable. But the brilliant front office thought they did not need another Closer like Duran.

Homie, Duran has pitched 4 innings for the Phillies. He is a very good pitcher, but 4 innings is 4 innings.

In his final 6 appearances with the Twins he allowed a run in 3 of them and had a 5.14 ERA over those 7 innings. If this was his stat-line with the Jays, you would be on here waxing poetic about how he shouldn't be closing and how he can't be trusted.

So this is not some perfect pitcher that will throw shutout after shutout for the remainder of the season. If he was so perfect and infallible, he wouldn't have sucked over his final 6 appearances with the Twins, now would he?

I love these grand conclusions over small sample sizes. Do you guys want to see a really fun one?

Ty France post trade: 161 wRC+
Eugenio Suarez post trade: -1 wRC+

What 4D Chess by our amazing, magnanimous front office to not trade for overrated Eugenio Suarez who is a nervous wreck and can't handle pressure, and to instead acquirer Ty "Cobb" France!

First of all Homie- I am looking at all of Duran's stats for the whole year and the guy has been elite and on a different level than Hoffman. I expect no pitcher to throw shutout after shutout. You talk about Duran's final 6 appearances in Minnesota, but only two of them were not great. One of the rough ones was when he pitched two innings. The other one was result of his garbage defense behind him. With a real team behind him now, and defense is not a concern. You might be comfortable with Hoffman as the Closer, but after his first month I am not.

Of course I do not expect a pitcher to throw shutout after shut out, but I also do not want my Closer to be a nervous wreck on the mound and not trust his stuff. To the point where he is comfortable giving walks to bottom of the order hitters on a regular basis like Hoffman is. Duran is on a different level than Hoffman, and it is funny you cherry pick a couple of not so great outings but disregard what Duran has done for the year. You might be satisfied with Hoffman as the Closer, but I am not. That is why this front office should have acquired another Closer at the deadline, but they thought otherwise. I hope Hoffman can be the guy he was again in April. Maybe it is the workload, but his command is nowhere it was the first month on a consistent basis. Hopefully, he can turn it around going forward.

[Boogie!]

The guy I wish we really could have had is Duran. I heard the Jays were close on him, but it did not transpire in the end. You look at the two prospects the Phillies gave up for Duran, and you shake your head why the Jays could not have matched that. They were not even the Phillies two top prospects. I seen Duran a couple of times this past week closing games for the Phillies, and the guy has been Lights Out. Confident, and looks and acts like a Closer. He has a swagger on the mound and has poise. He does not look like a nervous wreck like Hoffman, who likes to play around and hope the opposing hitter chases his bad pitches.

Nervous Wreck Hoffman is inclined to put runners on base and walk them, when things get dicey. Duran is the opposite of Hoffman. You see how Duran has re-energized the Phillies fanbase, and the confidence he gives the whole team when he comes on the mound. The opposite of Nervous Wreck Hoffman, who gives me Romano vibes after his great April. Right now, I have no faith in Hoffman closing games in October. Maybe it is the work load, but the Phillies GM was not wrong when he said earlier in the year he was not willing to meet the price tag of Hoffman who has never been a full-time closer before this year. Duran is also making only about 4 million this year and still has two more years of control left, compared to the 11 million a year for Hoffman. Brilliant move by Philadelphia, which I had hoped the Jays would have made. Hoffman then could have been a 7th or 8th inning guy again like he was last year in Philadelphia, and also occasionally closing when Duran was unavailable. But the brilliant front office thought they did not need another Closer like Duran.

Homie, Duran has pitched 4 innings for the Phillies. He is a very good pitcher, but 4 innings is 4 innings.

In his final 6 appearances with the Twins he allowed a run in 3 of them and had a 5.14 ERA over those 7 innings. If this was his stat-line with the Jays, you would be on here waxing poetic about how he shouldn't be closing and how he can't be trusted.

So this is not some perfect pitcher that will throw shutout after shutout for the remainder of the season. If he was so perfect and infallible, he wouldn't have sucked over his final 6 appearances with the Twins, now would he?

I love these grand conclusions over small sample sizes. Do you guys want to see a really fun one?

Ty France post trade: 161 wRC+
Eugenio Suarez post trade: -1 wRC+

What 4D Chess by our amazing, magnanimous front office to not trade for overrated Eugenio Suarez who is a nervous wreck and can't handle pressure, and to instead acquirer Ty "Cobb" France!

First of all Homie- I am looking at all of Duran's stats for the whole year and the guy has been elite and on a different level than Hoffman. I expect no pitcher to throw shutout after shutout. You talk about Duran's final 6 appearances in Minnesota, but only two of them were not great. One of the rough ones was when he pitched two innings. The other one was result of his garbage defense behind him. With a real team behind him now, and defense is not a concern. You might be comfortable with Hoffman as the Closer, but after his first month I am not.

Of course I do not expect a pitcher to throw shutout after shut out, but I also do not want my Closer to be a nervous wreck on the mound and not trust his stuff. To the point where he is comfortable giving walks to bottom of the order hitters on a regular basis like Hoffman is. Duran is on a different level than Hoffman, and it is funny you cherry pick a couple of not so great outings but disregard what Duran has done for the year. You might be satisfied with Hoffman as the Closer, but I am not. That is why this front office should have acquired another Closer at the deadline, but they thought otherwise. I hope Hoffman can be the guy he was again in April. Maybe it is the workload, but his command is nowhere it was the first month on a consistent basis. Hopefully, he can turn it around going forward.

hoffman has the highest HR/9 since he became a full time reliever. again, this reminds me of the romano situation when I would call him blowmano and people would get mad and use stats to back up how awesome he was. then lo and behold in an important wild card game he blows a 7 run lead.

when hoffman was killing it in April, I was the first one to say how awesome I thought he was and how we a step up from Romano with his composure and his pitch selection and ability to throw strikes. I was so excited talking about how finally we had a closer we could trust. Like you said, I didn't expect him to save every game, that isn't realistic, but what we are seeing now, and what we've seen for a large portion of the season is not the same Hoffman.

[Mehar]

Homie, Duran has pitched 4 innings for the Phillies. He is a very good pitcher, but 4 innings is 4 innings.

In his final 6 appearances with the Twins he allowed a run in 3 of them and had a 5.14 ERA over those 7 innings. If this was his stat-line with the Jays, you would be on here waxing poetic about how he shouldn't be closing and how he can't be trusted.

So this is not some perfect pitcher that will throw shutout after shutout for the remainder of the season. If he was so perfect and infallible, he wouldn't have sucked over his final 6 appearances with the Twins, now would he?

I love these grand conclusions over small sample sizes. Do you guys want to see a really fun one?

Ty France post trade: 161 wRC+
Eugenio Suarez post trade: -1 wRC+

What 4D Chess by our amazing, magnanimous front office to not trade for overrated Eugenio Suarez who is a nervous wreck and can't handle pressure, and to instead acquirer Ty "Cobb" France!

First of all Homie- I am looking at all of Duran's stats for the whole year and the guy has been elite and on a different level than Hoffman. I expect no pitcher to throw shutout after shutout. You talk about Duran's final 6 appearances in Minnesota, but only two of them were not great. One of the rough ones was when he pitched two innings. The other one was result of his garbage defense behind him. With a real team behind him now, and defense is not a concern. You might be comfortable with Hoffman as the Closer, but after his first month I am not.

Of course I do not expect a pitcher to throw shutout after shut out, but I also do not want my Closer to be a nervous wreck on the mound and not trust his stuff. To the point where he is comfortable giving walks to bottom of the order hitters on a regular basis like Hoffman is. Duran is on a different level than Hoffman, and it is funny you cherry pick a couple of not so great outings but disregard what Duran has done for the year. You might be satisfied with Hoffman as the Closer, but I am not. That is why this front office should have acquired another Closer at the deadline, but they thought otherwise. I hope Hoffman can be the guy he was again in April. Maybe it is the workload, but his command is nowhere it was the first month on a consistent basis. Hopefully, he can turn it around going forward.

hoffman has the highest HR/9 since he became a full time reliever. again, this reminds me of the romano situation when I would call him blowmano and people would get mad and use stats to back up how awesome he was. then lo and behold in an important wild card game he blows a 7 run lead.

when hoffman was killing it in April, I was the first one to say how awesome I thought he was and how we a step up from Romano with his composure and his pitch selection and ability to throw strikes. I was so excited talking about how finally we had a closer we could trust. Like you said, I didn't expect him to save every game, that isn't realistic, but what we are seeing now, and what we've seen for a large portion of the season is not the same Hoffman.

Not to mention the hard hit contact Hoffman has allowed all year in the games he has pitched, and if it was not for the great defense of guys like Straw behind him- some of those Saves Hoffman was credited for could have easily been Blown Saves. Looking back, the Phillies GM Dave Dombrowski was correct to say in Spring Training that he was not comfortable paying the money Hoffman got by the Jays, because he had never been a full-time Closer for an entire year.

Now the Phillies got arguably one of the best Closers in the Game making over 4 million a year with two years of control after this season. Well done Phillies. Hopefully Hoffman could figure it out, stop being a nervous wreck at times, stop giving everyone Romano vibes, trust his stuff more and be the guy he was for the first month of the year again.

[vaff87]

Homie, Duran has pitched 4 innings for the Phillies. He is a very good pitcher, but 4 innings is 4 innings.

In his final 6 appearances with the Twins he allowed a run in 3 of them and had a 5.14 ERA over those 7 innings. If this was his stat-line with the Jays, you would be on here waxing poetic about how he shouldn't be closing and how he can't be trusted.

So this is not some perfect pitcher that will throw shutout after shutout for the remainder of the season. If he was so perfect and infallible, he wouldn't have sucked over his final 6 appearances with the Twins, now would he?

I love these grand conclusions over small sample sizes. Do you guys want to see a really fun one?

Ty France post trade: 161 wRC+
Eugenio Suarez post trade: -1 wRC+

What 4D Chess by our amazing, magnanimous front office to not trade for overrated Eugenio Suarez who is a nervous wreck and can't handle pressure, and to instead acquirer Ty "Cobb" France!

First of all Homie- I am looking at all of Duran's stats for the whole year and the guy has been elite and on a different level than Hoffman. I expect no pitcher to throw shutout after shutout. You talk about Duran's final 6 appearances in Minnesota, but only two of them were not great. One of the rough ones was when he pitched two innings. The other one was result of his garbage defense behind him. With a real team behind him now, and defense is not a concern. You might be comfortable with Hoffman as the Closer, but after his first month I am not.

Of course I do not expect a pitcher to throw shutout after shut out, but I also do not want my Closer to be a nervous wreck on the mound and not trust his stuff. To the point where he is comfortable giving walks to bottom of the order hitters on a regular basis like Hoffman is. Duran is on a different level than Hoffman, and it is funny you cherry pick a couple of not so great outings but disregard what Duran has done for the year. You might be satisfied with Hoffman as the Closer, but I am not. That is why this front office should have acquired another Closer at the deadline, but they thought otherwise. I hope Hoffman can be the guy he was again in April. Maybe it is the workload, but his command is nowhere it was the first month on a consistent basis. Hopefully, he can turn it around going forward.

hoffman has the highest HR/9 since he became a full time reliever. again, this reminds me of the romano situation when I would call him blowmano and people would get mad and use stats to back up how awesome he was. then lo and behold in an important wild card game he blows a 7 run lead.

when hoffman was killing it in April, I was the first one to say how awesome I thought he was and how we a step up from Romano with his composure and his pitch selection and ability to throw strikes. I was so excited talking about how finally we had a closer we could trust. Like you said, I didn't expect him to save every game, that isn't realistic, but what we are seeing now, and what we've seen for a large portion of the season is not the same Hoffman.

Tbh, over the last 4 years, only this year Hoffman has had a concerning HR/9 rate, which corresponds with a huge increase in HR/FB%

2022 (in Cincinnati) - 44.2 inn 5 HR 1.01 HR/9 7.5% HR/FB
2023 (in Philadelphia) - 52.1 inn 3 HR 0.52 HR/9 6.7% HR/FB
2024 - 66.1 inn 6 HR 0.81 HR/9 9.4% HR/FB
2025 (Jays, obviously) - 48 inn 10 HR 1.88 HR/9 20% HR/FB