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Blue Jays are all in with R.A. Dickey trade
Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 2:29 am
by polo007
http://sports.nationalpost.com/2012/12/ ... key-trade/
The Toronto Blue Jays cannot control what happens when the season starts, but they can hope. R.A. Dickey is 38, and he won the National League Cy Young in 2012, and the Jays are very close to trading for him. If Toronto can agree on a contract extension with the warrior poet of baseball — and the sense is that it won’t be a problem — they will send two of their top three remaining prospects to the New York Mets, swap backup catchers and warm bodies, and hope not to look back. It will be a bold move.
But it will be a reasonable gamble, and that’s what matters. Yes, it will pain general manager Alex Anthopoulos to send catcher Travis d’Arnaud and pitcher Noah Syndergaard — No. 1 and No. 3 in their minor-league system, if you believe Baseball America — for Dickey. The rest of the deal sends backup catcher John Buck and a warm body for Dickey’s personal catcher, Josh Thole, and a different warm body, but the prospects make it go. It will be a steep price, plus the extension. This isn’t a heist. The Mets aren’t the Marlins.
But that is where the Jays are. This is what they are. They are not waiting for players to develop anymore, for the crop to come in. They added US$166-million in contract commitments when they raided Miami for Jose Reyes, Josh Johnson, and Mark Buehrle, and that’s before a Johnson extension is discussed. They threw another US$16-million at Melky Cabrera. Dickey is 38 years old, but he’s great right now. Now, to Toronto, is what matters.
And if it didn’t, then they would be going the other way. They would be trading Jose Bautista (32) or Buehrle (33). They would be restocking the minor leagues, rather than using them as currency. At this point, the Jays are either in or they’re out, and clearly they’re in. D’Arnaud and Syndergaard might be good major leaguers, but it won’t be this year, and it might not be next year. Next year, they don’t help.
Dickey does. The deal hinges on him, obviously, and if his knuckler loses its fairy dust then it’s a bust, and Anthopoulos will get killed for chasing the wrong guy. That’s fine.
But Dickey’s magic seems replicable, which means the rotation could go Dickey, Johnson, Brandon Morrow, Buehrle, and Ricky Romero. Dickey doesn’t throw Tim Wakefield’s 66 mph floater; his knuckler doesn’t bob and float and dance in the traditional way. He throws a fast one and a slow one, and he mixes in fastballs for effect, and his pitches aren’t mere objects of faith, even though he’s a religious man. He threw four wild pitches last year, and his walk rate is low and steady. He appears to have unlocked something, and it’s only gotten better.
Re: Blue Jays are all in with R.A. Dickey trade
Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 2:31 am
by Randle McMurphy
Komodo wrote:Can someone correct anything that's wrong? I'm trying to keep track of all the players in a word document.
5 Starting Pitchers
1. Dickey
2. Johnson
3. Morrow
4. Buerhle
5. Romero
7 Relief Pitchers
1. Janssen
2. Delabar
3. Lincoln
4. Loup
5. Santos (injury?)
6. Happ (long man)
Oliver (retire?)
6 Infielders
1. Reyes (SS)
2. Lawrie (3B)
3. Encarnacion (DH/1B)
4. Bonifacio (2B/3B/SS/OF)
5. Izturis (2B)
6. Arencibia (C)
------------------------------
Bench. Lind (1B/DH)
Bench. Thole (C)
5 Outfielders
1. Bautista (RF)
2. Cabrera (LF)
3. Rasmus (CF)
4. Davis (OF)
5.
AAA Buffalo Bison Callups
Gose (OF)
Cooper (1B/DH)
Jenkins (SP)
Sierra (OF)
McCoy (INF)
Lineup
1. Reyes (SS)
2. Cabrera (LF)
3. Bautista (RF)
4. Encarnacion (1B)
5. Lawrie (3B)
6. Lind/Davis (DH)
7. Rasmus (CF)
8. Arencibia (C)
9. Izturis (2B)
You forgot Dustin McGowan on the DL.
Re: Blue Jays are all in with R.A. Dickey trade
Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 2:38 am
by engageTHEmasses
****double post****
Re: Blue Jays are all in with R.A. Dickey trade
Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 2:39 am
by engageTHEmasses
Randle McMurphy wrote:Komodo wrote:Can someone correct anything that's wrong? I'm trying to keep track of all the players in a word document.
5 Starting Pitchers
1. Dickey
2. Johnson
3. Morrow
4. Buerhle
5. Romero
7 Relief Pitchers
1. Janssen
2. Delabar
3. Lincoln
4. Loup
5. Santos (injury?)
6. Happ (long man)
Oliver (retire?)
6 Infielders
1. Reyes (SS)
2. Lawrie (3B)
3. Encarnacion (DH/1B)
4. Bonifacio (2B/3B/SS/OF)
5. Izturis (2B)
6. Arencibia (C)
------------------------------
Bench. Lind (1B/DH)
Bench. Thole (C)
5 Outfielders
1. Bautista (RF)
2. Cabrera (LF)
3. Rasmus (CF)
4. Davis (OF)
5.
AAA Buffalo Bison Callups
Gose (OF)
Cooper (1B/DH)
Jenkins (SP)
Sierra (OF)
McCoy (INF)
Lineup
1. Reyes (SS)
2. Cabrera (LF)
3. Bautista (RF)
4. Encarnacion (1B)
5. Lawrie (3B)
6. Lind/Davis (DH)
7. Rasmus (CF)
8. Arencibia (C)
9. Izturis (2B)
You forgot Dustin McGowan on the DL.
Rogers in the 'pen.
Hutch and Drabek due back sometime this year.
Re: Blue Jays are all in with R.A. Dickey trade
Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 2:41 am
by J-Roc
Surprise the Blue Jays in house sports network is pro the trade.
Re: Blue Jays are all in with R.A. Dickey trade
Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 2:47 am
by Tyrone Slothrop
Rosenthal's take:
http://msn.foxsports.com/mlb/story/toro ... now-121612Edit- Just saw it was posted in the other thread, but worth posting again
Re: Blue Jays are all in with R.A. Dickey trade
Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 2:57 am
by UN-Owen
"He's athletic"?
Dude looks like Kenny Powers
Re: Blue Jays are all in with R.A. Dickey trade
Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 3:05 am
by TheseSicklyKeys
J-Roc wrote:Surprise the Blue Jays in house sports network is pro the trade.
Actually that's also not surprise considering that most media and analysts seem to be calling it at least a fine deal for the Jays.
Re: Blue Jays are all in with R.A. Dickey trade
Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 3:06 am
by LittleOzzy
330 views in just over a 1/2 hour... I think this forum is in for a major increase of members next season.
Re: Blue Jays are all in with R.A. Dickey trade
Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 3:07 am
by spykelee
^^ I guess that's good...
Re: Blue Jays are all in with R.A. Dickey trade
Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 3:08 am
by zong
I'm holding my breath on that mystery third player from the Mets we are supposedly going to receive.
Should I be? or will that player not affect anything significant?
Re: Blue Jays are all in with R.A. Dickey trade
Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 3:08 am
by LittleOzzy
spykelee wrote:^^ I guess that's good...
Not necessarily, but it's going to happen either way.
A better team is going to bring over a lot of people from the Raptors forum.
Re: Blue Jays are all in with R.A. Dickey trade
Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 3:09 am
by Tyrone Slothrop
spykelee wrote:^^ I guess that's good...
Judging from the previous thread, I'm going to go with "No"
Re: Blue Jays are all in with R.A. Dickey trade
Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 3:11 am
by spykelee
LittleOzzy wrote:spykelee wrote:^^ I guess that's good...
Not necessarily, but it's going to happen either way.
A better team is going to bring over a lot of people from the Raptors forum.
Ugh, don't remind me.
Re: Blue Jays are all in with R.A. Dickey trade
Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 3:13 am
by DreamTeam09
That article by Ken Rosenthal made me understand this trade a little better. I get the point ppl were saying about gutting the farm system for a 38yr old, but if that's the player you think will take you over the top then I understand and i'm all for it. TDA has had several injuries and its not like JPA is a slouch anyway. The pitcher is like 3yrs away b4 sniffing the majors according to the article meanwhile dickey is cy young winner as of last yr. 200inngs 3yrs straight, that's more than solid. This team prolly has a 3yr window, i'm sure AA can find another out-of-this-world prospect by then.
Re: Blue Jays are all in with R.A. Dickey trade
Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 3:14 am
by Tyrone Slothrop
zong wrote:I'm holding my breath on that mystery third player from the Mets we are supposedly going to receive.
Should I be? or will that player not affect anything significant?
I'm not familiar with the Mets system beyond their top couple of guys, but I would say best case scenario is a high ceiling player who hasn't played beyond low A or a AAAA starting pitcher who's better than Chad Jenkins and can be insurance in case of injury
Re: Blue Jays are all in with R.A. Dickey trade
Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 3:14 am
by Randle McMurphy
Tyrone Slothrop wrote:spykelee wrote:^^ I guess that's good...
Judging from the previous thread, I'm going to go with "No"
Good for the health and strength of the franchise, bad for the level of the discourse around here and other Jays places on the net.
Re: Blue Jays are all in with R.A. Dickey trade
Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 3:21 am
by The_Hater
DreamTeam09 wrote:That article by Ken Rosenthal made me understand this trade a little better. I get the point ppl were saying about gutting the farm system for a 38yr old, but if that's the player you think will take you over the top then I understand and i'm all for it. TDA has had several injuries and its not like JPA is a slouch anyway. The pitcher is like 3yrs away b4 sniffing the majors according to the article meanwhile dickey is cy young winner as of last yr. 200inngs 3yrs straight, that's more than solid. This team prolly has a 3yr window, i'm sure AA can find another out-of-this-world prospect by then.
The trade can be a poor value trade but still logically be the right thing to do. That's the way I view the deal.
Re: Blue Jays are all in with R.A. Dickey trade
Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 3:33 am
by Tyrone Slothrop
Re: Blue Jays are all in with R.A. Dickey trade
Posted: Mon Dec 17, 2012 3:36 am
by DreamTeam09
The_Hater wrote:DreamTeam09 wrote:That article by Ken Rosenthal made me understand this trade a little better. I get the point ppl were saying about gutting the farm system for a 38yr old, but if that's the player you think will take you over the top then I understand and i'm all for it. TDA has had several injuries and its not like JPA is a slouch anyway. The pitcher is like 3yrs away b4 sniffing the majors according to the article meanwhile dickey is cy young winner as of last yr. 200inngs 3yrs straight, that's more than solid. This team prolly has a 3yr window, i'm sure AA can find another out-of-this-world prospect by then.
The trade can be a poor value trade but still logically be the right thing to do. That's the way I view the deal.
True, I hear and agree with that statement... Why can't we get a prospect back of some value, are the mets playing hard ball?? The age factor is something AA should be pressing no?