RealGM

Send Dickey, Buhrle, Reyes, etc. to the highest bidders. Agree or disagree?

No. Maybe during the off season if we don't make the playoffs but we shouldn't be sellers right now and give up trying to win.

If you're going to trade all those guys, you should trade Bautista and Encarnacion too. But you're not.

Randle McMurphy wrote:If you're going to trade all those guys, you should trade Bautista and Encarnacion too. But you're not.

Not necessarily. You can still keep both and compete next year with a younger rotation. Everyone else would not be untouchable though.

Agreed on Reyes. Jettison him now while he still holds some value, if possible.

I'd hold off on the other guys (including Bautista and Encarnacion) unless we're 7+ games out at the deadline, which the way things are going is a distinct possibility. Get positional prospects in AA and AAA ball to complement our young arms and go for a quick rebuild. And all of this should be managed by another GM, it goes without saying.

as long as they are one or the other, i am happy. if theyre sellers go all out though(including bautista and EE) and get good prospects.

Tough to sell high on Dickey/Buerhle at the moment

I'd rather see the season through. As bad as we've played for over a month now, we're still not far out of first and right in the wild card race. Its not like were in the basement right now

The offseason will be the time to decide what to do

zong wrote:Tough to sell high on Dickey/Buerhle at the moment

Not sure about Buerhle. We might have to eat some salary, but on his current pitching, I'd say we'd get something decent for him. But you don't really deal him if and until there is a plan for a somewhat broader restructuring.

Dan2087 wrote:I'd rather see the season through. As bad as we've played for over a month now, we're still not far out of first and right in the wild card race. Its not like were in the basement right now

The offseason will be the time to decide what to do

Agree. Let the season play out. They are only one game out, and nobody is running away with the division. However- If this team is not playing meaningful ball games in September- this organization needs to be cleaned out from top to bottom, and guys like Bautista, Reyes, Dickey, Beurhle, need all to be to traded. I wanted AA out the door last winter, but i thought he deserved one more year. This is it for him. This is his 5th year in charge of this team, and even the AA apologists on this board will agree that this should be his last year if the team does not play meaningful baseball in September.

Santoki wrote:

Randle McMurphy wrote:If you're going to trade all those guys, you should trade Bautista and Encarnacion too. But you're not.

Not necessarily. You can still keep both and compete next year with a younger rotation. Everyone else would be untouchable though.

Agreed. If the Jays can trade Reyes, Dickey, and Buehrle (for example) to not only save money for next season but also fill glaring holes in the roster, then it could be done and the team could compete next year by keeping the core guys (Bautista/Encarnacion). They would have to reallocate the saved money though, and with Rogers, that's never a sure thing.

Prior to McCarthy being traded, I was thinking of possible trade scenarios, and one I had in mind was trading Dickey to the Mariners for Nick Franklin and a prospect, and then sending the prospect to the D-Backs for McCarthy. So in essence, the Jays would have replaced Dickey with McCarthy for 2014 and plugged Franklin into 2B for the next five years. Saved money, filled a hole, and potentially upgraded a lateral move depending on what you thought the difference between Dickey and McCarthy was. Those are the types of deals the Jays should be trying. Of course, they won't, as this organization seems to have a boom or bust mentality ("we tried for one year, it didn't work, now let's do nothing").

Santoki wrote:

Randle McMurphy wrote:If you're going to trade all those guys, you should trade Bautista and Encarnacion too. But you're not.

Not necessarily. You can still keep both and compete next year with a younger rotation. Everyone else would not be untouchable though.

Rest of the team wouldn't be good enough to contend (as I don't expect any further spending from Rogers after another failed season). Don't see it happening.

Randle McMurphy wrote:

Santoki wrote:

Randle McMurphy wrote:If you're going to trade all those guys, you should trade Bautista and Encarnacion too. But you're not.

Not necessarily. You can still keep both and compete next year with a younger rotation. Everyone else would not be untouchable though.

Rest of the team wouldn't be good enough to contend (as I don't expect any further spending from Rogers after another failed season). Don't see it happening.

Melky, Lawrie, Rasmus, EE, and Bautista along with a young, cheap rotation is about as good as we're going to get for a long time. You have 3-4 other holes to fill but I'd rather attempt to fill them one more time before giving up on two of the best hitters in baseball. I don't know if Rogers will be on board for that of course, so this could all be moot.

Santoki wrote:

Randle McMurphy wrote:

Santoki wrote:
Not necessarily. You can still keep both and compete next year with a younger rotation. Everyone else would not be untouchable though.

Rest of the team wouldn't be good enough to contend (as I don't expect any further spending from Rogers after another failed season). Don't see it happening.

Melky, Lawrie, Rasmus, EE, and Bautista along with a young, cheap rotation is about as good as we're going to get for a long time. You have 3-4 other holes to fill but I'd rather attempt to fill them one more time before giving up on two of the best hitters in baseball. I don't know if Rogers will be on board for that of course, so this could all be moot.

It's a near certainty that Rasmus won't be on the team next year. Melky may not be either if his cost is too much for Rogers as well.

Reading this thread is making me highly depressed.


Here's to another 20 years with no playoffs

Randle McMurphy wrote:If you're going to trade all those guys, you should trade Bautista and Encarnacion too. But you're not.

At this point I think they need to blow it up for real and trade those guys. They just aren't good enough and have too many holes. Load up on as many prospects as you can and go from there. AA tried his best, but it just didn't happen.

Doesn't matter, they won't get you anything.

I'm not concerned with Salary, this is frickin MLB...I evaluate the players.

Whatever they are worth is not my concern, we should spend with all the big boys, our owners have the god damned money.

The Jays should not trade Bautista and Encarnacion, unless they are getting Greg Polanco type talent. Those two are cheap and still elite players. Find a way to shed replaceable salary and try again next year, assuming Rogers doesn't mandate another rebuild.

If they could turn Dickey, Reyes, and Buehrle into a combination of salary relief and cost effective solutions (preferably in the middle infield), then there is a chance to compete next year assuming the saved money can be reallocated on talent. I'd rather they take that approach. Rogers does not have the patience to rebuild properly, and developing talent like Bautista and Encarnacion again is going to be near impossible.

chargerxthirty wrote:I'm not concerned with Salary, this is frickin MLB...I evaluate the players.

Whatever they are worth is not my concern, we should spend with all the big boys, our owners have the god damned money.

This. There is no reason for Toronto to be sellers and start a rebuild. We are 2.5 games back just before the All Star game and striking distance of 1st in our division.

Look at the Yankees. When was the last time they sold their star players for prospects and started a rebuild? Boston the same. We should be spending. The owners of this team have the money. This is not Tampa, or Oakland.