RealGM

The loss is still very raw in my mind, and I'm sure in every one else's too. Let's use this thread to talk about the offseason.

Looking for a bit more positive and offseason outlook vibe in here. If you need to vent about the loss still, please use the game thread. If you need to vent about Varsho, use the Varsho thread. If you need to vent about IKF, open another thread lol.

Anyways, biggest offseason question will be what we do with Bo. Clearly his bat would be a huge piece to lose. In an ideal world, he resigns as a second basemen. But I'm sure there will be teams out there willing to offer him shortstop in order to get him.

The only really big decisions they have to make this off-season are Bichette and Bieber. I'd imagine both Bassitt and Scherzer would be willing to come back for similar or perhaps a little less than they each made last year.

If they aren't bringing Bichette back, they need to fill that spot with an impact player. But it doesn't necessarily have to be an infielder. You could have Gimenez at short, Barger/Clement at 3B, and Clement/Schneider at 2B. Actually, the more I look at this, the more I think they let Bichette go and chase a big outfield bat.

If they aren't bringing Bieber back, they'll obviously need to fill out the rotation. Gausman/Yesavage/Berrios is solid (yes, Berrios is solid) to start with. I'm not sure if Bieber's stuff plays in the AL East. I think you go outside the organization to sign a #3 type (ideally a LHP), bring back Bassitt to eat some innings, and hope guys like Tiedemann and Bloss can step up at some point to fill needs as necessary. And I wouldn't be against bringing Scherzer back if the number is right.

Ideally Springer will be healthy enough to play LF next year, pushing Santander to DH.

As much as I love Kirk, we have to realize his weight/lack of speed should always preclude him from being a cleanup hitter. The rally-killing double play ball is just too much of a risk.

The team needs to finally come to terms with the fact that Varsho is not a middle of the order bat, at least for the 75%-80% of the time he's ice cold. When he's got the power stroke going you can move him up, but personally I'd just leave him be in #7 or #8 hole all season.

The bullpen, when healthy, is in pretty decent shape. A lights out LHP would be nice, but not crucial.

As of now, I expect we see something like the following next year:

LF Springer
3B Barger
1B Guerrero Jr.
DH Santander
RF (off-season impact bat)
2B Clement
C Kirk
CF Varsho
SS Gimenez

Gausman
(off-season lefty)
Yesavage
Bassitt
Berrios

I''d also think that the situation with Bo will be influenced by how flexible he is willing to be on positioning, and what the organization thinks of the kids in the minors. They have invested heavily in infielders, and within a couple of years guys like Parker and Nimmala will arrive, and Clement and Barger will remain arb or pre-arb cheap for years. So while a long-term deal for Bo might look good in 2026, moving beyond that it might become hard to justify unless he's ready to become a full-time second baseman at some point. Even that might not be enough.

The same issue - contract flexibility - might also apply to the starters. The Jays have some top level pitching prospects and might not want to go out and sign multiple long-term free agents. I'm thinking Gage Stanifer might arrive in the second half of next season, also Ricky Tiedemann if he's healthy (yes, I know). Johnny King, as a teenager, is a couple of years away. The timing of Jake Bloss' surgery makes him unlikely for 2026 but a good bet for spring training 2027.

Re-sign Bo to a 8 million $200 million contract. He will eventually have to be moved to DH in a couple of years.

Let Varsho walk. Send him on a bus to a country far far away.

Sign Kyle Tucker to 5 years $150 type contract.

Re-sign Beiber for 5th starter type money

Bring back Clement, Barger

Your new lineup:
LF - Springer
1B - Vladdy
2B - Bichette
CF - Tucker
DH - Santander
RF - Barger
3B - Clement
C - Kirk
SS - Jimenez


Starting Pitchers:
- Gausman
- Yesavage
- Berrios
- ??
- Beiber

We have Varsho under club control for one more season.

JaysRule15 wrote:We have Varsho under club control for one more season.

**** Varsho.

GameChannel wrote:

JaysRule15 wrote:We have Varsho under club control for one more season.

**** Varsho.

He was great during the regular season but really sh*t the bed in WS

Man some of you really hate Varsho. I would bring him back, he's a crazy hard worker and is now 10x the player he was when Jays traded for him. His defense is needed and what he provided during the season and during some parts of the playoffs helped the team make it to game 7. All this team needs is Bichette back and Santander healthy and they are good offensively. The rest shouyld go to figure out the pitching.

JCP11 wrote:Man some of you really hate Varsho. I would bring him back, he's a crazy hard worker and is now 10x the player he was when Jays traded for him. His defense is needed and what he provided during the season and during some parts of the playoffs helped the team make it to game 7. All this team needs is Bichette back and Santander healthy and they are good offensively. The rest shouyld go to figure out the pitching.

Varsho is only good at catching flyballs. His arm is poor and the **** hasn’t improved at all as a hitter. That guy screams AAA. **** him.

Ranger Suarez is one guy I'd look at for pitching.

With Bo, would love to bring him back, and maybe with how things played out, he would be more open to be a 2B. Make him the highest paid 2B at a 25AAV contract, and I think both parties would be happy.

Curious to see what happens with Biebs, Bassit and Max.

Do we have enough trading chips to trade for Skubal?

I think the Dodgers formula of ramping up their pitchers and having them all healthy and ready for the postseason also works. However, they are lucky they get to play against the Diamondbacks and Colorado while they Jays are stuck with the Yankees, Red Sox, and the Rays.

Is there any interest in re-signing 1B Ty France?

JCP11 wrote:Man some of you really hate Varsho. I would bring him back, he's a crazy hard worker and is now 10x the player he was when Jays traded for him. His defense is needed and what he provided during the season and during some parts of the playoffs helped the team make it to game 7. All this team needs is Bichette back and Santander healthy and they are good offensively. The rest shouyld go to figure out the pitching.

It's really a strange way to vent against Varsho. He's a very flawed player and this FO assembled many such flawed players on this team. While many have called Varsho for costing us this WS (myself included in the heat of the moment), it was really the management who set the lineup order (Atkins+Schneider) who refused to slot Varsho lower that cost us the WS

dagger wrote:I''d also think that the situation with Bo will be influenced by how flexible he is willing to be on positioning, and what the organization thinks of the kids in the minors. They have invested heavily in infielders, and within a couple of years guys like Parker and Nimmala will arrive, and Clement and Barger will remain arb or pre-arb cheap for years. So while a long-term deal for Bo might look good in 2026, moving beyond that it might become hard to justify unless he's ready to become a full-time second baseman at some point. Even that might not be enough.

The same issue - contract flexibility - might also apply to the starters. The Jays have some top level pitching prospects and might not want to go out and sign multiple long-term free agents. I'm thinking Gage Stanifer might arrive in the second half of next season, also Ricky Tiedemann if he's healthy (yes, I know). Johnny King, as a teenager, is a couple of years away. The timing of Jake Bloss' surgery makes him unlikely for 2026 but a good bet for spring training 2027.

Very good summary. Yes I too believe that Shapiro / Atkins don't want Bo back, not at the money he is expecting as a starting SS. That's why they took on Gimenez's negative value contract.

They haven’t had any intention of bringing Bo back for a while now, I think. I’d be pretty surprised if that shifted especially with Barger-Gimenez-Clement-Vlad looking like a potential full-time infield next year. Even if you don’t buy Ernie as a hitter against RHP (and I don’t really), he was a top 5 defender in baseball this year. That guy has to start at his cost.

I think you try to replace Bo’s offense by adding an outfielder to take Lukes’ spot. Varsho, Springer, and Santander have their own spots in the order on lock.

Randle McMurphy wrote:They haven’t had any intention of bringing Bo back for a while now, I think. I’d be pretty surprised if that shifted especially with Barger-Gimenez-Clement-Vlad looking like a potential full-time infield next year. Even if you don’t buy Ernie as a hitter against RHP (and I don’t really), he was a top 5 defender in baseball this year. That guy has to start at his cost.

I think you try to replace Bo’s offense by adding an outfielder to take Lukes’ spot. Varsho, Springer, and Santander have their own spots in the order on lock.

FO will chase Bellinger or Tucker. They will take the RF baton from Springer after 1 year.

I would like to see another OF in the prototype of Steven Kwan - maybe himself

Randle McMurphy wrote:They haven’t had any intention of bringing Bo back for a while now, I think. I’d be pretty surprised if that shifted especially with Barger-Gimenez-Clement-Vlad looking like a potential full-time infield next year. Even if you don’t buy Ernie as a hitter against RHP (and I don’t really), he was a top 5 defender in baseball this year. That guy has to start at his cost.

I think you try to replace Bo’s offense by adding an outfielder to take Lukes’ spot. Varsho, Springer, and Santander have their own spots in the order on lock.

One of the really nice things about Ernie and Barger's versatility is that you have a few options when looking for a power bat. RF, 3B, or 2B all work and allow both Ernest and Addison to play.

scuervo1 wrote:Do we have enough trading chips to trade for Skubal?

Wouldnt that be amazing!

Morris_Shatford wrote:

scuervo1 wrote:Do we have enough trading chips to trade for Skubal?

Wouldnt that be amazing!

Skubal? That depends on how desperate Detroit is to trade him. There are deeper farm systems than the Jays. Heck, the Dodgers are one. The Yankees and Red Sox another two. And there are others. So I would think that if Detroit deals him, yes the Jays could cobble together a decent package but the winning offer might be more than the Jays feel like offering. The FA market for starting pitchers if deep, and the Jays can be financially competitive in that area without sacrificing more than a comp pick, rather than deal away prospects who have passed the bust threshold and look like future major leaguers.