Nene traded!!!

[no D in Hibachi]

Actually, McGee can finish with the best of them in PnR offense. He is a supreme dunker. He has a sky hook that is starting to get better. Occasionally, he has really nice post moves. Most of the time he's awkward and will plow over guys out of control. McGee is perplexing. The other day, he dominated the Spurs. He shot a nice floater that didn't look totally accidental, but I'm not sure.

Javale has more offensive ability than anything. It's his defense that you're going to wonder about IMO. He is a spectacular weak side shot blocker but his fundamentals are terrible on defense.

This is an analysis from the stat sheet. The Spurs game was a microcosm of his career in DC. All sizzle, no stake, all style, no substance. His actual contributions were completely detrimental to the team. His PnR defense on Parker was a the worst display of defensive effort/intelligence I've seen in a long time. Also, how about that play where Duncan lead the break and blew right past McGee who didn't even bother to alter or contest the shot. Oh, and his dominating effort helped the Wiz get blown out...how can anyone claim someone was truly dominate when their team got blown out?

[Maf]

request: Please, send here interview with Ujiri as soon as you find it. I mean why? Why the hell?

[Ruzious]

R.I.P. Denver

I don't know why, but that me laugh out loud.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

Actually, McGee can finish with the best of them in PnR offense. He is a supreme dunker. He has a sky hook that is starting to get better. Occasionally, he has really nice post moves. Most of the time he's awkward and will plow over guys out of control. McGee is perplexing. The other day, he dominated the Spurs. He shot a nice floater that didn't look totally accidental, but I'm not sure.

Javale has more offensive ability than anything. It's his defense that you're going to wonder about IMO. He is a spectacular weak side shot blocker but his fundamentals are terrible on defense.

This is an analysis from the stat sheet. The Spurs game was a microcosm of his career in DC. All sizzle, no stake, all style, no substance. His actual contributions were completely detrimental to the team. His PnR defense on Parker was a the worst display of defensive effort/intelligence I've seen in a long time. Also, how about that play where Duncan lead the break and blew right past McGee who didn't even bother to alter or contest the shot. Oh, and his dominating effort helped the Wiz get blown out...how can anyone claim someone was truly dominate when their team got blown out?

If you want to look at a stat that really shows what is going on, I suggest you look at Wins Produced and Points Produce. This shows what McGee did over 41 games.

http://www.nerdnumbers.com/splits?team= ... F14%2F2012

People like no D will tell you McGee is clueless and they will hit you with emotional reasoning, character assassination, and thoughts on how much money McGee will demand in the future.

What I will do is utilize the most objective assessment I know of that takes into account offensive efficiency, defensive efficiency, league norms by position; and quantifies them every game. I monitor things like PER, WS, WS/48, Ortg, Drtg on basketball-reference.com. I look at =/- on 82games.com. I look at hoopstats.com.

In addition to considering that body of evidence, then I subjectively say what I think.

Javale was one of the most productive Wizards. Like almost every former Wizard, he will prosper elsewhere. He is going to be a solid worker and a guy George Karl will praise. Most Wizard fans are as clueless as their GM. They call players knuckleheads but don't look at the bigger picture. Wall had 9 turnovers today. Jordan Crawford is jacking shots. Randy Wittman plays him more than Seraphin. They just traded for Nene before they even considered they had a defensive C, already.

McGee will be a fine player for you, particularly next to Faried.

[no D in Hibachi]

Its sooo rich when the unquestioned MOST emotional member from the Wiz board calls anyone's post emotional, but I'll rise above that. All my negative remarks of McGee were absolute fact with one exception, but that's what you focus on. Then with your smug, greater than thou tone, make it seem like you've substantially backed your stance that McGee is a budding star. Let's take a look at some of the most simplistic advanced stats, from the sites you mentioned, but curiously omitted from disclosing during your analysis.

1) Counterpart PER 22.0. That's right 22.0! For comparison's sake, Alonzo Mornings career PER was 21.2 and Patrick Ewing’s career PER was 21.0. Essentially every night McGee allowed the opposing center to play at a HOF level.
2) On/off per 100 possessions is -13.0. There is only one starter in the entire league who's on/off per 100 is worse--that's Aaron Afflalo who's on/off is -15.7. There are only two other players who are posting a worse on/off per 100 while averaging greater than 25% of the team’s minutes: Norris Cole, Big Baby Davis. Aside from these three players, NO other players are even in McGee's terrible on/off per 100 stratosphere. Not only that, but McGee's backups have been Andray Blatche, Jan Vesely, and Seraphin, who until 2 weeks ago many questioned whether he was a legit NBA caliber player.
3) McGee ranks 123 in the league TS% for all player averaging >10MPG. Considering 58% of his shots are dunks/tips/close shots, and he's 7'1'' with outstanding reach/explosivenss how can he be such a terrible shooter. Two reasons: 1) he has no understanding of what's a quality shot and just throws up junk too often, 2) his FT% is awful, which indicates lack of effort/concentration.

I could go on but it’s not worth the effort as it’s doubtful you’ll even acknowledge the fact that there are substantial hard facts clearly indicating McGee is an extremely poor player who has been a key contributing force of the Wizards losing culture.

[Rafael122]

Wiz fan here, if George Karl can't get something out of McGee, no one can. Karl is probably one of two coaches, maybe the other being Pop who could probably straighten him out. We'll see. Some posters think he's going to blow up, I mean he's averaging 11 and 8. Blowing up for me would be 19 and 11 or something of that nature and I don't think McGee has it in him.

He just so happens to be tall and can jump out of the building. Tyrus Thomas syndrome.

God speed and good luck.

[koogiking]

Its sooo rich when the unquestioned MOST emotional member from the Wiz board calls anyone's post emotional, but I'll rise above that. All my negative remarks of McGee were absolute fact with one exception, but that's what you focus on. Then with your smug, greater than thou tone, make it seem like you've substantially backed your stance that McGee is a budding star. Let's take a look at some of the most simplistic advanced stats, from the sites you mentioned, but curiously omitted from disclosing during your analysis.

1) Counterpart PER 22.0. That's right 22.0! For comparison's sake, Alonzo Mornings career PER was 21.2 and Patrick Ewing’s career PER was 21.0. Essentially every night McGee allowed the opposing center to play at a HOF level.
2) On/off per 100 possessions is -13.0. There is only one starter in the entire league who's on/off per 100 is worse--that's Aaron Afflalo who's on/off is -15.7. There are only two other players who are posting a worse on/off per 100 while averaging greater than 25% of the team’s minutes: Norris Cole, Big Baby Davis. Aside from these three players, NO other players are even in McGee's terrible on/off per 100 stratosphere. Not only that, but McGee's backups have been Andray Blatche, Jan Vesely, and Seraphin, who until 2 weeks ago many questioned whether he was a legit NBA caliber player.
3) McGee ranks 123 in the league TS% for all player averaging >10MPG. Considering 58% of his shots are dunks/tips/close shots, and he's 7'1'' with outstanding reach/explosivenss how can he be such a terrible shooter. Two reasons: 1) he has no understanding of what's a quality shot and just throws up junk too often, 2) his FT% is awful, which indicates lack of effort/concentration.

I could go on but it’s not worth the effort as it’s doubtful you’ll even acknowledge the fact that there are substantial hard facts clearly indicating McGee is an extremely poor player who has been a key contributing force of the Wizards losing culture.

I like this post. A lot of stat guys like to look at stats and selectively use stats that support their argument, while they try and hide/omit the stats that go against their argument.

[The Rebel]

Can anybody find Koufos poster block on McGee dump attempt? I cannot even find it on the team highlights but i remember that block...

For some reason and really unfortunately Denver was playing better when Nene was out during his injury. The main reason was not only his absence but the PT that Farried and Koufos got. Those players provided hustle, rebounds and blocks although much less talented. Also they required less times the ball in their hands. Most of their baskets are either dunks or putbacks. While the latter may be an advantage Denver should really develop some plays for the remaining big men.

McGee can provide excellent help defense, length and great athletic ability.

Nuggets did not aqcuire any players to improve on half court offense.

what the Nuggets were in 2nd place in the west while Nene was healthy, sure this last week they had problems with Nene and Gallo coming back, but that is to be expected after both missed so many games.

The difference between 2nd and 8th place in the west after the 17th win mark is like a thin line. Koufos and Farried along with others during the absence of starters lost some games (the first one until they adjust) but thereafter Denver had a more clear game strategy. So i did not write that they played winning basketball (the actual word was better) but for sure closer of what GK had in mind. Agree?


When starters got back healthy it was really confusing. No clear strategy and some tough loses from under .500 teams. Just remember tthe CAVS game. Undersized Nuggets could not defend the paint.

I don't know if I would call 6 games between 2nd and 8th seed a thin line, you can try to spin everything as much as you want, but the Nuggets are 8-8 without Nene in the lineup and 16-12 with him in the lineup. A 500 record does not get the Nuggets in playoffs in fact it gets them tied for the 9th seed a game and a half out. You can point to one game all you want, but overall record tell a different story, especially since the one winning streak the Nuggets went on without Nene lasted a whole 3 games, all home games, all of which they should have been the favorites to win.

as for what Karl had in mind, for some reason I doubt 500 basketball is what he had in mind, and considering there were many reports that Karl was pissed about the trade I would not doubt that he was far from happy mixing and matching a lineup every night.

As for the team being happy with the play of Koufos and Faried, you may be right on Faried, but I find it telling that they reportedly looking for a young center. Which means to me that they do not think either Koufos or mozgov are the long term answer as a starting center.

[Chocolate City Jordanaire]

Its sooo rich when the unquestioned MOST emotional member from the Wiz board calls anyone's post emotional, but I'll rise above that. All my negative remarks of McGee were absolute fact with one exception, but that's what you focus on. Then with your smug, greater than thou tone, make it seem like you've substantially backed your stance that McGee is a budding star. Let's take a look at some of the most simplistic advanced stats, from the sites you mentioned, but curiously omitted from disclosing during your analysis.

1) Counterpart PER 22.0. That's right 22.0! For comparison's sake, Alonzo Mornings career PER was 21.2 and Patrick Ewing’s career PER was 21.0. Essentially every night McGee allowed the opposing center to play at a HOF level.
2) On/off per 100 possessions is -13.0. There is only one starter in the entire league who's on/off per 100 is worse--that's Aaron Afflalo who's on/off is -15.7. There are only two other players who are posting a worse on/off per 100 while averaging greater than 25% of the team’s minutes: Norris Cole, Big Baby Davis. Aside from these three players, NO other players are even in McGee's terrible on/off per 100 stratosphere. Not only that, but McGee's backups have been Andray Blatche, Jan Vesely, and Seraphin, who until 2 weeks ago many questioned whether he was a legit NBA caliber player.
3) McGee ranks 123 in the league TS% for all player averaging >10MPG. Considering 58% of his shots are dunks/tips/close shots, and he's 7'1'' with outstanding reach/explosivenss how can he be such a terrible shooter. Two reasons: 1) he has no understanding of what's a quality shot and just throws up junk too often, 2) his FT% is awful, which indicates lack of effort/concentration.

I could go on but it’s not worth the effort as it’s doubtful you’ll even acknowledge the fact that there are substantial hard facts clearly indicating McGee is an extremely poor player who has been a key contributing force of the Wizards losing culture.

I like this post. A lot of stat guys like to look at stats and selectively use stats that support their argument, while they try and hide/omit the stats that go against their argument.

I'm not one of those stat guys. I know his counterpart PER is atrocious. I know his +/- on Roland Beech's 82games.com is the worst on the Wizards. I also know it was one of the best last season.

That metric I listed takes into account both offensive effenciency and defensive efficiency. It takes into account league averages by position. It is much more accurate than the stats no D gave you.

The proof will be in the pudding. If McGee comes in and tears it up and gets praise, you'll say to yourself, "I don't know how this guy was so bad with Washington. He is much better than I thought,"

Or, if I'm wrong, you will say, "No wonder the Wizards got rid of Mcgee. He's clueless!"

I think you'll say both, but in the end the first will win out because of the fit on your team. McGee does a lot of good things out there that DC fans totally ignore.

11.9 points, 8.8 rebounds, 2.5 blocks in only 27.5 minutes. Top-10 NBA in FG%, offensive rebound percentage, and block percentage. He is going to be an even better shot blocker than Birdman.

Trust me. Ernie Grunfeld is the reason the Wizards stink year after year after year. He gave you guys an early Christmas present. You will see.

[hehsy5sy5]

I would take Nene over Chandler 100 times over a 100, if that was the whole thinking behind this move then they are stupid, especially considering the Nuggets are at their lowest payroll in 8 years.

I am getting really tired of having one of the 4 richest owners in the league, but yet he refuses to spend the money it takes to build a winner.

It's more like McGee and Chandler for Nene without going over the cap. Nene's 14/7 wasn't going to be worth 13 mil for the next 5 years. If they do sign Chandler for 5 or 6 a year like Stein is reporting then maybe they do know what they're doing in the can.

so we traded Carmelo, billups, and Nene (3 best players on a western conference team) for Gallo, Mozgov, andre Miller, Hamilton, and chandler. Is that your attitude, because I could have swore that was the package we got for 2 of those players.

So let me say that is just bull, it is Mcgee for Nene, chandler is a restricted free agent, they had the ability to sign him without moving Nene. the Nuggets were at the cap before this trade, for the 1st time since they signed KMart they had the ability to resign a player and not even be near the tax.

they chose to save money and dump Nene, I have no problem with that, but you have to get something more worthwhile then another talented headcase that struggles to get minutes on possibly the worst team in the league. You should be able to at least get a pick or two with that kind of return, if not you hold on and wait until next year. We just got a taller version of JR with more head issues and less talent.

Just a taller version of JR with more head cases and less talent? Javale McGee's bad reputation is really blown out, and he's a much more talented version of any young center you can get in the NBA. He's a young legit, TRUE center, which is extremely scarce in this league and overpayed for, with unmatchable athleticism and freak body, and if he is developed well, in a few years he would easily be a max salary center for any team. I've been watching him, and he is probably one of the most athletic bigs to come out on the NBA in the last DECADE...

With his athleticism, physique, and potential he can easily develop into a top 5 defensive center in the league and a greater Tyson Chandler, and HAS THE BODY, POTENTIAL/ATHLETICISM, AND TALENT to maybe be the next Dwight Howard. Why do you think any team with money were all looking at and were interested in McGee regardless of the notorious reputation he has? With the right coaching staff and proper work ethic, this guy is a potential BEAST, and that's a understatement and everyone knows it. You fans don't understand how much of a diamond in the rough this guy is right now, there's a reason that he has such value regardless of his knuckleheadness. This guy is pure talent and has a cyborg's body, and regardless of the horrible situation he has been in at Washington playerwise and coachingwise, he has managed to improve every year.

If you don't want him, please don't resign him. There's a lot of people who would throw cash at him, considering DeAndre was given so much and the fact that McGee is already past DeAndre Jordan's level and is much more of a prospect, is much more of a beast defensively already (top 5 shot blocker in the league too) and still has all the potential in the world left in him. If McGee gets a proper post game/offensive game+ fixes his stupidness...I don't even...

[Greco21]

I don't know if I would call 6 games between 2nd and 8th seed a thin line, you can try to spin everything as much as you want, but the Nuggets are 8-8 without Nene in the lineup and 16-12 with him in the lineup. A 500 record does not get the Nuggets in playoffs in fact it gets them tied for the 9th seed a game and a half out. You can point to one game all you want, but overall record tell a different story, especially since the one winning streak the Nuggets went on without Nene lasted a whole 3 games, all home games, all of which they should have been the favorites to win.

as for what Karl had in mind, for some reason I doubt 500 basketball is what he had in mind, and considering there were many reports that Karl was pissed about the trade I would not doubt that he was far from happy mixing and matching a lineup every night.

As for the team being happy with the play of Koufos and Faried, you may be right on Faried, but I find it telling that they reportedly looking for a young center. Which means to me that they do not think either Koufos or mozgov are the long term answer as a starting center.

I am not the only one that things that small ball is not the long term answer. Karl wanted Al playing big minutes and with Nene in the lineup you often had them occupy the backcourt positions. I may find a lot of games that the Nuggets lost, or even were minus on the court. And do not attribute all loses just to Nene’s absence. Gallo was out too for a stretch, Ty was out for a stretch etc.
Farried is a better rebounder than Nene and might have something extra to deliver and carry the team in the future. Now as far as it concerns Koufos look at his stats given PT. He is not for sure a future hall of famer but he is a tool and maybe the best backup center for a team.
To make a long story short. Nene’s trade is confusing. It seemed that Nuggets would build on him, Gallo and Afflalo and suddenly they changed their mind. If it was my decision to make a choice I would keep Nene and would let go Harrington and Bird. I still believe though that Nene was not realizing GK plan with his performance. Now you can blame me for spinning or blame the plan. You cannot run when you do not rebound consistently.


P.S 2nd place is 29 wins when 7th is 25. If you just consider how many “easy” – home games Denver lost to a tiny margin YES the line is extra-ultra thin

[elbowthrower]

R.I.P. Denver

That's funny coming from a Portland fan whose team was just blown up.

[PeTBuLL]

Nené already changed WSH team, with him they won one game and lost 2 on the clutch (wall and crawford are just awlful to finish games), today, without Nene, they couldn´t compete, was a easy win for Boston...

And Denver, well, Denver now is out of the po´s, i have nothing against McGee, he´s a freak of the nature, but Nene has IQ and team play, something everyone need´s to win games...

[clockwork]

Nené already changed WSH team, with him they won one game and lost 2 on the clutch (wall and crawford are just awlful to finish games), today, without Nene, they couldn´t compete, was a easy win for Boston...

And Denver, well, Denver now is out of the po´s, i have nothing against McGee, he´s a freak of the nature, but Nene has IQ and team play, something everyone need´s to win games...

we're out of the playoffs because of various injuries that prevent team consistency in any goddamn category.

[Rakner]

Yeah people talk about Nene like he was the best player here at the Nuggets. Injuries were and still are the main problem of the team struggles.

[hands11]

So how you'll like McGee so far ?

[almost famous]

Love him when playing 2k online.