Harden and hindsight

scottcarman · Post #1 » by **scottcarman** » Sun Mar 3, 2013 6:55 am

I wonder if the Nuggets made an offer for James Harden? I believe he was traded for Kevin Martin, Lamb, and Tor 1st round pick. Is this a better offer then the Nuggets wanted to make or did the Nuggets not make an offer?

Of course hindsight is 20/20 but I wonder if the Nuggets mis-evaluating and letting Harden go to the Rockets is Ujiri's first mistake. I remember at the time, I was proposing some pretty significant trades that most were against at the time. Harden is exactly what the Nuggets need at 2 guard position and those are pretty scarce these days.

It depends a little on if OKC wins a championship this year and if they resign Kevin Martin to an extension.

Any thoughts?

torotoe · Post #2 » by **torotoe** » Sun Mar 3, 2013 7:23 am

OKC was not trading Harden to the nuggets. period.

scottcarman · Post #3 » by **scottcarman** » Sun Mar 3, 2013 7:40 am

They had no problem trading him to houston. I think their reasoning was more financially motivated and less emotional.

Post #4 » by **The Rebel** » Sun Mar 3, 2013 2:39 pm

The Nuggets did not have a top prospect that was just drafted and had blown up in the -dleague as well as a pick that was guaranteed to be in the lotto in the next few years, not to mention a scorer off the bench on an expiring contract to replace Harden this year. The cap space was a part of it but let's be honest the pieces the Nuggets had to give up at that time was not nearly as worthwhile to a top team with salary problems as those 3.

scottcarman · Post #5 » by **scottcarman** » Sun Mar 3, 2013 3:33 pm

Well, we had Faried, who you would think would be more valuable than the Toronto pick, and I certainly would give up Faried for Harden. Is K Mart just a rental for OKC? If he signs somewhere else in the offseason and are left with just Lamb (what has he done) and a Toronto lotto pick, then did they get a good return?

They also were not able to dump Perkins contract which may come back and hurt them. An offer centered around Faried, Chandler (remember nearly traded for 7th pick, but probably worth mid first at the time), Mozgov for Harden/Perkins would be a competitive offer. And the Nuggets could have added a pick or two. I don't buy the fact that the Nuggets didn't have the assets at the time that would be enticing to OKC.

Powder Blue · Post #6 » by **Powder Blue** » Sun Mar 3, 2013 5:59 pm

OKC needed to replace Harden with a similar player, we didn't have one.....and no way they'd be sending him to someone in same division when there were other offers.

RRFB · Post #7 » by **RRFB** » Tue Mar 5, 2013 1:10 am

As much as everyone hated the trade for OKC at the time and as much as Harden has emerged as a legit superstar, I still don't think you can say OKC lost that trade. Kevin Martin is perfect fit for what they need. He's essentially giving them the same production Harden gave them but at half the price. Factor in Lamb and the Toronto pick, that's probably a better package than anything we'd be willing to offer.

DaFan334 · Post #8 » by **DaFan334** » Tue Mar 5, 2013 2:37 am

OKC lost by default for not moving Perkins instead of Harden. They could have easily replaced what Perkins has been bringing them this year, Martin is still very far off from Harden.

scottcarman · Post #9 » by **scottcarman** » Tue Mar 5, 2013 3:22 am

I think the Nuggets could have made a competitive offer, but I am not sure if they did and got rejected, or didn't even make a competitive offer.

I will judge how OKC did on the trade based on what happens with K Mart after this year. If he gives them a good deal and extends then OKC made a good trade. If he leaves, and they only have Lamb and the Tor pick, then they could have done better by insisting that Perkins is included.

Of course, it will also depend if OKC wins the championship this year. KMart walks but delivers a championship to OKC, then hard to argue that they lost.

Powder Blue · Post #10 » by **Powder Blue** » Tue Mar 5, 2013 5:11 am

DaFan334 wrote:OKC lost by default for not moving Perkins instead of Harden. They could have easily replaced what Perkins has been bringing them this year, Martin is still very far off from Harden.

Who would have taken Perkins?

GrapeApe · Post #11 » by **GrapeApe** » Tue Mar 5, 2013 8:03 pm

scottcarman wrote:Well, we had Faried, who you would think would be more valuable than the Toronto pick, and I certainly would give up Faried for Harden. Is K Mart just a rental for OKC? If he signs somewhere else in the offseason and are left with just Lamb (what has he done) and a Toronto lotto pick, then did they get a good return?

At the time of the trade Lamb had just finished being the star of summer league. He averaged 20 points and 4.4 rebounds. The Toronto pick can safely be assumed to be top ten.

Currently, Lamb isn't getting P.T. with the Thunder because they are contenders and he is a rookie. However, He is tearing it up in the D-League, 21.1 points on 47.1% shooting, 35.4% on threes and 89.6% on FT.

pickIBL · Post #12 » by **pickIBL** » Tue Mar 5, 2013 9:18 pm

Kmart2 is a nice short term solution for OKC. Lamb is going to eventually get his shot to take over there. Ibaka will probably be their long term 5 man... and if they can land the right hybrid/stretch 4 they'll be an absolute nightmare to defend. Denver was not getting Harden. Think if they draft Otto Porter or something and Jones will eventually get some time too. OKC is going to be a pain in the ass to beat for a long time.

We got our work cut out for us.