RealGM

Here's a great read from the Gazette. I know the feeling on here is that Shaw sucks and he's the problem but I refuse to believe he's the only problem.

The Nuggets stink, and most of them don't seem to give a flip. Too many of them are here as hired mercenaries on short contracts, brought in to bridge the gap between George Karl and The Big Trade that always looms just around the bend. Too many others got their big contract, so, by the way, when is payday again?

http://gazette.com/klee-before-nuggets- ... le/1541219

Hope they can win without crowd support, can't see many folks stepping out in the cold to see this sorry squad.

today is the last straw for denver. Either win and build off of that or keep on losing for that draft pick.

I dont think the problem is players not caring, i blame most of this on brian shaw. Theres no 1-1 isolation player on this team so a coaches gameplan means alot more to how the team will come out and play. karl had these guys winning 50+ games multiple times with the same exact starting lineup we have now. difference is under shaw, ty lawson is supposed to be the playmaker/leading scorer, faried/mozgov get post feeds, and team plays slow. with karl, lawson pushes the ball at will and can play conservative, faried/mozgov are cleanup guys and the offensive focus was to RUN!

Why does shaw dump the ball down to faried for postups? faried made his name under karl by out hustling everyone for his points/rbs/etc. Shaw tries to use faried like he's milsap or something.


that being said, i predict denver losing by 17 unfornately. please let me be wrong

StunnaStan wrote:today is the last straw for denver. Either win and build off of that or keep on losing for that draft pick.

I dont think the problem is players not caring, i blame most of this on brian shaw. Theres no 1-1 isolation player on this team so a coaches gameplan means alot more to how the team will come out and play. karl had these guys winning 50+ games multiple times with the same exact starting lineup we have now. difference is under shaw, ty lawson is supposed to be the playmaker/leading scorer, faried/mozgov get post feeds, and team plays slow. with karl, lawson pushes the ball at will and can play conservative, faried/mozgov are cleanup guys and the offensive focus was to RUN!

Why does shaw dump the ball down to faried for postups? faried made his name under karl by out hustling everyone for his points/rbs/etc. Shaw tries to use faried like he's milsap or something.


that being said, i predict denver losing by 17 unfornately. please let me be wrong

good points.. under karl denver had an identity.. under what it is like WTH is going on out there. I see a lot of players playing different styles.. none of them really meshing..

Getting guys like gallo and nate healthy will help.

OTOH I keep hearing that the Nugz 'have the same lineup that won 50+ games' several years ago. In reality it's not the same team. AAA is not the same player he was a few years ago. Gallo coming off injury is not the same player either. Andre Miller's role was replaced with Nate who is not the same type of facilitator. Birdman's role was never appreciated. He was crazy but on the court had a high BBIQ unlike Javale, Hickson or DArth. Not to mention I believe the WC is even stronger today that it was a few years ago with teams like Golden State, Portland, Houston and Phoenix much stronger. The Nugz had a good little formula a few years ago but it's just really hard to win consistently in the NBA when you don't have that "go to" player.

Just playing a little devil's advocate regarding Shaw here....not saying he's the 2nd coming of Phil Jackson or Red Auerbach at all. Maybe Karl would get in the players' faces and define their roles a bit more but frankly none of these guys have stepped up either and most of them have gotten minutes. Even with minute restrictions I would think 1-2 of these guys could step up their games regardless of the coaching.

Not to give up on the season yet but...On the bright side I really do think Nurkic has a future in this league. He and Manimal could make a nice frontcourt in another year or two. Lawson is a proven commodity at this point..a nice 2nd or 3rd option on a playoff team. I believe everyone else might eventually be expendable in the right deal. Even Lawson could go but it would have to be for a really good haul. Hopefully the Nuggets turn it around this season but at this point the change will have to come from the players or some of them will be gone.

mg wrote:OTOH I keep hearing that the Nugz 'have the same lineup that won 50+ games' several years ago. In reality it's not the same team. AAA is not the same player he was a few years ago. Gallo coming off injury is not the same player either. Andre Miller's role was replaced with Nate who is not the same type of facilitator. Birdman's role was never appreciated. He was crazy but on the court had a high BBIQ unlike Javale, Hickson or DArth. Not to mention I believe the WC is even stronger today that it was a few years ago with teams like Golden State, Portland, Houston and Phoenix much stronger. The Nugz had a good little formula a few years ago but it's just really hard to win consistently in the NBA when you don't have that "go to" player.

Just playing a little devil's advocate regarding Shaw here....not saying he's the 2nd coming of Phil Jackson or Red Auerbach at all. Maybe Karl would get in the players' faces and define their roles a bit more but frankly none of these guys have stepped up either and most of them have gotten minutes. Even with minute restrictions I would think 1-2 of these guys could step up their games regardless of the coaching.

Not to give up on the season yet but...On the bright side I really do think Nurkic has a future in this league. He and Manimal could make a nice frontcourt in another year or two. Lawson is a proven commodity at this point..a nice 2nd or 3rd option on a playoff team. I believe everyone else might eventually be expendable in the right deal. Even Lawson could go but it would have to be for a really good haul. Hopefully the Nuggets turn it around this season but at this point the change will have to come from the players or some of them will be gone.

Agree with MG, not the same "50 win" team. The teams that won 50 games had healthy effiecient play at the 3 (Melo or Gallo). When Gallo went out it was at the end of the season and we had already won 50 games. This squad without a healthy, effective Gallo has not won 50 games...and it won't. Chandler had all last season to rise up to being a quality start 3 and it didn't happen.

Great point about a "go-to" player also...I guess we'll be getting one of those in the big trade we've compiled all these assets for.

Don't believe it's that the players don't care...more that they aren't buying into the system yet. Surprised that both Faried nor Mozgov are playing so poorly, especially with the improvements they made at the end of last season.

I'm done with this game. Arthur and Hickson first bigs off the bench, what a joke.

I don't know how long you can keep this roster and this coach together...

i don't know any other team or coach that does this **** - that if starters aren't playing up to par we go 13 players deep.

I would fire shaw right after the game, what a poor excuse for a head coach. No wonder it took forever for him to get hired somewhere.

One positive, no moz 3's........

Shout out to the Keystone Cops.


Say.....if the idea is to wear out the opposing team don't we need to make baskets? Otherwise it is just this team wearing itself out and fast.

I'm not going to whine about Karl being gone. I did that for a full year when Shaw first got here.

To answer the question in the title, no I do not think the players even care anymore.

Powder Blue wrote:I don't know how long you can keep this roster and this coach together...

You don't. Someone's gotta go.

First game this year that I have seen live and couldn't be more annoyed with Shaw. His rotation is a joke. Not sure what the **** we are doing out there on offense or defense.

Was there any mention of why Afflalo was benched? Saw him get really mad and have to have Hickson hold him back and calm him down, then never saw him come back in the game.

TC has to make a move soon or this will be his last season in Denver. This was the worst attendance I have seen at a Nuggets game in over a decade.

"Do the players care?"

i believe that was a resounding NO!

Shaw's definition of effort regarding Arthur and Hickson is different to mine.

something told me denver would lose by 17 smh. i would say jusuf nurkic has clearly outplayed timofey softgov thus far yet hes probably played less than half of softys min

eathb_au wrote:I'm done with this game. Arthur and Hickson first bigs off the bench, what a joke.

that is exactly what I said...

Haven't been able to watch the last few games. And judging by these game threads and the box scores, I'm perfectly fine with that.