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Honestly it appears there is a chance we don't make the playoffs this year, AGAIN. We've has some dad losses to the likes of DAL (2x), PHX, SAC, LAL, etc. We've also had injuries to both Millsap and Jokic that derailed our season as well. Malone continues to fumble lineups, his player management leaves a lot to be desired IMO. Yet we have continued to improve, we should easily eclipse our win total of last year and end up on the right side of .500. We've also seen some nice development out of Jamal Murray as well as gotten a nice surprise out of Trey Lyles (when Malone gives him mins). Most people have anticipated us to make the playoffs yet right now we're outside looking in from the 10th seed. The FO has to be frustrated as they were hoping to make the 2nd season last year and expecting to make it this year. Yet given the strides we have been making, teams like HOU or GSW are still at the top of their game and would make quick work of us, we're just not ready to compete. Playoff experience would be useful, but being swept can also be demoralizing to this team.

So what happens if we don't ?? Lets say we end up at 45-38 and end up 13th in the lottery. The blame has to go right at Malone, I'd say he'd get fired and deservedly so IMO. This team has the talent to be the 3-5 seed in the West , to miss the playoffs for the 2nd year in a row after the big deal MIllsap signed is a disgrace. But that could be a HUGE win for this team in the long run. Malone has been a nice coach, done some player development, created a healthier locker room culture, etc....but it's more than apparent he isn't the coach to take us to the next level ! There would HAVE to some serious interest from coaches when they look at this roster. I can't foresee who that guy will be but I'd think there would be some strong candidates drooling over the potential to take over this roster.

We would also get some strength from another lottery pick, hopefully we are remiss this year and keep it or trade up to fill our SF or PG needs. There are some intriguing players who could help this team, names like Trae Young, Kevin Knox, Mikal Bridges, Colin Sexton or even MPJ would look real good in our lineup next year.

Another thing would be a new coach would have the open mind to see what guys like Juancho, Lyles , Beasley, heck even Morris, Craig and Lydon could do given a nice a chance, perhaps a house cleaning to some of the older vets is in order.

skywalker33 wrote:Honestly it appears there is a chance we don't make the playoffs this year, AGAIN. We've has some dad losses to the likes of DAL (2x), PHX, SAC, LAL, etc. We've also had injuries to both Millsap and Jokic that derailed our season as well. Malone continues to fumble lineups, his player management leaves a lot to be desired IMO. Yet we have continued to improve, we should easily eclipse our win total of last year and end up on the right side of .500. We've also seen some nice development out of Jamal Murray as well as gotten a nice surprise out of Trey Lyles (when Malone gives him mins). Most people have anticipated us to make the playoffs yet right now we're outside looking in from the 10th seed. The FO has to be frustrated as they were hoping to make the 2nd season last year and expecting to make it this year. Yet given the strides we have been making, teams like HOU or GSW are still at the top of their game and would make quick work of us, we're just not ready to compete. Playoff experience would be useful, but being swept can also be demoralizing to this team.

So what happens if we don't ?? Lets say we end up at 45-38 and end up 13th in the lottery. The blame has to go right at Malone, I'd say he'd get fired and deservedly so IMO. This team has the talent to be the 3-5 seed in the West , to miss the playoffs for the 2nd year in a row after the big deal MIllsap signed is a disgrace. But that could be a HUGE win for this team in the long run. Malone has been a nice coach, done some player development, created a healthier locker room culture, etc....but it's more than apparent he isn't the coach to take us to the next level ! There would HAVE to some serious interest from coaches when they look at this roster. I can't foresee who that guy will be but I'd think there would be some strong candidates drooling over the potential to take over this roster.

We would also get some strength from another lottery pick, hopefully we are remiss this year and keep it or trade up to fill our SF or PG needs. There are some intriguing players who could help this team, names like Trae Young, Kevin Knox, Mikal Bridges, Colin Sexton or even MPJ would look real good in our lineup next year.

Another thing would be a new coach would have the open mind to see what guys like Juancho, Lyles , Beasley, heck even Morris, Craig and Lydon could do given a nice a chance, perhaps a house cleaning to some of the older vets is in order.

Great post - I think we should solely target SFs in the off-season (draft/FA). Morris might make a decent backup PG and we could always get a late-career vet for mid-level exception or veteran's minimum. It'd be OK to go for a young center for future development.

Nice take on Malone. I tend not to give him any credit, but the one thing he has done (at least to a degree) is develop a better team-attitude/lockerroom. Not sure how much he has done there either. But nice take on him. We certainly do need a different coach though. He clearly isn't doing a good enough job IMO.

Put part of the blame on the front office that gave Malone a team with two centers, one SF Malone would use, two SGs Malone would use, one PG Malone would use and a limousine full of PFs that he didn't need. Let's hope they can restructure the roster to make it more balanced!

Difference between #13-#20 is not the same as between #3-#10 where every spot is important.

There is no big difference between #13 #15 #17 or #20 draft pick, so it would be insane to tank rest of season because we want #13 instead of #17 for example. Sometimes #13 is the biggest steal of the draft (like Mitchell last season), sometimes it is #15 (like Giannis in 2013), sometimes it is late #41 pick Nikola Jokic.

So we should give our best in the rest of the season anyway, and see where are we right now exactly.

WC#6&pick#18 >>> WC#8&pick#15 >>> WC#10&pick#13

THE J0KER wrote:Difference between #13-#20 is not the same as between #3-#10 where every spot is important.

There is no big difference between #13 #15 #17 or #20 draft pick, so it would be insane to tank rest of season because we want #13 instead of #17 for example. Sometimes #13 is the biggest steal of the draft (like Mitchell last season), sometimes it is #15 (like Giannis in 2013), sometimes it is late #41 pick Nikola Jokic.

So we should give our best in the rest of the season anyway, and see where are we right now exactly.

WC#6&pick#18 >>> WC#8&pick#15 >>> WC#10&pick#13

I disagree, granted this is a top 7 draft but there is a quality difference between 13th pick and 18th, especially in regards to positions we need. Plus we can maneuver more from there

So would it really be so bad? We can "play our best" but isn't that what we've supposed to have been doing all season? Drafting's always a crap shoot but hey, the higher the pick the more likely we are to get our choice - unless of course we trade our pick for a PF and then use our lower pick for another PF. Just think, we could have 8-10 PFs next year? It'll make switching on defense easier.

It would definitely be horrendous if they can't even take the 8 seed but there isn't really much of a point just to get the 8 seed then get swept by the rockets or GSW. It pains me to say this because I want to see jokic in the playoff and for the team to get that experience but this team needs to fire malone ASAP or in the off season the sooner the better, he can't be allowed to stay for an other season that would truly be catastrophic. He is by far the worst "coach" in the nba and it isn't even close I have alot to say when it comes to him but I will make a thread in the coming days on the GB about him where i will share my thoughts. If missing the PO is gonna get malone fired then I am all for it, the best would be to get the 7 or 8 seed and then fire malone.

This team will never reach anywhere near it's full potential as long as he is this team "coach" he is stunting this cores development especially jokic. I was expecting him to become a top 10 player before the season started and putting up atleast 20/11/7
but of course malone and his ingenuity had different plans and changed everything and went away from jokic ball. He doesn't deserve to coach a team this talented, infact he shouldn't be allowed to coach any team in the nba **** G league coach!

I want Messina to get the job when he gets fired. I think he could be perfect for this team he has studied under pop and who better to learn from? While I have never seen him coach, I have heard good things about him and he likes to play through the center and who better to play through then jokic!?? I think he would install the right mentality in jokic and guide him in the right direction and have him become the player that this franchise needs him to become and unlock his HOF potential and make him the superstar that he can be. Here is the link about Messina that stiff posted indepth about him back in 15.
https://www.denverstiffs.com/2015/3/11/8189423/coachs-resume-a-look-at-ettore-messina

Darklight wrote:It would definitely be horrendous if they can't even take the 8 seed but there isn't really much of a point just to get the 8 seed then get swept by the rockets or GSW. It pains me to say this because I want to see jokic in the playoff and for the team to get that experience but this team needs to fire malone ASAP or in the off season the sooner the better, he can't be allowed to stay for an other season that would truly be catastrophic. He is by far the worst "coach" in the nba and it isn't even close I have alot to say when it comes to him but I will make a thread in the coming days on the GB about him where i will share my thoughts. If missing the PO is gonna get malone fired then I am all for it, the best would be to get the 7 or 8 seed and then fire malone.

This team will never reach anywhere near it's full potential as long as he is this team "coach" he is stunting this cores development especially jokic. I was expecting him to become a top 10 player before the season started and putting up atleast 20/11/7
but of course malone and his ingenuity had different plans and changed everything and went away from jokic ball. He doesn't deserve to coach a team this talented, infact he shouldn't be allowed to coach any team in the nba **** G league coach!

I want Messina to get the job when he gets fired. I think he could be perfect for this team he has studied under pop and who better to learn from? While I have never seen him coach, I have heard good things about him and he likes to play through the center and who better to play through then jokic!?? I think he would install the right mentality in jokic and guide him in the right direction and have him become the player that this franchise needs him to become and unlock his HOF potential and make him the superstar that he can be. Here is the link about Messina that stiff posted indepth about him back in 15.
https://www.denverstiffs.com/2015/3/11/8189423/coachs-resume-a-look-at-ettore-messina

Welcome Darklight - I started to disagree with you, that Malone is the worst coach in the NBA, but I'm rather prejudiced and extremely anti-Malone, so I guess I won't disagree. I hadn't figured out who might be a better choice, but Messina would seem to be a good choice IMO.

Darklight wrote:It would definitely be horrendous if they can't even take the 8 seed but there isn't really much of a point just to get the 8 seed then get swept by the rockets or GSW. It pains me to say this because I want to see jokic in the playoff and for the team to get that experience but this team needs to fire malone ASAP or in the off season the sooner the better, he can't be allowed to stay for an other season that would truly be catastrophic. He is by far the worst "coach" in the nba and it isn't even close I have alot to say when it comes to him but I will make a thread in the coming days on the GB about him where i will share my thoughts. If missing the PO is gonna get malone fired then I am all for it, the best would be to get the 7 or 8 seed and then fire malone.

This team will never reach anywhere near it's full potential as long as he is this team "coach" he is stunting this cores development especially jokic. I was expecting him to become a top 10 player before the season started and putting up atleast 20/11/7
but of course malone and his ingenuity had different plans and changed everything and went away from jokic ball. He doesn't deserve to coach a team this talented, infact he shouldn't be allowed to coach any team in the nba **** G league coach!

I want Messina to get the job when he gets fired. I think he could be perfect for this team he has studied under pop and who better to learn from? While I have never seen him coach, I have heard good things about him and he likes to play through the center and who better to play through then jokic!?? I think he would install the right mentality in jokic and guide him in the right direction and have him become the player that this franchise needs him to become and unlock his HOF potential and make him the superstar that he can be. Here is the link about Messina that stiff posted indepth about him back in 15.
https://www.denverstiffs.com/2015/3/11/8189423/coachs-resume-a-look-at-ettore-messina

Welcome to the forum !!

Messina would be on my list too, think he could do a lot with Jokic. Have a few other candidates as well but gotta think he has the pedigree I'd be looking for. Did a bit of digging for that review, kudos on that man ! While I'm not a huge MAlone fan, really harsh to say he the WORST coach in the NBA, quite a few that're crappier, he does have a few good qualities, just not as a HC.

I hate to say it, but yes it would really be bad for the Nuggets to miss the playoffs.

Right now there is some buzz building around the team, missing the playoffs and doing it by falling apart at the end of the season is going to kill that. That will hurt the bottom line next year and help convince Stan to go cheap.

It is fairly obvious to everyone who watches the Nuggets that Malone has major issues and is hurting this team. Even his apologists on Reddit are backing down these days. If Josh and Connelly had any balls they would fire him regardless of how the season ends up, but it far from a given that they fire him either way.

One way or the other this team has to make changes this summer, coaching and roster, but I have lost faith that they will do anything other than **** it up by doing nothing.

The Rebel wrote:I hate to say it, but yes it would really be bad for the Nuggets to miss the playoffs.

Right now there is some buzz building around the team, missing the playoffs and doing it by falling apart at the end of the season is going to kill that. That will hurt the bottom line next year and help convince Stan to go cheap.

It is fairly obvious to everyone who watches the Nuggets that Malone has major issues and is hurting this team. Even his apologists on Reddit are backing down these days. If Josh and Connelly had any balls they would fire him regardless of how the season ends up, but it far from a given that they fire him either way.

One way or the other this team has to make changes this summer, coaching and roster, but I have lost faith that they will do anything other than **** it up by doing nothing.

"It is fairly obvious to everyone who watches the Nuggets that Malone has major issues and is hurting this team" - except the front office and the owner.

So when hasn’t KSE been on the cheap side ? I can really only remember one time the Nuggets went aggressively into the luxury tax.

First of thanks for the warm welcome guys looking forward to be here and discuss with you.

NuggetsWY wrote:Welcome Darklight - I started to disagree with you, that Malone is the worst coach in the NBA, but I'm rather prejudiced and extremely anti-Malone, so I guess I won't disagree. I hadn't figured out who might be a better choice, but Messina would seem to be a good choice IMO.

I am also extremly anti-malone so that makes two of us, altough with good reasons. I actually thought that kidd for a month or two was the worst coach in the nba but honestly I don't know what I was thinking. I was gonna make a thread about malone in general board but for some reasons I can't post there so I might share some of might thoughts on him here anyways. Going a bit off topic but speaking about the GB,I registered my account on february 23, more then two weeks has passed yet I get a message that I have to wait 14 more days before I can post there, what's up with that?

Sry for the tldr in advance but it's a topic that i feel you have to go more indepth

Anyways back to the malone topic. I don't see how malone isn't the worst coach in the league he never learns from his mistake, this team should be the 3 or 4th seed with how the west is looking and probably would make the second round of the playoffs or atleast take it to a 6 or 7 game series against the blazers or timberwolves, yet here we are fighting to get the 8 seed and most likely to miss the playsoffs while jazz gets in. Would be pretty comical if the jazz knocked us out, first it was nurkic that we traded to portland which knocked us out and now it could be the jazz when we traded our pick that netted them donovan mitchell that is leading that team with gobert missing the majority of the season, you just can't make this up.

Honestly, malone should be fired just based on how he is treating jokic that's completly unacceptable, he is this teams franchise player a future superstar without a doubt. It took him half a year to start playing jokic in his natrual positon and we all know what happend from december 15 and forward that season. YET AGAIN after 10-20 matches he starts to play him again at PF just like last year, I mean are you **** kidding me?? You know already from last season that it wasn't working yet you are doing it again!???
So he decides to play the franchise player out of positon for some scrub that they overpayed massively, that can't hit a free throw or a jump shot to save his life? There is no other coach in the entire nba that would treat their franchise player in that way
aside from malone and we are not even talking about a star player here we are talking about a legitmate franchise player that can lead you to the best offense in the entire nba or atleast top3 with GSW and the rockets who have historic ones. Note, that there is a big difference between a star player and a legitmate franchise player, jokic is a franchise player while someone like millsap is a star for example but I know that you all know what I mean. Doing the same thing and expecting different results is insanity and that is what malone is doing playing jokic at PF and thinking it's gonna be different.

Seriosuly, why on earth would you be going away from something that was working perfectly fine and netting you the best offense rating since this team started to play that way? There is a saying, don't fix it if it isn't broken, guess what he did?
I already knew it would end up this way once he said in the off season that they wouldn't play through jokic as much and he wouldn't be the vocal point anymore on offense. Another thing is that you always play to your teams strenght and not their weakness and this team strenght is obviously offense and not defence yet he is trying to play to this teams weakness. It simply doesn't make any sense at all but nothing he does make any sense anyways. This is basic it's not like it's rocket science or anything and if you can't understand something so simple then you shouldn't even coach in the G league let alone in the nba.

Beisdes, why do you guys think we got millsap in the first place and why did he decide to come and join the nuggets in the first place anyways? From what I know this team has struggled to attract big free agents. Was it to be coached by malone to play with the young core or simply jokic? You all know the answer to that, it was jokic and the potential he showed that made him to join this team and that they were and up and coming team in the league. He said that it was the "young core" but that season murray had an average rookie season (i could already see that maybe he could be a potential allstar at that time and I know many others did aswell ffs the kid played through 2 sport hernias) harris showed nice potential but nothing earth shattering while jokic showed HOF potential not to say that the core was bad but it didn't show the promise that it is now with jamal and harris starting to show their true potential. Jokic is this teams future and HE IS the one that's gonna attract the big FAs to want come to denver and play, he is the one that's gonna lead this team to a ring if they get one. That's why you can't have someone like malone who is stunting his growth, hampering him and playing him out of postion the FO needs to realise it and get rid of him!
My basketball knowledge isn't that good and I am pretty sure you guys on here know more about basketball then me but there's one thing. I know trash when I see it, I also know talent when I see it and malone is trash.

I am Jokic fan I admit it and the reason I watch the nuggets is because of him but that doesn't mean I don't care about the team and what is happening. This simply isn't about jokic stats or whatever but what's best for this team going forward and for them to take the next step and get to that "next level". I am pretty invested in the team and have seen alot of them so I know what I am talking about but because of malone I have to root for them to lose and miss the playoffs similar to how the bucks hoped for Ls so they could get rid of kidd. Hopefully he is gone soon so I can root for them again.

I have already made this long enough while a have more to say on this malone topic i will leave that in another post later.

skywalker33 wrote:Welcome to the forum !!

Messina would be on my list too, think he could do a lot with Jokic. Have a few other candidates as well but gotta think he has the pedigree I'd be looking for. Did a bit of digging for that review, kudos on that man ! While I'm not a huge MAlone fan, really harsh to say he the WORST coach in the NBA, quite a few that're crappier, he does have a few good qualities, just not as a HC.

Darklight wrote:First of thanks for the warm welcome guys looking forward to be here and discuss with you.

I was gonna make a thread about malone in general board but for some reasons I can't post there so I might share some of might thoughts on him here anyways. Going a bit off topic but speaking about the GB,I registered my account on february 23, more then two weeks has passed yet I get a message that I have to wait 14 more days before I can post there, what's up with that?

Most welcome - as for the General Board, there are a couple of places new RealGM posters should visit. The first is just in general. The second is regarding the General Board. Since the General Board is so busy and active (and tends to get rather hostile sometimes), so they require a period where new posters need to wait before posting. It doesn't work and perhaps they could require a certain number of posts, but it is what it is.

viewforum.php?f=191

viewtopic.php?f=6&t=1533796

NuggetsWY wrote:"It is fairly obvious to everyone who watches the Nuggets that Malone has major issues and is hurting this team" - except the front office and the owner.

Maybe they don't watch the Nuggets

NuggetsWY wrote:

The Rebel wrote:I hate to say it, but yes it would really be bad for the Nuggets to miss the playoffs.

Right now there is some buzz building around the team, missing the playoffs and doing it by falling apart at the end of the season is going to kill that. That will hurt the bottom line next year and help convince Stan to go cheap.

It is fairly obvious to everyone who watches the Nuggets that Malone has major issues and is hurting this team. Even his apologists on Reddit are backing down these days. If Josh and Connelly had any balls they would fire him regardless of how the season ends up, but it far from a given that they fire him either way.

One way or the other this team has to make changes this summer, coaching and roster, but I have lost faith that they will do anything other than **** it up by doing nothing.

"It is fairly obvious to everyone who watches the Nuggets that Malone has major issues and is hurting this team" - except the front office and the owner.

Except maybe they are starting to see it, stiffs has written about it twice, and now some in the national media are starting to catch on, maybe they are as well. Sometimes it is hardest to see what is right in front of your face.

skywalker33 wrote:So when hasn’t KSE been on the cheap side ? I can really only remember one time the Nuggets went aggressively into the luxury tax.

Exactly my point, this team as constituted is in the tax next season if they do the right thing with Jokic, what do you want to see them give up to stay under the tax if this team doesn't make the playoffs and have a healthy increase in ticket sales?

The Rebel wrote:

skywalker33 wrote:So when hasn’t KSE been on the cheap side ? I can really only remember one time the Nuggets went aggressively into the luxury tax.

Exactly my point, this team as constituted is in the tax next season if they do the right thing with Jokic, what do you want to see them give up to stay under the tax if this team doesn't make the playoffs and have a healthy increase in ticket sales?

Well, they will be giving up Barton and hopefully Chandler but on your other point, a playoff run would help justify a price increase but if they didn't make the playoffs, do you really think that'll absolutely stop them from increasing ticket prices ?? I don't, they'll spin it as "with a healthy Paul Millsap this team should've been a 50 win team, we've just signed a top 10 player, signed Gary Harris join us and watch this young team blow up yada yada yada..."

I don't think Malone is worst NBA coach, nor TOP5 worst, but if we look at Western Conference only, he is arguably bottom-5 there (out of 15), so why Denver with so talented young core should risk anything with him anymore? He is still young coach which can improve a lot in near future, but for the Nuggets he already has done couple unforgivable things like starting every single season with team's best player Jokic on the totally wrong way until the middle of December. Also, he tried too many times things which are already proven that will not work, and also too many times he tried without any rational reason to change some things which previously worked almost perfectly. So he should learn his lessons in some less talented team than current Denver is, which under better coach would play playoff last season and this season would be a good bet to reach TOP5 after the regular season and 2nd round of the playoff.

I agree Ettore Messina would be a very interesting solution for Nuggets next season. Another name which I prefer is David Fizdale, without big reason fired from Memphis this season. He is a real expert for the defense, not just self-promoted like in Malone case, and he used very properly Marc Gasol last season, which is a good sign because Nikola Jokic is a unique NBA center, and Marc Gasol is one of the rare centers which has some similarities with him.

skywalker33 wrote:So when hasn’t KSE been on the cheap side ? I can really only remember one time the Nuggets went aggressively into the luxury tax.

I have the misfortune of coincidentally following two teams that he owns, and if the way he runs Arsenal is anything to go by he's as cheap as they come.

skywalker33 wrote:

The Rebel wrote:

skywalker33 wrote:So when hasn’t KSE been on the cheap side ? I can really only remember one time the Nuggets went aggressively into the luxury tax.

Exactly my point, this team as constituted is in the tax next season if they do the right thing with Jokic, what do you want to see them give up to stay under the tax if this team doesn't make the playoffs and have a healthy increase in ticket sales?

Well, they will be giving up Barton and hopefully Chandler but on your other point, a playoff run would help justify a price increase but if they didn't make the playoffs, do you really think that'll absolutely stop them from increasing ticket prices ?? I don't, they'll spin it as "with a healthy Paul Millsap this team should've been a 50 win team, we've just signed a top 10 player, signed Gary Harris join us and watch this young team blow up yada yada yada..."

Barton is already expiring, and not part of the salary calculations for next year. Depending on the cap increase this summer losing Chandler may not be enough to get under the tax once they give Jokic the extension.

Also I didn't say anything about raising ticket prices, I said selling tickets. Season ticket sales and renewals start right after the season. While attendence has increased this year, we are still 20th, and missing the playoffs is not likely to increase that.