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Michael Porter Jr

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THE J0KER
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Re: Michael Porter Jr 

Post#201 » by THE J0KER » Wed Oct 7, 2020 12:32 pm

TunaFish wrote:
skywalker33 wrote:
Mac1958 wrote:Yeah. As far as I'm concerned, both of them have to prove that they're not worth keeping and playing a lot.

That would be one amazing frontcourt.


Not sure that I see Bol as a starter, at least not until I see more of him (a healthier, sturdier body as well as time on the court). He'd be amazingly productive coming off the bench, he has mismatches galore. I can visualize him in spot-duty as a starter but think his best production comes as a reserve for this team. Will he play along side MPJ ??? Sure it'll happen, same with Joker too.


Bol has a lot of room to grow and that 3 point shot is excellent. Same with MPJ, so it entirely possible that Bol will play some backup at the 3 and the 4 but don't see Bol much at Center for the reasons you point out.

MPJ is so graceful and has such an impact on offense that if he improves on defense, we could be looking at a future all star. I could see MPJ playing shooting guard and Bol playing small forward. Talk about a big lineup!
Around a third of the all all-star players are actually nothing special in the defensive end, and just using smartly his big size for an SF player, MPJ will be OK and beyond average in defense. Even this playoff Porter was already more useful in defense than problematic, thanks to his elite rebounding, despite all these "high-school" ridiculous mistakes he makes time after time. If Malone is the head coach of Miami Heat this season, rookie Tyler Herro would play under 15mpg this season (including playoff) "because of defense" or for some other fake reason.

But Bol case will be more complex, especially with the established Jokic-MPJ-Grant frontcourt line, so if we can use him in a trade to improve our backcourt line, we should do it.
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Re: Michael Porter Jr 

Post#202 » by TunaFish » Wed Oct 7, 2020 2:59 pm

THE J0KER wrote:
TunaFish wrote:
skywalker33 wrote:
Not sure that I see Bol as a starter, at least not until I see more of him (a healthier, sturdier body as well as time on the court). He'd be amazingly productive coming off the bench, he has mismatches galore. I can visualize him in spot-duty as a starter but think his best production comes as a reserve for this team. Will he play along side MPJ ??? Sure it'll happen, same with Joker too.


Bol has a lot of room to grow and that 3 point shot is excellent. Same with MPJ, so it entirely possible that Bol will play some backup at the 3 and the 4 but don't see Bol much at Center for the reasons you point out.

MPJ is so graceful and has such an impact on offense that if he improves on defense, we could be looking at a future all star. I could see MPJ playing shooting guard and Bol playing small forward. Talk about a big lineup!
Around a third of the all all-star players are actually nothing special in the defensive end, and just using smartly his big size for an SF player, MPJ will be OK and beyond average in defense. Even this playoff Porter was already more useful in defense than problematic, thanks to his elite rebounding, despite all these "high-school" ridiculous mistakes he makes time after time. If Malone is the head coach of Miami Heat this season, rookie Tyler Herro would play under 15mpg this season (including playoff) "because of defense" or for some other fake reason.

But Bol case will be more complex, especially with the established Jokic-MPJ-Grant frontcourt line, so if we can use him in a trade to improve our backcourt line, we should do it.


I wouldn't be too quick to give up on Bol.

I do think we need to upgrade the shooting guard position if we continue to see Garry Harris become a non factor offensively. How they do that is tough to see.
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Re: Michael Porter Jr 

Post#203 » by stoo » Wed Oct 7, 2020 3:21 pm

TunaFish wrote:
THE J0KER wrote:
TunaFish wrote:
Bol has a lot of room to grow and that 3 point shot is excellent. Same with MPJ, so it entirely possible that Bol will play some backup at the 3 and the 4 but don't see Bol much at Center for the reasons you point out.

MPJ is so graceful and has such an impact on offense that if he improves on defense, we could be looking at a future all star. I could see MPJ playing shooting guard and Bol playing small forward. Talk about a big lineup!
Around a third of the all all-star players are actually nothing special in the defensive end, and just using smartly his big size for an SF player, MPJ will be OK and beyond average in defense. Even this playoff Porter was already more useful in defense than problematic, thanks to his elite rebounding, despite all these "high-school" ridiculous mistakes he makes time after time. If Malone is the head coach of Miami Heat this season, rookie Tyler Herro would play under 15mpg this season (including playoff) "because of defense" or for some other fake reason.

But Bol case will be more complex, especially with the established Jokic-MPJ-Grant frontcourt line, so if we can use him in a trade to improve our backcourt line, we should do it.


I wouldn't be too quick to give up on Bol.

I do think we need to upgrade the shooting guard position if we continue to see Garry Harris become a non factor offensively. How they do that is tough to see.


Bol looks to me to have a safer spot. Somebody from denver just recently said they expect Bol to be part of the rotation. But MPJ, I can see Denver using him as a valuable asset, to get a defensive scoring star guard or forward
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Re: Michael Porter Jr 

Post#204 » by skywalker33 » Wed Oct 7, 2020 4:42 pm

stoo wrote:
TunaFish wrote:
THE J0KER wrote:Around a third of the all all-star players are actually nothing special in the defensive end, and just using smartly his big size for an SF player, MPJ will be OK and beyond average in defense. Even this playoff Porter was already more useful in defense than problematic, thanks to his elite rebounding, despite all these "high-school" ridiculous mistakes he makes time after time. If Malone is the head coach of Miami Heat this season, rookie Tyler Herro would play under 15mpg this season (including playoff) "because of defense" or for some other fake reason.

But Bol case will be more complex, especially with the established Jokic-MPJ-Grant frontcourt line, so if we can use him in a trade to improve our backcourt line, we should do it.


I wouldn't be too quick to give up on Bol.

I do think we need to upgrade the shooting guard position if we continue to see Garry Harris become a non factor offensively. How they do that is tough to see.


Bol looks to me to have a safer spot. Somebody from denver just recently said they expect Bol to be part of the rotation. But MPJ, I can see Denver using him as a valuable asset, to get a defensive scoring star guard or forward


MPJ has one of the sweetest shooting strokes, we've just started to see the potential this guy has. He seemingly improved on the defensive end in the playoffs, I'd expect this to continue during the off-season. His size alone creates mismatches at the SF position, his rebounding is above average for the position and I expect his offense to improve as well. Why would you want to rid this team of of such a potent player just to try to upgrade at the SG position ?? To obtain the type of player you're looking for, other assets would have to be added as well, seems like a waste to me.
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Re: Michael Porter Jr 

Post#205 » by TunaFish » Thu Oct 8, 2020 1:21 am

stoo wrote:
TunaFish wrote:
THE J0KER wrote:Around a third of the all all-star players are actually nothing special in the defensive end, and just using smartly his big size for an SF player, MPJ will be OK and beyond average in defense. Even this playoff Porter was already more useful in defense than problematic, thanks to his elite rebounding, despite all these "high-school" ridiculous mistakes he makes time after time. If Malone is the head coach of Miami Heat this season, rookie Tyler Herro would play under 15mpg this season (including playoff) "because of defense" or for some other fake reason.

But Bol case will be more complex, especially with the established Jokic-MPJ-Grant frontcourt line, so if we can use him in a trade to improve our backcourt line, we should do it.


I wouldn't be too quick to give up on Bol.

I do think we need to upgrade the shooting guard position if we continue to see Garry Harris become a non factor offensively. How they do that is tough to see.


Bol looks to me to have a safer spot. Somebody from denver just recently said they expect Bol to be part of the rotation. But MPJ, I can see Denver using him as a valuable asset, to get a defensive scoring star guard or forward


MPJ is a valuable asset, so valuable that the fans would string up the GM if he traded him without bringing back an all star quality player in return, at the least. MPJ, in my opinion, has a such growth potential including the possibility of becoming a top 10 or top 5 scorer that you don't trade him. That level of talent is hard to find and when you get one who is ascending, that's as close to untradable as you can be. Why trade him if he is likely the best player in the future?

Today the top tier players are so good (like AD) that you can't really trade for them because they decide where they are going (and force you to trade them if they want to go) and they decide who they are going to play with. Instead you have to get lucky and find one in the draft and build around them. MPJ is the perfect addition for a building team in the future.
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Re: Michael Porter Jr 

Post#206 » by The Rebel » Thu Oct 8, 2020 4:41 am

TunaFish wrote:
stoo wrote:
TunaFish wrote:
I wouldn't be too quick to give up on Bol.

I do think we need to upgrade the shooting guard position if we continue to see Garry Harris become a non factor offensively. How they do that is tough to see.


Bol looks to me to have a safer spot. Somebody from denver just recently said they expect Bol to be part of the rotation. But MPJ, I can see Denver using him as a valuable asset, to get a defensive scoring star guard or forward


MPJ is a valuable asset, so valuable that the fans would string up the GM if he traded him without bringing back an all star quality player in return, at the least. MPJ, in my opinion, has a such growth potential including the possibility of become a top 10 or top 5 scorer that you don't trade him. That level of talent is hard to find and when you get one who is ascending, that's as close to untradable as you can be. Why trade him if he is likely the best player in the future?

Today the top tier players are so good (like AD) that you can't really trade for them because they decide where they are going (and force you to trade them if they want to go) and they decide who they are going to play with. Instead you have to get lucky and find one in the draft and build around them. MPJ is the perfect addition for a building team in the future.


agreed and to add 1 thing to it, Stan Kroenke has already made him untouchable.
https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/257055/Stan-Kroenke-Declares-Michael-Porter-Jr-Untouchable-For-Nuggets

People need to stay patient. We have a potential dynasty on our hands. The last 2 times a team had this much talent this young were the Durant/Harden/Westbrook Thunder and the Warriors. The Thunder were in the finals in a strong western conference and than had a cheap owner and injuries derail the team. The Warriors became a dynasty.

We all saw what happened in the playoffs, Murray and Jokic carried us offensively. What we really need is a primary scorer that can play solid defense. MPJ does not have to be a great defender if he is a great scorer and rebounds as well as he did. Even average with a good defender at SG and a good one at PF than our defense should be fine. MPJ showed he could get open and get his shot off against some great defenders in this league, to me he can be a 6'10" Reggie Miller with better rebounding and shot blocking. To me you look at this team and what Reggie Miller used to do, the swagger, the shooting, the getting in guy's heads, the constantly moving is exactly what this team needs.

This whole idea of going all in for some random star is crazy to me. Ask George Karl, he traded young Ray Allen for ancient Gary Payton, not even realizing that Allen was his best talent by far on that team. Karl always does that crap, every time a front office got replaced Karl would end up a bigger voice and eventually he would take a talented young team and destroy it. Unless a guy is the perfect fit (Beal or a prime Reggie Miller) than there is no way I am giving up MPJ, and then if I do it will not include much else.
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Re: Michael Porter Jr 

Post#207 » by SkillzFromThe6 » Wed Oct 14, 2020 5:25 pm

IMO, I've probably said this before somewhere. The CHAMPIONSHIP lineup will be:

Murray
MPJ
Grant
Bol
Jokic
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Re: Michael Porter Jr 

Post#208 » by skywalker33 » Fri Oct 16, 2020 3:13 am

SkillzFromThe6 wrote:IMO, I've probably said this before somewhere. The CHAMPIONSHIP lineup will be:

Murray
MPJ
Grant
Bol
Jokic


Certainly an interesting lineup with some talent but don't know how it would work against a speedy lineup
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Re: Michael Porter Jr 

Post#209 » by NuggetsWY » Fri Oct 16, 2020 9:58 am

skywalker33 wrote:
SkillzFromThe6 wrote:IMO, I've probably said this before somewhere. The CHAMPIONSHIP lineup will be:

Murray
MPJ
Grant
Bol
Jokic

Certainly an interesting lineup with some talent but don't know how it would work against a speedy lineup

Agreed, "certainly an interesting lineup with some talent" and it would be interesting against the aforementioned weakness against smaller, quicker lineups. The size and length would suggest a 3-2 zone might be effective, at least for brief periods of time.

I do not see it as a starting lineup or one that is given extensive minutes, but the offense this lineup could provide is quite interesting. It would only need two plays IMO.

Jokic at the high post with Grant & Bol in the corners where both are effective 3pt shooters. Murray & Porter on the outside wings. Use a standard Murray-Jokic pick-n-handoff. Murray heading to the basket, his quickness in a relatively open lane would be lethal and if help comes, one of three shooters would be open. If Jokic is heading to the basket through an open lane, he would be hard to stop and if help comes, one of three shooters would be open.

Jokic at the low post with four outside shooters would be hard to stop and once again, if help comes, one of four outside shooters would be open.

All of this assumes significant attention and work is placed upon 3pt shooting.
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Re: Michael Porter Jr 

Post#210 » by THE J0KER » Fri Oct 16, 2020 11:46 pm

SkillzFromThe6 wrote:IMO, I've probably said this before somewhere. The CHAMPIONSHIP lineup will be:

Murray
MPJ
Grant
Bol
Jokic

This lineup would better work with Jokic as PG than Porter as SG. But in both cases (Jokic as PG or Porter as SG) it will be an unnatural lineup and mistake. This is one of the reasons why I think Denver with an established Jokic-Grant-Porter frontcourt line should trade Bol once he obtains good trade value.
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Re: Michael Porter Jr 

Post#211 » by NuggetsWY » Sat Oct 17, 2020 1:41 am

THE J0KER wrote:
SkillzFromThe6 wrote:IMO, I've probably said this before somewhere. The CHAMPIONSHIP lineup will be:

Murray
MPJ
Grant
Bol
Jokic

This lineup would better work with Jokic as PG than Porter as SG. But in both cases (Jokic as PG or Porter as SG) it will be an unnatural lineup and mistake. This is one of the reasons why I think Denver with an established Jokic-Grant-Porter frontcourt line should trade Bol once he obtains good trade value.

With this lineup, labels are probably not going to work. :lol: The PG would have to be Murray or Jokic. Any of them could be the SG. All but Murray and maybe Jokic could play SF. All but Murray could be PF. Jokic and Bol could be center with Grant against some lineups.

Like I said, "a few minutes" it might work.

I'm not a fan of trading Bol and I do not see him as a starter, but off the bench? Nice.

Since this is a Porter thread, let me finish with: I see Porter as a small forward that can play shooting guard or power forward -and- that as he ages, he will become more of a power forward that can play small forward (but probably not much shooting guard).
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Re: Michael Porter Jr 

Post#212 » by skywalker33 » Sat Oct 17, 2020 2:54 pm

Can't say I am a fan of Porter at the SG position, I don't believe he has the foot quickness to keep up with most SG's in the league. Now maybe his length with compensate but I believe he'd end up panicking and get some silly fouls. MPJ on the bench in foul trouble is not what we need.
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Re: Michael Porter Jr 

Post#213 » by NuggetsWY » Sat Oct 17, 2020 8:07 pm

skywalker33 wrote:Can't say I am a fan of Porter at the SG position, I don't believe he has the foot quickness to keep up with most SG's in the league. Now maybe his length with compensate but I believe he'd end up panicking and get some silly fouls. MPJ on the bench in foul trouble is not what we need.

:lol: Look on the bright side; "silly fouls" are common on the Nuggets. Several seem to specialize in "silly fouls" and as much as those irritate me, I'd say Jokic is the only one that needs to eliminate those "silly fouls". Until Porter is playing 30+ mpg, it shouldn't matter and most players learn how to eliminate those "silly fouls" as they play more minutes.
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Re: Michael Porter Jr 

Post#214 » by TunaFish » Sat Oct 24, 2020 12:00 pm

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