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Nuggets Trades

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Re: Nuggets Trades 

Post#1301 » by Manolito » Tue Jan 5, 2021 9:47 pm

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Re: Nuggets Trades 

Post#1302 » by THE J0KER » Tue Jan 5, 2021 9:48 pm

NuggetsWY wrote:With all of that Sacramento noise about trading Bagley, would we be interested? His biggest problem has been injuries and gambling on injuries has worked somewhat well for us (Porter especially, but Beasley fell in the draft due to injury and worked out fairly well, and now we have Bol working on it).

Barton for Bagley?

Value of #2 pick of 2018 draft which disappointed and have limited minutes as injury prevention but still has flashes of future good player with 20-10 "per 36 minutes" stats in both of first two seasons under rookie contract is not Barton but Barton + 2xFRP (2021, 2025) if Kings are interested.

Barton for Bjelica+2nd seems to be much more realistic. The reason why would Kings accept this offer is that Bjelica is expiring, he is also part of Divac's legacy, and they have 3x2nd round picks in the 2021 draft.
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Re: Nuggets Trades 

Post#1303 » by THE J0KER » Tue Jan 5, 2021 10:29 pm

Manolito wrote:https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2925346-gary-harris-trade-rumors-nuggets-have-tried-and-failed-to-find-market-for-sg

A good indication about Harris' trade value

This is the third episode of the "Harris trade" saga, and he always played his worst basketball when it happens. I don't know is that some kind of his protective mechanism which he using to stay in Denver, or he has some kind of mental blockade because of pressure, but all three-times undermined his trade value so badly that it is very probably part of the reasons why all that attempts fail. But the other reason is the clear inability of our FO to trade players before the trade deadline except when the other side is the clear winner (Nurkic+FRP for expiring Plumlee, low value back for Muddiay, Beasley, Juancho).

I don't know why the #1 trade priority is not Will Barton. The trade market for him is arguably bigger than for in-slump 18M Harris, and unlike Harris, Barton damaging team chemistry and game system.
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Re: Nuggets Trades 

Post#1304 » by skywalker33 » Tue Jan 5, 2021 10:59 pm

KKP wrote:Harris and Bol for Langford and Smart a bitch for Muray..


Can't say this thrills me, and I don't think BOS would be overjoyed either. However, keep the ideas coming
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Re: Nuggets Trades 

Post#1305 » by NuggetsWY » Tue Jan 5, 2021 11:51 pm

Manolito wrote:https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2925346-gary-harris-trade-rumors-nuggets-have-tried-and-failed-to-find-market-for-sg

A good indication about Harris' trade value

I get it, Harris is struggling on offense. But again, offense is not the Nuggets' biggest problem. Sure, I had dreams of Harris scoring 20+ along with Jokic & Murray doing the same. But I've come around to taking the position that I'd rather have his defense than give him away.

If he wants to score, he should just move, move, move. Jokic's had some great passes to "Gary Harris at the rim"!
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Re: Nuggets Trades 

Post#1306 » by Richard Miller » Wed Jan 6, 2021 12:16 am

THE J0KER wrote:The trade market for him is arguably bigger than for in-slump 18M Harris,


Is it though? I can't say I remember reading a single line recently that anyone is interested in Barton. His value at the moment doesn't appear to be much different than Gary's and Gary at least is still capable of elite defense.
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Re: Nuggets Trades 

Post#1307 » by The Rebel » Wed Jan 6, 2021 2:35 am

Richard Miller wrote:
THE J0KER wrote:The trade market for him is arguably bigger than for in-slump 18M Harris,


Is it though? I can't say I remember reading a single line recently that anyone is interested in Barton. His value at the moment doesn't appear to be much different than Gary's and Gary at least is still capable of elite defense.


Are you sure they are shopping Barton? I have not heard anything about him being shopped since the trade deadline.

What this rumor tells me is that the Nuggets are shopping Harris right now, but are not finding takers. Maybe a team executive that is interested sees the rumor and goes after Harris?

The only guys who are even close to starting SGs on a contender are Harris and Barton, and there are not many rumors of SGs being available outside of Houston.

While I think Harris's defense is more important than Barton, that does not mean the front office agrees. They could like Barton's scoring and think the defense is close enough if Murray has truly improved on defense.
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Re: Nuggets Trades 

Post#1308 » by THE J0KER » Wed Jan 6, 2021 4:59 am

MINNESOTA: Harris, Barton, FRP2021
DENVER: Beasley, Juancho, Vanderbilt
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Re: Nuggets Trades 

Post#1309 » by skywalker33 » Wed Jan 6, 2021 5:20 am

THE J0KER wrote:MINNESOTA: Harris, Barton, FRP2021
DENVER: Beasley, Juancho, Vanderbilt



Aren't you supposed to put sarcasm in green font ??
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Re: Nuggets Trades 

Post#1310 » by DaFan334 » Wed Jan 6, 2021 5:45 am

NuggetsWY wrote:
Manolito wrote:https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2925346-gary-harris-trade-rumors-nuggets-have-tried-and-failed-to-find-market-for-sg

A good indication about Harris' trade value

I get it, Harris is struggling on offense. But again, offense is not the Nuggets' biggest problem. Sure, I had dreams of Harris scoring 20+ along with Jokic & Murray doing the same. But I've come around to taking the position that I'd rather have his defense than give him away.

If he wants to score, he should just move, move, move. Jokic's had some great passes to "Gary Harris at the rim"!


So I would normally say that, but this chart made me question how much Harris has just completely fallen off. It was posted to see the guy on the upper right of the chart, but the guy on the lower left stuck out almost as much.

Read on Twitter


I'm not sure what has happened to Gary, but it's rough from a guy who was such an impact player 3 years ago. I think they need to bench him for a bit. He shouldn't be playing 30 minutes a game like he is.
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Re: Nuggets Trades 

Post#1311 » by Richard Miller » Wed Jan 6, 2021 11:49 am

The Rebel wrote:
While I think Harris's defense is more important than Barton, that does not mean the front office agrees. They could like Barton's scoring and think the defense is close enough if Murray has truly improved on defense.


Tbh, if they stay healthy both Harris and Barton have more value staying than being traded for some bench warmers and/or late picks. Barton probably had the best game so far this season and almost completely shut down Beasley whenever he was on him, after getting hot the last game he didn't hit a single three last night.
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Re: Nuggets Trades 

Post#1312 » by The Rebel » Wed Jan 6, 2021 1:34 pm

Richard Miller wrote:
The Rebel wrote:
While I think Harris's defense is more important than Barton, that does not mean the front office agrees. They could like Barton's scoring and think the defense is close enough if Murray has truly improved on defense.


Tbh, if they stay healthy both Harris and Barton have more value staying than being traded for some bench warmers and/or late picks. Barton probably had the best game so far this season and almost completely shut down Beasley whenever he was on him, after getting hot the last game he didn't hit a single three last night.


It depends on what Barton you get, when you get the guy committed to defense and willing to just fit into the offense like last night than he can easily be our 3rd best player and a very good role player. The issue is that you do not get that every night, in fact last night was the 1st night that guy has shown up this season. When he is not playing defense and isoing the guy destroys our entire offensive system, and I would rather trade him for a 15th guy and a pick when he does that.

As for Harris, he is an elite defender, he actually spent a lot more time on Beasley last night than anybody. I agree I would rather take the risk on him figuring out how to shoot again than trade him for a future pick and bench guy.
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Re: Nuggets Trades 

Post#1313 » by skywalker33 » Thu Jan 7, 2021 6:33 am

I'm betting on Barton opting out of his PO and I don't see us ponying up to pay him (unless he lowers his salary for a longer term). Trying to be proactive, if we were to trade him before the deadline, what is his worth ? I could see looking for a wing, would Oubre Jr be a fair target ? Could we resign him or will he outprice us as well ? Any other targets you can think of ?
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Re: Nuggets Trades 

Post#1314 » by Manolito » Thu Jan 7, 2021 7:26 am

After Fultz injury, Orlando might be a good trade destination if they are still willing to compete

Barton + Cancar + unprotected 2021FRP x Gordon.....don´t know if that is enough. I guess ORL will ask for Nnaji or Hampton instead of Cancar

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Re: Nuggets Trades 

Post#1315 » by stoo » Thu Jan 7, 2021 6:49 pm

DaFan334 wrote:
NuggetsWY wrote:
Manolito wrote:https://bleacherreport.com/articles/2925346-gary-harris-trade-rumors-nuggets-have-tried-and-failed-to-find-market-for-sg

A good indication about Harris' trade value

I get it, Harris is struggling on offense. But again, offense is not the Nuggets' biggest problem. Sure, I had dreams of Harris scoring 20+ along with Jokic & Murray doing the same. But I've come around to taking the position that I'd rather have his defense than give him away.

If he wants to score, he should just move, move, move. Jokic's had some great passes to "Gary Harris at the rim"!


So I would normally say that, but this chart made me question how much Harris has just completely fallen off. It was posted to see the guy on the upper right of the chart, but the guy on the lower left stuck out almost as much.

Read on Twitter


I'm not sure what has happened to Gary, but it's rough from a guy who was such an impact player 3 years ago. I think they need to bench him for a bit. He shouldn't be playing 30 minutes a game like he is.


if i read this correctly, jokic is quite useful on defense
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Re: Nuggets Trades 

Post#1316 » by skywalker33 » Thu Jan 7, 2021 6:52 pm

Manolito wrote:After Fultz injury, Orlando might be a good trade destination if they are still willing to compete

Barton + Cancar + unprotected 2021FRP x Gordon.....don´t know if that is enough. I guess ORL will ask for Nnaji or Hampton instead of Cancar

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Gordon is averaging 14/7 and is not a defensive slatwart like Grant, not giving all that up for an average overpaid. And realistically, with their need, they aren't dealing from a position of strength IMO
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Re: Nuggets Trades 

Post#1317 » by NuggetsWY » Thu Jan 7, 2021 10:20 pm

stoo wrote:
Spoiler:
DaFan334 wrote:
NuggetsWY wrote:I get it, Harris is struggling on offense. But again, offense is not the Nuggets' biggest problem. Sure, I had dreams of Harris scoring 20+ along with Jokic & Murray doing the same. But I've come around to taking the position that I'd rather have his defense than give him away.

If he wants to score, he should just move, move, move. Jokic's had some great passes to "Gary Harris at the rim"!


So I would normally say that, but this chart made me question how much Harris has just completely fallen off. It was posted to see the guy on the upper right of the chart, but the guy on the lower left stuck out almost as much.

Read on Twitter


I'm not sure what has happened to Gary, but it's rough from a guy who was such an impact player 3 years ago. I think they need to bench him for a bit. He shouldn't be playing 30 minutes a game like he is.

if i read this correctly, jokic is quite useful on defense

Some of us have been saying that for a couple of years, but most fans only look for sky-high blocked shots. Jokic's defense is all about position and his in-the-paint stats are elite.
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Re: Nuggets Trades 

Post#1318 » by NuggetsWY » Thu Jan 7, 2021 10:23 pm

skywalker33 wrote:
Manolito wrote:After Fultz injury, Orlando might be a good trade destination if they are still willing to compete

Barton + Cancar + unprotected 2021FRP x Gordon.....don´t know if that is enough. I guess ORL will ask for Nnaji or Hampton instead of Cancar

Gordon is averaging 14/7 and is not a defensive slatwart like Grant, not giving all that up for an average overpaid. And realistically, with their need, they aren't dealing from a position of strength IMO

I'd offer Barton + Cancar but not with a 1st and certainly not with Nnaji or Hampton.
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Re: Nuggets Trades 

Post#1319 » by THE J0KER » Thu Jan 7, 2021 11:56 pm

NuggetsWY wrote:
skywalker33 wrote:
Manolito wrote:After Fultz injury, Orlando might be a good trade destination if they are still willing to compete

Barton + Cancar + unprotected 2021FRP x Gordon.....don´t know if that is enough. I guess ORL will ask for Nnaji or Hampton instead of Cancar

Gordon is averaging 14/7 and is not a defensive slatwart like Grant, not giving all that up for an average overpaid. And realistically, with their need, they aren't dealing from a position of strength IMO

I'd offer Barton + Cancar but not with a 1st and certainly not with Nnaji or Hampton.

No matter what I personally think about Nnaji or Hampton's talent, I would use them to get some good experienced players because no signs Malone will go anytime soon or change his methods. As a basketball fan, I wish we traded Beasley and Juancho a year or two earlier or Nurkic before the start of the 2016-17 season, so they would not waste all these seasons and the Nuggets would get a bigger outcome back. To get Malone's attention and respect under 22 players must show flashes of a future star like Jokic, Murray, or Porter, and young Harris was amazing too at some point when his TS% was close to 60% (and Nuggets are not stacked in 2015 like today). Craig, Morris, and I guess Campazzo get their chances already under rookie contract years, but they started their NBA career when they are already 22+ old.

Look at Boston #26 pick rookie point guard Pritchard. Kemba is injured so Brad Stevens gives him the chance to play some minutes, and if he playing well on a sudden day his playing time goes up, so he already has one 30+ minutes game (Porter didn't have last season before bubble) when he scored 20+ points and yesterday he even has buzzer-beater in such important game for Celtics vs Heat, their opponent in last season ECF! And how many minutes #22 pick PF Nnaji gets so far considering that PF Green didn't play the opening 4 games while Porter was out the next 3?? Just 5 minutes overall, despite a very decent performance during preseason games. How many minutes played PF Bol Bol which was TOP10 contender for the rookie of the year award by bookmakers before the start of this season? He played just 14 minutes overall. To compensate MPJ's and Green PF minutes Malone rather prefers to use even older guards (Barton and Dozier) over young players whose PF is natural positions.

Hartenstein gets some chance to play and he used it very well, but since Green is back his minutes despaired. He will turn 23 in the next 3-4 months so I guess he is in a better position, but still... until Malone is Denver coach we should trade young assets which talent is recognized to get notable veterans which would be actually used.

If Orlando wants to give up from this season because of Isaac and Fultz's injuries and use it to rebuild the team, and Denver's FO finally starts to use the "win now" strategy, or just to not be delusional about Malone, Hampton, Nnaji, and 2021FRP can be very useful assets. For example:

ORLANDO: Barton, Harris, Hampton, Nnaji, Cancar, DEN2021-1st, DEN2025-1st
DENVER: Gordon, Fournier, Ross, ORL2021-2nd, ORL2022-2nd
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Re: Nuggets Trades 

Post#1320 » by The Rebel » Fri Jan 8, 2021 1:32 am

Manolito wrote:After Fultz injury, Orlando might be a good trade destination if they are still willing to compete

Barton + Cancar + unprotected 2021FRP x Gordon.....don´t know if that is enough. I guess ORL will ask for Nnaji or Hampton instead of Cancar

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For the life of me I cannot figure out why Fultz getting injured would make them want a SG/SF? At least give them a backup PG or something.

By the way I would not trade Barton, a prospect (even a bad prospect), and a 1st for Gordon. Gordon is not that much better than Barton, in fact this year it is arguable if Gordon even is better than Barton so far. Which is pretty damn scary to think about.

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