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Isaiah Hartenstein

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Isaiah Hartenstein 

Post#1 » by THE J0KER » Sun Dec 13, 2020 1:12 pm

Just notice our new backup center, Isaiah Hartenstein, still not have its own thread. Maybe because his name is hard to spell :lol:

We can use the nickname HartEinstein when he playing good, or HartFrankenstein when he is a mess... or just a 'Stein, which is... short.

First impressions after his preseason debut are definitely positive, he much more looked like NBA than a G-League player (he is best known so far as G-League 2019 fMVP). Plumlee's defense will be missed but his good passing not that much because new play Campazzo will bring it to the 2nd unit. So Hartenstein looks like an OK backup center option especially in the offense, his contract is about 5 times cheaper than Plumlee, and for a change, this season Nuggets don't have any single under 0.700 FT% player which opponents will foul intentionally. No surprise if Denver FT% this season from around 77% and #16-20 place in the league where Nuggets ranks since 2016 suddenly improve into TOP10 (during 2020 playoff where Plumlee and Craig's minutes was very limited, Denver FT% rank was #3!).

Isaiah Hartenstein is 1998 born, drafted as #43 pick in the 2017 draft from Houston.

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Re: Isaiah Hartenstein 

Post#2 » by UcanUwill » Sun Dec 13, 2020 3:24 pm

I am believer, still believe he can turn out really good. From what I have seen in years, he cant switch and guard small guys at perimeter, and thats what really kills it, but I always though his help defense was great when he was playing in LIthuania. He was showing very good awareness on both ends with knowing when to help on d and when and where to pass on O. As a prospect center, he was doing kinda everything, rebounding, shooting, passing, finishing at the rim, but at the same time he wasn't doing any of that at a very high level, So it made sense that he would be G league MVP, but it would take time for him to become NBA level player, if only he made small steps in his all around game and hes a very good player. When he was drafted I said his ultimate upside is Marc Gasol and I still believe that.
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Re: Isaiah Hartenstein 

Post#3 » by Richard Miller » Sun Dec 13, 2020 7:17 pm

How many backup centers can successfully guard the small guys on the perimeter? Or even starting centers? So far doesn't look worse than Plumdog and far cheaper and younger too.
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Re: Isaiah Hartenstein 

Post#4 » by NuggetsWY » Mon Dec 14, 2020 5:03 pm

Richard Miller wrote:How many backup centers can successfully guard the small guys on the perimeter? Or even starting centers? So far doesn't look worse than Plumdog and far cheaper and younger too.

:rockon: We need a big thumbs-up smilie for that one.
I think the best center to guard a small guy on the perimeter exists only in video games. That's why so many NBA teams spend the majority of their time playing pick-n-roll to get those switches.
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Re: Isaiah Hartenstein 

Post#5 » by Timmyyy » Mon Jan 11, 2021 12:13 am

Hope the "Hartenstein is clueless on defense" guys were watching that second quarter. Amazing defense from the guy. It's so obvious, too. Like that one instance when the Knicks were nearly having a shotclock violation. He was guarding outside, helped inside a blink of an eye later, he was just everywhere. And it is not just today, he has been good all season.
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Re: Isaiah Hartenstein 

Post#6 » by U hova » Mon Jan 11, 2021 2:10 am

I hope Green takes all his backup C minutes.
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Re: Isaiah Hartenstein 

Post#7 » by The Rebel » Mon Jan 11, 2021 2:39 am

U hova wrote:I hope Green takes all his backup C minutes.


Are you serious? The guy fouls to much but he will start getting called for less and less fouls as refs figure out he is an agreesive physical defender, other than that I cannot see any problem with him on the court.
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Re: Isaiah Hartenstein 

Post#8 » by Mac1958 » Mon Jan 11, 2021 10:33 am

I like this guy a lot. He's skilled, and you're getting 100% from him.

It looks like he's not quite the passer that Plumlee is, but he makes up for it in other areas.

Excellent backup center at that cost.
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Re: Isaiah Hartenstein 

Post#9 » by U hova » Mon Jan 11, 2021 11:44 am

The Rebel wrote:
U hova wrote:I hope Green takes all his backup C minutes.


Are you serious? The guy fouls to much but he will start getting called for less and less fouls as refs figure out he is an agreesive physical defender, other than that I cannot see any problem with him on the court.

They don't always figure that out within the season - I can give him time, but we're the worst team in the league when Jokic is on the bench right now.
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Re: Isaiah Hartenstein 

Post#10 » by Timmyyy » Mon Jan 11, 2021 12:29 pm

The Rebel wrote:
U hova wrote:I hope Green takes all his backup C minutes.


Are you serious? The guy fouls to much but he will start getting called for less and less fouls as refs figure out he is an agreesive physical defender, other than that I cannot see any problem with him on the court.


I would even go a step further and ask: why should we care if a guy that is a 10-15min backup fouls out after 12 minutes. I couldn't care less actually.

U hova wrote:They don't always figure that out within the season - I can give him time, but we're the worst team in the league when Jokic is on the bench right now.


You act as if Hartenstein is expected to take the second unit on his back and carry them to good results. Is it his fault that the bench is bad just because he is the guy coming in when Jokic goes out? I can't understand how people watch the Nuggets this season and don't think Isaiah was good in the limited minutes he played. He is a big reason why our bench isn't even worse without Jokic on the floor. If you want to blame someone for the bad bench than it has to be the inconsistent perimeter guys and Malone for playing mega small ball. But just randomly blame the guy that is subbed in for the best center in the game because he can't carry the bench to better results doesn't make sense at all.
Sometimes I am not sure what expectations some guys have from our backup center. He won't be able to run the offense in a way that we are not noticing Jokic is on the bench. But the guy plays good defense and him in the pick and roll is one of the more reliable offensive options we have with the bench on offense since the perimeter players are highly inconsistent. So, what do you want him to do? Anchor offense and defense for the bench like Jokic does with the starters?
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Re: Isaiah Hartenstein 

Post#11 » by NuggetsWY » Mon Jan 11, 2021 1:43 pm

I'd love a 30 years+ veteran as a third center, but in my opinion, Hartenstein was a good acquisition.
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Re: Isaiah Hartenstein 

Post#12 » by The Rebel » Mon Jan 11, 2021 2:54 pm

U hova wrote:
The Rebel wrote:
U hova wrote:I hope Green takes all his backup C minutes.


Are you serious? The guy fouls to much but he will start getting called for less and less fouls as refs figure out he is an agreesive physical defender, other than that I cannot see any problem with him on the court.

They don't always figure that out within the season - I can give him time, but we're the worst team in the league when Jokic is on the bench right now.


Hartenstein has a 87.9 defensive rating which is by far the best on the team, His net rating is +14.5 also the best on the team, so it is hard to blame him for our bench issues. In fact he has been key the last 2 games in making our bench better. Last night on defense and against the 76ers on offense and defense. If you look at the lineups on nba.com it does not take long to see that the biggest reason our bench is so horrible is the 4 guard lineups, no matter who is at Center. There have been 5 mpg using Green or Millsap at C and 2 games were they used Green or Millsap at Center for over 10 minutes, those were the worst of the lineups.
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Re: Isaiah Hartenstein 

Post#13 » by The Rebel » Mon Jan 11, 2021 3:16 pm

Timmyyy wrote:
The Rebel wrote:
U hova wrote:I hope Green takes all his backup C minutes.


Are you serious? The guy fouls to much but he will start getting called for less and less fouls as refs figure out he is an agreesive physical defender, other than that I cannot see any problem with him on the court.


I would even go a step further and ask: why should we care if a guy that is a 10-15min backup fouls out after 12 minutes. I couldn't care less actually.


The fouls matter in the 2nd and 4th especially because it helps get our opponents to the line earlier in the quarters. An extra 2 fouls in the 1st 3 minutes of a quarter usually mean the opponents will be going to the line for every touch foul once the starters come back in so it hurts the team overall.
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Re: Isaiah Hartenstein 

Post#14 » by Timmyyy » Mon Jan 11, 2021 5:05 pm

The Rebel wrote:
Timmyyy wrote:
The Rebel wrote:
Are you serious? The guy fouls to much but he will start getting called for less and less fouls as refs figure out he is an agreesive physical defender, other than that I cannot see any problem with him on the court.


I would even go a step further and ask: why should we care if a guy that is a 10-15min backup fouls out after 12 minutes. I couldn't care less actually.


The fouls matter in the 2nd and 4th especially because it helps get our opponents to the line earlier in the quarters. An extra 2 fouls in the 1st 3 minutes of a quarter usually mean the opponents will be going to the line for every touch foul once the starters come back in so it hurts the team overall.


Of course you are right on that one. Of course if this happens every game this is a problem because of the reasons you stated. What I meant was more like I don't care that it happened yesterday. So more or less, if he gets fouled out every 10th game I couldn't care less. Most of the time that won't be game deciding (but it can be, hence it should be low frequency). The other games this season he did foul at a high rate but not like yesterday and I never had the feeling that we got into trouble because of it. So I am not worried because of yesterdays game. That was more or less the bottom line what I wanted to say. But the way I worded it, you are right, it was too much.
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Re: Isaiah Hartenstein 

Post#15 » by THE J0KER » Mon Jan 11, 2021 5:11 pm

Hartenstain overperforming his salary so far, and if he stays this good, and Malone gives him all available backup center time when Jokic is on the bench, it will be even more obvious.

Per 36 minutes H'stain so far is a triple-double monster with 20 points 12 rebounds and 10 fouls! But 10 games and number of minutes he played so far is a small sample.
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Re: Isaiah Hartenstein 

Post#16 » by Richard Miller » Mon Jan 11, 2021 5:45 pm

Jokic used to foul a lot. Nikola Pekovic could barely stay on court and some Wolves fans used to comment "Pekovic is not a basketball player" or something. Not saying that Hartenstein is going to be a max player some day, but it would be nuts to write him off this early.
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Re: Isaiah Hartenstein 

Post#17 » by U hova » Wed Jan 13, 2021 2:22 am

Alright I'll take that back he's good

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