RealGM

Morris and Barton
for
KCP and Ish Smith

KCP is a nice piece but Nuggs are definitely going to miss Barton.

Ish Smith has played for every team in eh league!

There was a specific message already in the offseason thread, no need to open a new thread without adding new information or even reliable sources

Manolito wrote:There was a specific message already in the offseason thread, no need to open a new thread without adding new information or even reliable sources

Let the Joker take care of the MOD duties. Booth just gave away his assets, shoulda got a draft pick or waited until the market for them increased IMO

Manolito wrote:There was a specific message already in the offseason thread, no need to open a new thread without adding new information or even reliable sources

Chill out, let JOKER do his MOD duties,

Seems Booth is giving the store away. Ish is worthless IMO, so we get a little cap savings and KCP. Not happy with this return at all, Booth is underwhelming again

skywalker33 wrote:

Manolito wrote:There was a specific message already in the offseason thread, no need to open a new thread without adding new information or even reliable sources

Let the Joker take care of the MOD duties. Booth just gave away his assets, shoulda got a draft pick or waited until the market for them increased IMO

Market for Barton isn't going to increase and he alone couldn't get this done by any stretch of imagination. So it's either Monte (or Bones etc) or no deal.

The deal fits the needs, and I am sure the money savings played a role, but I am sure that Kroenke and company took the money savings over a pick. The question becomes what we do with the TPEs and MLE, with some quick math it looks like it puts us around $146 million in payroll, so we could us almost the full MLE or one of the TPEs for a sign and trade using the Green TPE and stay under the apron.

Richard Miller wrote:

skywalker33 wrote:

Manolito wrote:There was a specific message already in the offseason thread, no need to open a new thread without adding new information or even reliable sources

Let the Joker take care of the MOD duties. Booth just gave away his assets, shoulda got a draft pick or waited until the market for them increased IMO

Market for Barton isn't going to increase and he alone couldn't get this done by any stretch of imagination. So it's either Monte (or Bones etc) or no deal.

Injuries can CREATE markets in most sports, so I'm gonna have to disagree. I also feel Barton will provide some value to the WIZ, we were all just jaded by his presence/ego here,. But hey, he's their problem now, though

skywalker33 wrote:

Richard Miller wrote:

skywalker33 wrote:
Let the Joker take care of the MOD duties. Booth just gave away his assets, shoulda got a draft pick or waited until the market for them increased IMO

Market for Barton isn't going to increase and he alone couldn't get this done by any stretch of imagination. So it's either Monte (or Bones etc) or no deal.

Injuries can CREATE markets in most sports, so I'm gonna have to disagree.

Well no one is playing now and if you meant they should've waited February to make a trade, that's way too late, this had to be done this summer.

Richard Miller wrote:

skywalker33 wrote:

Richard Miller wrote:
Market for Barton isn't going to increase and he alone couldn't get this done by any stretch of imagination. So it's either Monte (or Bones etc) or no deal.

Injuries can CREATE markets in most sports, so I'm gonna have to disagree.

Well no one is playing now and if you meant they should've waited February to make a trade, that's way too late, this had to be done this summer.

FIBA is going on, many NBA players are playing worldwide. And injuries can happen anytime, that was how a market could open for him. I wasn't expecting us to wait until the trade deadline, we had to move on from Barton.

skywalker33 wrote:

Richard Miller wrote:

skywalker33 wrote:
Injuries can CREATE markets in most sports, so I'm gonna have to disagree.

Well no one is playing now and if you meant they should've waited February to make a trade, that's way too late, this had to be done this summer.

FIBA is going on, many NBA players are playing worldwide. And injuries can happen anytime, that was how a market could open for him. I wasn't expecting us to wait until the trade deadline, we had to move on from Barton.

The issue is that Barton was bad last year, according to advanced stats he was one of the worst starters in the league and a borderline rotation player. His value was an expiring contract, but did anybody really believe that Kroenke would agree to take back a longer deal for an overpaid player?

skywalker33 wrote:

Richard Miller wrote:

skywalker33 wrote:
Injuries can CREATE markets in most sports, so I'm gonna have to disagree.

Well no one is playing now and if you meant they should've waited February to make a trade, that's way too late, this had to be done this summer.

FIBA is going on, many NBA players are playing worldwide. And injuries can happen anytime, that was how a market could open for him.

Eurobasket is not until September, and there are not that many players that fit what Nuggets needed anyway, waiting for some really long shot would all but guarantee one more year of Barton.

Richard Miller wrote:

skywalker33 wrote:

Richard Miller wrote:
Well no one is playing now and if you meant they should've waited February to make a trade, that's way too late, this had to be done this summer.

FIBA is going on, many NBA players are playing worldwide. And injuries can happen anytime, that was how a market could open for him.

Eurobasket is not until September, and there are not that many players that fit what Nuggets needed anyway, waiting for some really long shot would all but guarantee one more year of Barton.

FIBA was only one ORGANIZED basketball platform (which I'm almost sure practice is already happening), a good 90% of NBA players play pickup all off-season. However, with Barton gone, I'm feeling MUCH better about this team already

skywalker33 wrote: a good 90% of NBA players play pickup all off-season.

I mean you're trying to upgrade a starter on a contender and you're counting on someone getting injured in a pickup game? That would be plain silly. But anyway, this move is done, and hopefully this wasn't the last, they still have some things to address.

This is... terrible. I know some of our posters always said trading Barton will solve ALL the problems but this? I would hate simple KCP for WB trade. But throwing in the best back up pure PG for Ish who cares Smith? I am down... It is´t that long ago we´ve read how Nuggets are ready to spend for contending team. Next move? Money saving trade. **** Calvin Booth. **** Kroenkes. Damn I am waking up in couple of hours but I am so pissed off I won´t be able to sleep.

skywalker33 wrote:

Manolito wrote:There was a specific message already in the offseason thread, no need to open a new thread without adding new information or even reliable sources

Let the Joker take care of the MOD duties. Booth just gave away his assets, shoulda got a draft pick or waited until the market for them increased IMO

We really don't need a new topic for every roster change, and new players will get their new own thread anyway. But OK, we just traded two of our starters from the previous season, and KCP is a potential starter for the incoming season, so this is some kind of the big deal, and nothing wrong if a separate thread exists.

Talking about "big deal", of course, I'm disappointed that at the end of the day we traded Barton and Morris just for the luxury tax and did not even get a one future FRP or at least 2 future 2nd round picks, despite we added to the fair Barton-KCP deal (both expire) another asset, Monte Morris under two-season team-friendly contract!

I find it funny that 10 days ago I proposed a deal after which Barton and Morris go to Washington, KCP to Denver, but instead of Ish Smith (using some other assets) we take an all-star player, and according to what Atlanta sent to Spurs to get that guy (expiring Gallinari + 3 future Firsts) this offer was correct!

THE J0KER wrote:WASHINGTON: Morris, Barton, SAS#25
SAN ANTONIO: WAS#10 DEN#21 DEN#30 Jeff Green
DENVER: Dejounte Murray, KCP

One of the implications of this deal IMO is that rumors the Nuggets will sign this summer EuroLeague 2-time F4 MVP Vasilije Micic are maybe not just the rumors. The other positive thing is that no matter how we evaluate Barton or Morris's market value compared to KCP, I'm pretty sure that 3&D KCP is a better fit for 2022-23 Nuggets than any of these two! So, this is bad but not as bad as it maybe seems, and FO has enough space to show that this move is just one little part of the bigger picture of this summer changes.

THE J0KER wrote:One of the implications of this deal IMO is that rumors the Nuggets will sign this summer EuroLeague 2-time F4 MVP Vasilije Micic are maybe not just the rumors. The other positive thing is that no matter how we evaluate Barton or Morris's market value compared to KCP, I'm pretty sure that 3&D KCP is a better fit for 2022-23 Nuggets than any of these two! So, this is bad but not as bad as it maybe seems, and FO has enough space to show that this move is just one little part of the bigger picture of this summer changes.

Micic's rights are held by OKC, so IF these were anything more than Euro hopefuls, we'd have obtained his right when we traded Green there. Guess we can lay those rumors to rest !

skywalker33 wrote:

THE J0KER wrote:One of the implications of this deal IMO is that rumors the Nuggets will sign this summer EuroLeague 2-time F4 MVP Vasilije Micic are maybe not just the rumors. The other positive thing is that no matter how we evaluate Barton or Morris's market value compared to KCP, I'm pretty sure that 3&D KCP is a better fit for 2022-23 Nuggets than any of these two! So, this is bad but not as bad as it maybe seems, and FO has enough space to show that this move is just one little part of the bigger picture of this summer changes.

Micic's rights are held by OKC, so IF these were anything more than Euro hopefuls, we'd have obtained his right when we traded Green there. Guess we can lay those rumors to rest !

We can make another deal with OKC, especially now when the salary cap was relaxed after Barton/Morris deal. Don't forget that Micic is a player in his prime, three years younger than Facundo Campazzo, so his eventual contract will be more likely similar to Monte Morris than Facu, and I'm not sure we are ready for such a deal weeks ago.

THE J0KER wrote:

skywalker33 wrote:

THE J0KER wrote:One of the implications of this deal IMO is that rumors the Nuggets will sign this summer EuroLeague 2-time F4 MVP Vasilije Micic are maybe not just the rumors. The other positive thing is that no matter how we evaluate Barton or Morris's market value compared to KCP, I'm pretty sure that 3&D KCP is a better fit for 2022-23 Nuggets than any of these two! So, this is bad but not as bad as it maybe seems, and FO has enough space to show that this move is just one little part of the bigger picture of this summer changes.

Micic's rights are held by OKC, so IF these were anything more than Euro hopefuls, we'd have obtained his right when we traded Green there. Guess we can lay those rumors to rest !

We can make another deal with OKC, especially now when the salary cap was relaxed after Barton/Morris deal. Don't forget that Micic is a player in his prime, three years younger than Facundo Campazzo, so his eventual contract will be more likely similar to Monte Morris than Facu, and I'm not sure we are ready for such a deal weeks ago.

I'd agree we could make another deal with OKC, but right now there are other teams who look to get in on the bidding for his rights. If the rumors you relayed are correct, we should/could have obtained them within the Green deal. Not sure now we have the assets to do that anymore.

THE J0KER wrote:

skywalker33 wrote:

THE J0KER wrote:One of the implications of this deal IMO is that rumors the Nuggets will sign this summer EuroLeague 2-time F4 MVP Vasilije Micic are maybe not just the rumors. The other positive thing is that no matter how we evaluate Barton or Morris's market value compared to KCP, I'm pretty sure that 3&D KCP is a better fit for 2022-23 Nuggets than any of these two! So, this is bad but not as bad as it maybe seems, and FO has enough space to show that this move is just one little part of the bigger picture of this summer changes.

Micic's rights are held by OKC, so IF these were anything more than Euro hopefuls, we'd have obtained his right when we traded Green there. Guess we can lay those rumors to rest !

We can make another deal with OKC, especially now when the salary cap was relaxed after Barton/Morris deal. Don't forget that Micic is a player in his prime, three years younger than Facundo Campazzo, so his eventual contract will be more likely similar to Monte Morris than Facu, and I'm not sure we are ready for such a deal weeks ago.

The only thing we have left to trade is 1 of the 2nd round picks we got from the Thunder on the Green deal or one of our young players. I don't see anyways that we trade a young guy for Micic and then spend to the tax apron (which hard caps us) for a guy who has never played a minute in the NBA which is what a Morris deal would entail.

The Rebel wrote:

THE J0KER wrote:

skywalker33 wrote:
Micic's rights are held by OKC, so IF these were anything more than Euro hopefuls, we'd have obtained his right when we traded Green there. Guess we can lay those rumors to rest !

We can make another deal with OKC, especially now when the salary cap was relaxed after Barton/Morris deal. Don't forget that Micic is a player in his prime, three years younger than Facundo Campazzo, so his eventual contract will be more likely similar to Monte Morris than Facu, and I'm not sure we are ready for such a deal weeks ago.

The only thing we have left to trade is 1 of the 2nd round picks we got from the Thunder on the Green deal or one of our young players. I don't see anyways that we trade a young guy for Micic and then spend to the tax apron (which hard caps us) for a guy who has never played a minute in the NBA which is what a Morris deal would entail.

One of these two 2nds (or Ismael Kamagate) sounds fair, especially because Micic doesn't want to play for OKC anyway. As a key player for Turkish team Efes to win back-to-back Euroleague titles (both times final-four MVP) Micic probably has the highest price in Europe apart from Nikola Mirotic. The last time some "Euro star" come in his prime years was Bogdan Bogdanovic whose first NBA contract was a 27/3 deal with the Kings (but he was 25yo, not 28yo, so I guess Micic's price is about 5-7 for a year).

BTW talking about NBA prices for players from Europe did anyone have an idea what the current price is for Danilo Gallinari because there are rumors that Spurs will waive his expiring contract? No surprise if he is going to be our target as a key backup option for our frontcourt if his price declined enough.