2023 Offseason

[THE J0KER]

Very detailed picture of the Denver Nuggets' 2023 offseason case you can see here: Nuggets offseason primer: CBA restrictions, Jamal Murray extension, Bruce Brown free agency and more (thanks to skywalker33 for info)


This offseason was actually destined to be our front-office nightmare because we have a supermax superstar and two max-contract stars, and the market value of our player with the best "team-friendly" contract who is now FA is more than doubled.

But luckily, we won the 2023 ring, so no more "small market" troubles with the potential free agents who want to sign with the Nuggets this season, and Bruce Brown will not follow Jeramy Grant's example in instantly capitalizing on a great season in Denver, and even maybe Kroenke family will make some unusual luxury-tax changes to their usual ownership strategy because of the ring.

We won the 2023 playoff with a stacked 5+1 lineup helped by the rest of the bench only notable in C. Braun's case and partly J. Green. Literally, all our key players are in their prime years, so holding them all 7 would be enough for Denver to be the TOP3 contender for the 2024 ring even if FO does not do any useful moves about the rest of the roster this summer!

If you ask me, we need desperately another very good and useful player because it would be a big gamble that the perfect "all-healthy" postseason will repeat back-to-back. Is that 8th man Payton Watson or our new 2023 rookie, or some veteran will be attracted by our ring and friendly culture to make some noise? Or some trade will be made to give Denver a useful player and clean the luxury tax!

I expect the best-ever regular season record for the Nuggets next season with a fully recovered Murray continuing to play like a true all-star, and also I expect to see improvement of MPJ who still didn't recover from an injury like Murray and improvement of the Braun who already in his rookie season shows big potential. But in playoff now all pressure will be on us, and no guarantee health will be on a perfect level like this postseason. That is why we need to hold the winning 5+2 roster and add at least one very useful player.

[TunaFish]

Whatever plan Booth is working on has to include bringing back Jeff Green, Cancar and maybe Jordan with Ish Smith, all on veterans minimums. These four have meshed so well with the young core that they are needed. If any of this group want more than the minimum, they are likely gone, due to tax limitations.

They will need the entire taxpayer MLE to find a replacement for Bruce Brown.

[skywalker33]

Whatever plan Booth is working on has to include bringing back Jeff Green, Cancar and maybe Jordan with Ish Smith, all on veterans minimums. These four have meshed so well with the young core that they are needed. If any of this group want more than the minimum, they are likely gone, due to tax limitations.

They will need the entire taxpayer MLE to find a replacement for Bruce Brown.

I really don't see Ish back, and probably not DAJ either, just my opinion. Even Green, while part of this playoff rotation, his play was showing his age and it feels like it's time to see what we have in Nnaji in that role. And seems Nnaji was always thrust into a C role anyway, I agree it was outta position.Cancar is a given back here, didn't we just re-sign him to a 3-yr contract this year ?

As for Brown, it feels like he's in the moment but realizes this is a prime spot and he can get paid NEXT year. I'd say it's now closer to a 40% chance he stays, this looking like a possible dynasty team.

[TunaFish]

Whatever plan Booth is working on has to include bringing back Jeff Green, Cancar and maybe Jordan with Ish Smith, all on veterans minimums. These four have meshed so well with the young core that they are needed. If any of this group want more than the minimum, they are likely gone, due to tax limitations.

They will need the entire taxpayer MLE to find a replacement for Bruce Brown.

I really don't see Ish back, and probably not DAJ either, just my opinion. Even Green, while part of this playoff rotation, his play was showing his age and it feels like it's time to see what we have in Nnaji in that role. And seems Nnaji was always thrust into a C role anyway, I agree it was outta position.Cancar is a given back here, didn't we just re-sign him to a 3-yr contract this year ?

As for Brown, it feels like he's in the moment but realizes this is a prime spot and he can get paid NEXT year. I'd say it's now closer to a 40% chance he stays, this looking like a possible dynasty team.

My mistake on Cancar. I forgot he signed a three year guaranteed contract last July.

Thinking about Brown: assuming he opts out and becomes an unrestricted free agent, why can we not use the TPE created in the Morris trade at $9.2 million? That expires in July after Brown's option must be exercised.

Also, anyone seen Rebel lately?

[Manolito]

If Brown does not accept 7.8M offer, I am sure FO will try to use Monte's TPE. But if Brown renews, we won't be using it because we would exceed second apron. Another problem is with new CBA, difference between MLE and TMLE is way higher than it was, which makes more complicated another Brown esque signing

Basically I see two scenarios:
Brown renews with 7.8M, then TMLE for a Center.
Brown is gone, use TPMLE and Monte's TPE for a guard and or a center

With 11 players (9 + 2 explained above), I expect 3 more signings at minimum or second round rookie with first year salary. 14 players roster using all 3 two way contracts. 37th & 40th picks, Kamagate, Gillespie (two way), Maybe Jeff Green at minimum...many options to fill the roster. I only hope they add one - two veterans at the minimum, we can not rely too much on youth.

Candidates for TMLE (guards): Josh Richardson, Levert (maybe too optimistic), Lonnie Walker. Less appealing Beverly or Schroder.
As Center I only see Plumlee. I would also pay Drummond a bit more than minimum.

[skywalker33]

One thing brought up here is who takes that next step ? Many, including myself, expect Peyton Watson to take a step forward in his development, but will it be enough to contribute to this rotation. Another unknown is Colin Gillespie, the UDFA point guard who got injured before the season even started. He has a strong pedigree (coach's son, came from a winning college program, etc) but we didn't get to see what he can bring, do we need to fill a backup PG role ? Bruce Brown is yet another question mark, does he stay like he stated right after winning the championship or does he follow the money and if he does, do we already have or do we need to try and fill that role ? With news coming out that Israel Karmagate probably won't be coming over this year, do we find a 1-year stop-gap or try and fill a backup Center long-term ?

[DaFan334]

One thing brought up here is who takes that next step ? Many, including myself, expect Peyton Watson to take a step forward in his development, but will it be enough to contribute to this rotation. Another unknown is Colin Gillespie, the UDFA point guard who got injured before the season even started. He has a strong pedigree (coach's son, came from a winning college program, etc) but we didn't get to see what he can bring, do we need to fill a backup PG role ? Bruce Brown is yet another question mark, does he stay like he stated right after winning the championship or does he follow the money and if he does, do we already have or do we need to try and fill that role ? With news coming out that Israel Karmagate probably won't be coming over this year, do we find a 1-year stop-gap or try and fill a backup Center long-term ?

Zeke Nnaji is another guy in this conversation. I'm wondering what the plan is for Zeke and if there is a mutual interest to keep him around. It's been frustrating that he continues to find himself on the outside of the rotation, but with the uncertainty of Jeff Green, he makes the most sense finally filling that role.

[TunaFish]

I was shocked to see Bruce Brown leading cheers of "one more year" from the crowd. I have always assumed Brown would leave for more money when he is due to exercise his out clause (which seems logical). However, now I am not so sure.

How can they bring Bruce Brown back? Would it be a similar deal used by the Bucks to retain Bobby Portis? A wink/wink deal of one season to acquire Bird rights?

[TunaFish]

If Brown does not accept 7.8M offer, I am sure FO will try to use Monte's TPE. But if Brown renews, we won't be using it because we would exceed second apron. Another problem is with new CBA, difference between MLE and TMLE is way higher than it was, which makes more complicated another Brown esque signing

Basically I see two scenarios:
Brown renews with 7.8M, then TMLE for a Center.
Brown is gone, use TPMLE and Monte's TPE for a guard and or a center

With 11 players (9 + 2 explained above), I expect 3 more signings at minimum or second round rookie with first year salary. 14 players roster using all 3 two way contracts. 37th & 40th picks, Kamagate, Gillespie (two way), Maybe Jeff Green at minimum...many options to fill the roster. I only hope they add one - two veterans at the minimum, we can not rely too much on youth.

Candidates for TMLE (guards): Josh Richardson, Levert (maybe too optimistic), Lonnie Walker. Less appealing Beverly or Schroder.
As Center I only see Plumlee. I would also pay Drummond a bit more than minimum.

I think it likely that they will try to retain Brown but how is a mystery.

[DaFan334]

I was shocked to see Bruce Brown leading cheers of "one more year" from the crowd. I have always assumed Brown would leave for more money when he is due to exercise his out clause (which sees logical). However, now I am not so sure.

How can they bring Bruce Brown back? Would it be a similar deal used by the Bucks to retain Bobby Portis? A wink/wink deal of one season to acquire Bird rights?

I think the Portis deal is the likely blueprint. The really hard thing about that is going to be this new second apron from my understanding and might force some tough decisions down the road with some of our other core players. You also have to consider his agent and others will be in his ear telling him to go for more money. Some of the logic about potential earnings is hard to ignore once the championship hangover wears off.

I think the hope is that Braun can eventually replace KCP by the time KCP's contract is over and then PWat can replace Gordon or MPJ eventually. MPJ's contact may eventually lead to him being moved, but I still think he has continued to develop very well and despite a slump in the finals, can be a pivotal member of the team going forward in trying to make this a Dynasty.

[Manolito]

Great news, 23/24 salary cap has increased, which increases second apron 3M$ more, up to 182.5M$

We are at 163.8M$ with 9 players, 19M$ away. Assuming Bruce renews at 7.8M$ at we spend TMLE and 29th draft pick, we still have 4M$ to fill in the roster with 2-3 more players. That means we can still afford a minimum veteran (Jeff Green) without trading Nnaji

I see highly unlikely we select three new players today

[THE J0KER]

We should offer the Wizards our 2023 #37 pick for their 2023 #8 pick. Washington suddenly started selling off its best assets to 2024 title contenders for next to nothing this week, so we should jump at the chance!

[TunaFish]

I didn't see any big men drafted. Does that mean that Jordan is returning, maybe on a veteran's minimum contract?

[THE J0KER]

I didn't see any big men drafted. Does that mean that Jordan is returning, maybe on a veteran's minimum contract?

I'm not sure Jordan wants to stay in NBA anymore to play for veteran minimum as a former all-star who finally grab the ring.

[skywalker33]

Well, feels like we got our backup PG position filled, Pickett was a good pick IMO. We absolutely need to find relief for when Joker is on the bench, I'm still hoping Karmagate comes over ( at least see how he looks in SL play). The selection of Strawther makes me ponder the strong possibility that Brown will be replaced with a Braun/Watson combination with Strawther hopefully providing some two-way play off the bench, particularly some offense.

[skywalker33]

Beal to the Suns, Smart to the Grizz, even CP3 to the Warriors, and yet none of them appear anywhere closer to threatening the Nuggets IMO, they just don't get it. I feel our biggest weapon (beyond Jokic) is team chemistry. Now the West has a lot of talent, but none of them will have the chemistry and team play we have here in Denver.

[THE J0KER]

Beal to the Suns, Smart to the Grizz, even CP3 to the Warriors, and yet none of them appear anywhere closer to threatening the Nuggets IMO, they just don't get it. I feel our biggest weapon (beyond Jokic) is team chemistry. Now the West has a lot of talent, but none of them will have the chemistry and team play we have here in Denver.

If we re-sign B.Brown and be again injury free in playoffs, our team can be even better than this year with the additional and expected improvement of MPJ and C.Braun. But to be fair, our biggest 2023 enemy Suns will make an even bigger improvement by adding NBA TOP30 Beal instead of veteran CP3 who was injured already during game#2.

[lilfishi22]

Hey fellas, first of all, congrats on winning your first title and as a Suns fan, I sure hope to be in that club one day.

I'm curious to know your take on MPJ in relation to his production per dollar and long term plans with him. Over on the Suns board, there's been a lot of discussion about moving Ayton for depth pieces because DA on the max (similar to MPJ on the max) doesn't appear to be the best allocation of financial resources. Is he a long-term piece for you guys or is it a case of, if you can turn him into another starter and 1-2 rotation guys, you'd do that?

[skywalker33]

Hey fellas, first of all, congrats on winning your first title and as a Suns fan, I sure hope to be in that club one day.

I'm curious to know your take on MPJ in relation to his production per dollar and long term plans with him. Over on the Suns board, there's been a lot of discussion about moving Ayton for depth pieces because DA on the max (similar to MPJ on the max) doesn't appear to be the best allocation of financial resources. Is he a long-term piece for you guys or is it a case of, if you can turn him into another starter and 1-2 rotation guys, you'd do that?

Well, obviously we'd like more consistency in his play, many expect his playoff dropoff to get better with better health this season, we'll have to see what turns up. But ask yourself why the hell would we consider DA when Jokic would be playing ahead of him ?? And with his poor playoff performance (even compared to MPJ's) I wouldn't touch Ayton, he just disappeared. Then you have to consider helping out a rival in the Western Conference, probably not gonna happen. There are plenty of teams that might be interested, but DEN isn't one of them

[lilfishi22]

Hey fellas, first of all, congrats on winning your first title and as a Suns fan, I sure hope to be in that club one day.

I'm curious to know your take on MPJ in relation to his production per dollar and long term plans with him. Over on the Suns board, there's been a lot of discussion about moving Ayton for depth pieces because DA on the max (similar to MPJ on the max) doesn't appear to be the best allocation of financial resources. Is he a long-term piece for you guys or is it a case of, if you can turn him into another starter and 1-2 rotation guys, you'd do that?

Well, obviously we'd like more consistency in his play, many expect his playoff dropoff to get better with better health this season, we'll have to see what turns up. But ask yourself why the hell would we consider DA when Jokic would be playing ahead of him ?? And with his poor playoff performance (even compared to MPJ's) I wouldn't touch Ayton, he just disappeared. Then you have to consider helping out a rival in the Western Conference, probably not gonna happen. There are plenty of teams that might be interested, but DEN isn't one of them

Oh this is not a trade idea/proposal. I just wanted to get your guys feeling of a player on a max contract who has been underwhelming and whether there's any thoughts of a better use of that salary.