NFL MVP with 2 weeks to go !

Jaydubb · Post #21 » by **Jaydubb** » Mon Dec 30, 2024 3:57 pm

My vote still goes to josh allen

Mariner · Post #22 » by **Mariner** » Mon Dec 30, 2024 4:11 pm

Jaydubb wrote:My vote still goes to josh allen

Not a bad vote.
My vote would go to Barkley.
If Barkley doesn’t win it no running back will in the future. 2000 yards is pretty special.

Jaydubb · Post #23 » by **Jaydubb** » Mon Dec 30, 2024 4:40 pm

Mariner wrote:
Jaydubb wrote:My vote still goes to josh allen

Not a bad vote.
My vote would go to Barkley.
If Barkley doesn’t win it no running back will in the future. 2000 yards is pretty special.

I’ve said this before but if I had a vote for mvp on the eagles, it would go to the OL or the defensive coordinator. I’m not trying to take anything away from saquon, but those holes are absolutely enormous and I think the OL doesn’t get the credit that they deserve.

I don’t expect saquon to play next week but if he does and breaks the record, then I think it’s a better possibility because it will give something for voters to talk about, breaking a record that has stood for 40 years.

JujitsuFlip · Post #24 » by **JujitsuFlip** » Mon Dec 30, 2024 5:21 pm

QB_Eagles wrote:
bluejerseyjinx wrote:Leaning towards Burrow now. Just like last year, Egals back in choke mode. Barkley out.

You said the Chiefs were on a two-week bye.

Burrow can't make the playoffs without the Chiefs beating the Broncos next week.

When was the last time a player who didn't make the playoffs won MVP?

Edit: I looked it up. It was in 1967.

Nah, OJ won it in 1973 and the Bills did not qualify for the playoffs.

hermes · Post #25 » by **hermes** » Mon Dec 30, 2024 6:53 pm

adrian won in 2012 with over 2k
i didn't realize saquon was that close

Jaydubb · Post #26 » by **Jaydubb** » Mon Dec 30, 2024 7:39 pm

hermes wrote:adrian won in 2012 with over 2k
i didn't realize saquon was that close

When it comes to stats, I think it’s close. But I also think this eagles OL is better than that Vikings OL.

But AP was also like 5 yards away from the record so yeah it’s not the record, but it’s very close to the record. It doesn’t hurt that the year before (in 2011), Adrian Peterson tore his ACL and MCL. The very next year he comes back and almost breaks the nfl record. I think it was such a good story that the voters had to give MVP to him all things considered.

Personally, I think mvp has turned into a QB award but I think the exception is if a position player breaks a record and/or has a good story attached to it like Adrian Peterson coming back from knee surgery for example.

Post #27 » by **Duke4life831** » Mon Dec 30, 2024 10:21 pm

Just throwing this out there.

Say Darnold throws for 350 yards and 3 TDs next week and beats the Lions and the Vikings end up with the #1 seed and Darnold ends up with

4500 yards and 38 TDs, ties the record for most 100+ QB rating games in a season.

I feel like if his name was a more established name, this would be a 3 man race for the MVP.

Just saying…

GeorgeSears · Post #28 » by **GeorgeSears** » Mon Dec 30, 2024 10:38 pm

Is Josh Allen really having a better year than Lamar or are we victims of voter fatigue? I don't think so.

Lamar won MVP last season during a weak year, but he's having a much better year this time around.

For me it's:

1. Lamar
2. Saquon
3. Allen

I think Saquon should get it if he breaks the record.

azcatz11 · Post #29 » by **azcatz11** » Mon Dec 30, 2024 11:11 pm

Duke4life831 wrote:Just throwing this out there.

Say Darnold throws for 350 yards and 3 TDs next week and beats the Lions and the Vikings end up with the #1 seed and Darnold ends up with

4500 yards and 38 TDs, ties the record for most 100+ QB rating games in a season.

I feel like if his name was a more established name, this would be a 3 man race for the MVP.

Just saying…

He’s 5th in the ladder rn. I agree though. It’s probably impossible for a “journeyman” QB like him to ever win the award even though he was a top 3 pick. That stigma is going to stick with him.

azcatz11 · Post #30 » by **azcatz11** » Mon Dec 30, 2024 11:12 pm

Jaydubb wrote:My vote still goes to josh allen

Allen has poor skill position players around him. He basically has James Cook that’s it. If Allen had Chase + Higgins he may throw for 60 TDs if they let him do what they’re letting burrow doing

JujitsuFlip · Post #31 » by **JujitsuFlip** » Tue Dec 31, 2024 4:02 am

azcatz11 wrote:If Allen had Chase + Higgins he may throw for 60 TDs if they let him do what they’re letting burrow do

This is such a fallacy you have created lol

2018: 18 td (10 pass td 8 rush td)
2019: 29 td (20 pass td 9 rush td)
2020: 45 td (37 pass td 8 rush td)
2021: 42 td (36 pass td 6 rush td)
2022: 42 td (35 pass td 7 rush td)
2023: 44 td (29 pass td 15 rush td)
2024: 40 td (28 pass td 12 rush td)

Burrow this season with 1 game left to go... 44 td (42 pass td 2 rush td)

In 2020 Stefon Diggs led the league in receiving yards and receptions; he was Pro Bowl and All-Pro. Heck, Beasley nearly had 1,000 yards receiving that season and he was All-Pro too.

In 2021 Diggs went for over 1,000 again was still Pro Bowl. Beasley was still there, 1 season removed from being All-Pro. They added old man Emmanuel Sanders as their 3rd WR who was only a few seasons removed from being Pro Bowl. Plus, Gabe Davis was the perfect 4th WR/red zone target.

They traded Diggs. They let Beasley seek a trade and when he couldn't find one, they released him. Sanders retired. They let Davis walk in free agency. You claim Cook is the only skill position player that Allen has, it is the Bills own fault.

Higgins has never been All-Pro or a Pro Bowler. Chase hasn't been All-Pro since his rookie season. By accolades, Allen has had better WR corps than Burrow...

bluejerseyjinx · Post #32 » by **bluejerseyjinx** » Tue Dec 31, 2024 4:05 am

JujitsuFlip wrote:
azcatz11 wrote:If Allen had Chase + Higgins he may throw for 60 TDs if they let him do what they’re letting burrow do

This is such a fallacy you have created lol

2018: 18 td (10 pass td 8 rush td)
2019: 29 td (20 pass td 9 rush td)
2020: 45 td (37 pass td 8 rush td)
2021: 42 td (36 pass td 6 rush td)
2022: 42 td (35 pass td 7 rush td)
2023: 44 td (29 pass td 15 rush td)
2024: 40 td (28 pass td 12 rush td)

Burrow this season with 1 game left to go... 44 td (42 pass td 2 rush td)

In 2020 Stefon Diggs led the league in receiving yards and receptions; he was Pro Bowl and All-Pro. Heck, Beasley nearly had 1,000 yards receiving that season and he was All-Pro too.

In 2021 Diggs went for over 1,000 again was still Pro Bowl. Beasley was still there, 1 season removed from being All-Pro. They added old man Emmanuel Sanders as their 3rd WR who was only a few seasons removed from being Pro Bowl. Plus, Gabe Davis was the perfect 4th WR/red zone target.

They traded Diggs. They let Beasley seek a trade and when he couldn't find one, they released him. Sanders retired. They let Davis walk in free agency. You claim Cook is the only skill position player that Allen has, it is the Bills own fault.

Higgins has never been All-Pro or a Pro Bowler. Chase hasn't been All-Pro since his rookie season. By accolades, Allen has had better WR corps than Burrow...

QB_Eagles · Post #33 » by **QB_Eagles** » Tue Dec 31, 2024 10:47 am

JujitsuFlip wrote:
azcatz11 wrote:If Allen had Chase + Higgins he may throw for 60 TDs if they let him do what they’re letting burrow do

This is such a fallacy you have created lol

2018: 18 td (10 pass td 8 rush td)
2019: 29 td (20 pass td 9 rush td)
2020: 45 td (37 pass td 8 rush td)
2021: 42 td (36 pass td 6 rush td)
2022: 42 td (35 pass td 7 rush td)
2023: 44 td (29 pass td 15 rush td)
2024: 40 td (28 pass td 12 rush td)

Burrow this season with 1 game left to go... 44 td (42 pass td 2 rush td)

In 2020 Stefon Diggs led the league in receiving yards and receptions; he was Pro Bowl and All-Pro. Heck, Beasley nearly had 1,000 yards receiving that season and he was All-Pro too.

In 2021 Diggs went for over 1,000 again was still Pro Bowl. Beasley was still there, 1 season removed from being All-Pro. They added old man Emmanuel Sanders as their 3rd WR who was only a few seasons removed from being Pro Bowl. Plus, Gabe Davis was the perfect 4th WR/red zone target.

They traded Diggs. They let Beasley seek a trade and when he couldn't find one, they released him. Sanders retired. They let Davis walk in free agency. You claim Cook is the only skill position player that Allen has, it is the Bills own fault.

Higgins has never been All-Pro or a Pro Bowler. Chase hasn't been All-Pro since his rookie season. By accolades, Allen has had better WR corps than Burrow...

Josh Allen had the better WR corps because Cole Beasley got a single All-Pro vote in 2020. :crazy:

azcatz11 · Post #34 » by **azcatz11** » Tue Dec 31, 2024 2:44 pm

JujitsuFlip wrote:
azcatz11 wrote:If Allen had Chase + Higgins he may throw for 60 TDs if they let him do what they’re letting burrow do

This is such a fallacy you have created lol

2018: 18 td (10 pass td 8 rush td)
2019: 29 td (20 pass td 9 rush td)
2020: 45 td (37 pass td 8 rush td)
2021: 42 td (36 pass td 6 rush td)
2022: 42 td (35 pass td 7 rush td)
2023: 44 td (29 pass td 15 rush td)
2024: 40 td (28 pass td 12 rush td)

Burrow this season with 1 game left to go... 44 td (42 pass td 2 rush td)

In 2020 Stefon Diggs led the league in receiving yards and receptions; he was Pro Bowl and All-Pro. Heck, Beasley nearly had 1,000 yards receiving that season and he was All-Pro too.

In 2021 Diggs went for over 1,000 again was still Pro Bowl. Beasley was still there, 1 season removed from being All-Pro. They added old man Emmanuel Sanders as their 3rd WR who was only a few seasons removed from being Pro Bowl. Plus, Gabe Davis was the perfect 4th WR/red zone target.

They traded Diggs. They let Beasley seek a trade and when he couldn't find one, they released him. Sanders retired. They let Davis walk in free agency. You claim Cook is the only skill position player that Allen has, it is the Bills own fault.

Higgins has never been All-Pro or a Pro Bowler. Chase hasn't been All-Pro since his rookie season. By accolades, Allen has had better WR corps than Burrow...

Allen: better deep ball passer, mobility, twitchier arm (can hit more throws than Burrow anywhere on the field)

Burrow: more accurate intermediate, better pocket awareness, moves better in the pocket, better decision maker

Do you agree with the above? Feels like we're splitting hairs a bit but that's kind of how I see it. Diggs, at best, was a Tier 2 receiver. I don't think anyone ever had him Tier 1. Even in 2020 I don't think people thought he was Tier 1. Hopkins, Adams + Tyreek were probably the best receivers that year and Diggs a level below. JJ also his rookie year.

JujitsuFlip · Post #35 » by **JujitsuFlip** » Tue Dec 31, 2024 5:17 pm

QB_Eagles wrote:
JujitsuFlip wrote:
azcatz11 wrote:If Allen had Chase + Higgins he may throw for 60 TDs if they let him do what they’re letting burrow do

This is such a fallacy you have created lol

2018: 18 td (10 pass td 8 rush td)
2019: 29 td (20 pass td 9 rush td)
2020: 45 td (37 pass td 8 rush td)
2021: 42 td (36 pass td 6 rush td)
2022: 42 td (35 pass td 7 rush td)
2023: 44 td (29 pass td 15 rush td)
2024: 40 td (28 pass td 12 rush td)

Burrow this season with 1 game left to go... 44 td (42 pass td 2 rush td)

In 2020 Stefon Diggs led the league in receiving yards and receptions; he was Pro Bowl and All-Pro. Heck, Beasley nearly had 1,000 yards receiving that season and he was All-Pro too.

In 2021 Diggs went for over 1,000 again was still Pro Bowl. Beasley was still there, 1 season removed from being All-Pro. They added old man Emmanuel Sanders as their 3rd WR who was only a few seasons removed from being Pro Bowl. Plus, Gabe Davis was the perfect 4th WR/red zone target.

They traded Diggs. They let Beasley seek a trade and when he couldn't find one, they released him. Sanders retired. They let Davis walk in free agency. You claim Cook is the only skill position player that Allen has, it is the Bills own fault.

Higgins has never been All-Pro or a Pro Bowler. Chase hasn't been All-Pro since his rookie season. By accolades, Allen has had better WR corps than Burrow...

Josh Allen had the better WR corps because Cole Beasley got a single All-Pro vote in 2020.

Higgins has never received a single accolade. When Boyd was in Cincinnati, not a single accolade. Burrow never had a good 4th WR.

So yes, when Allen has a Pro Bowl WR, a 1 season removed All-Pro receiver, a few season removed Pro Bowl wide out, and Gabe Davis as his 4th option/red zone target... Then yes, by accolades, that is a better corps than Burrow has ever had to throw to in a single season.

The only other PB or AP wide receiver Burrow had to throw to was AJ Green and him and Chase were never on the Bengals simultaneously.

JujitsuFlip · Post #36 » by **JujitsuFlip** » Tue Dec 31, 2024 5:25 pm

azcatz11 wrote:
JujitsuFlip wrote:
azcatz11 wrote:If Allen had Chase + Higgins he may throw for 60 TDs if they let him do what they’re letting burrow do

This is such a fallacy you have created lol

2018: 18 td (10 pass td 8 rush td)
2019: 29 td (20 pass td 9 rush td)
2020: 45 td (37 pass td 8 rush td)
2021: 42 td (36 pass td 6 rush td)
2022: 42 td (35 pass td 7 rush td)
2023: 44 td (29 pass td 15 rush td)
2024: 40 td (28 pass td 12 rush td)

Burrow this season with 1 game left to go... 44 td (42 pass td 2 rush td)

In 2020 Stefon Diggs led the league in receiving yards and receptions; he was Pro Bowl and All-Pro. Heck, Beasley nearly had 1,000 yards receiving that season and he was All-Pro too.

In 2021 Diggs went for over 1,000 again was still Pro Bowl. Beasley was still there, 1 season removed from being All-Pro. They added old man Emmanuel Sanders as their 3rd WR who was only a few seasons removed from being Pro Bowl. Plus, Gabe Davis was the perfect 4th WR/red zone target.

They traded Diggs. They let Beasley seek a trade and when he couldn't find one, they released him. Sanders retired. They let Davis walk in free agency. You claim Cook is the only skill position player that Allen has, it is the Bills own fault.

Higgins has never been All-Pro or a Pro Bowler. Chase hasn't been All-Pro since his rookie season. By accolades, Allen has had better WR corps than Burrow...

Allen: better deep ball passer, mobility, twitchier arm (can hit more throws than Burrow anywhere on the field)

Burrow: more accurate intermediate, better pocket awareness, moves better in the pocket, better decision maker

Do you agree with the above? Feels like we're splitting hairs a bit but that's kind of how I see it. Diggs, at best, was a Tier 2 receiver. I don't think anyone ever had him Tier 1. Even in 2020 I don't think people thought he was Tier 1. Hopkins, Adams + Tyreek were probably the best receivers that year and Diggs a level below. JJ also his rookie year.

I'll put it to you this way, you can gift Allen whoever you believe the best 2 WR in history, in their primes and Allen still wouldn't throw 60 TD in that season. He's not accurate enough and relies on his legs to score too much.

Manning holds the record with 55 passing TD in a season and he's as pure of a pocket passer as the league ever witnessed.

Post #37 » by **Duke4life831** » Tue Dec 31, 2024 5:39 pm

azcatz11 wrote:
JujitsuFlip wrote:
azcatz11 wrote:If Allen had Chase + Higgins he may throw for 60 TDs if they let him do what they’re letting burrow do

This is such a fallacy you have created lol

2018: 18 td (10 pass td 8 rush td)
2019: 29 td (20 pass td 9 rush td)
2020: 45 td (37 pass td 8 rush td)
2021: 42 td (36 pass td 6 rush td)
2022: 42 td (35 pass td 7 rush td)
2023: 44 td (29 pass td 15 rush td)
2024: 40 td (28 pass td 12 rush td)

Burrow this season with 1 game left to go... 44 td (42 pass td 2 rush td)

In 2020 Stefon Diggs led the league in receiving yards and receptions; he was Pro Bowl and All-Pro. Heck, Beasley nearly had 1,000 yards receiving that season and he was All-Pro too.

In 2021 Diggs went for over 1,000 again was still Pro Bowl. Beasley was still there, 1 season removed from being All-Pro. They added old man Emmanuel Sanders as their 3rd WR who was only a few seasons removed from being Pro Bowl. Plus, Gabe Davis was the perfect 4th WR/red zone target.

They traded Diggs. They let Beasley seek a trade and when he couldn't find one, they released him. Sanders retired. They let Davis walk in free agency. You claim Cook is the only skill position player that Allen has, it is the Bills own fault.

Higgins has never been All-Pro or a Pro Bowler. Chase hasn't been All-Pro since his rookie season. By accolades, Allen has had better WR corps than Burrow...

Allen: better deep ball passer, mobility, twitchier arm (can hit more throws than Burrow anywhere on the field)

Burrow: more accurate intermediate, better pocket awareness, moves better in the pocket, better decision maker

Do you agree with the above? Feels like we're splitting hairs a bit but that's kind of how I see it. Diggs, at best, was a Tier 2 receiver. I don't think anyone ever had him Tier 1. Even in 2020 I don't think people thought he was Tier 1. Hopkins, Adams + Tyreek were probably the best receivers that year and Diggs a level below. JJ also his rookie year.

I’ll push back on a couple things here. Pocket awareness and moving in the pocket, I would give Allen the edge. He does have a pretty good O line, but the dude just doesn’t take sacks anymore. The last 2 seasons combined, he’s taken 38 sacks. Jalen Hurts has 38 sacks this year in just 15 games and his O line is as good as it gets.

I know sacks don’t tell the whole story on pocket awareness, but Allen truly has become elite in this area. Dude senses pressure as good as anyone and move in and out of the pocket beautifully.

Micah Prescott · Post #38 » by **Micah Prescott** » Tue Dec 31, 2024 5:40 pm

Lamar Jackson has the best individual numbers of all of the candidates.

39 TDs only 4 INTs

*WITH nearly 1,000 rushing and 4 rushing TDs

It's extremely impressive

it *SHOULD* be him but it won't be, I think Allen will get the nod.

Micah Prescott · Post #39 » by **Micah Prescott** » Tue Dec 31, 2024 5:43 pm

Burrow has zero chance and most understand that his numbers are highly inflated because Cincy has a bottom-5 defense

Jaydubb · Post #40 » by **Jaydubb** » Tue Dec 31, 2024 5:59 pm

It’s wild to me that the eagles are even considering playing the starters in week 18 until saquon gets the record. Maybe I’m old school but I just feel like that puts bad energy out there. The main goal should always be get to the Super Bowl. Playing starters won’t matter so risking injury is 100% unnecessary.

And it’s not even about risking saquon alone, if a guy like lane Johnson or Jordan mailata go down it might actually be just as big of an issue for the eagles.