NFL Draft Discussion

[Dr Positivity]

I don't really know anything about the NFL Draft, but Josh Allen 1st sounds like a terrible idea. QB with mediocre stats and mental game but IZ TALL WITH BIG HANDS!!!

[DirtyDez]

My dude...

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[righterwriter]

I don't really know anything about the NFL Draft, but Josh Allen 1st sounds like a terrible idea. QB with mediocre stats and mental game but IZ TALL WITH BIG HANDS!!!

I'm confused on Josh Allen, as well. He's got prototype size, a world class arm, great intangibles, excellent athleticism, and seems super coachable but he just wasn't very good at being an actual QB in college.

I think a lot of coaches want someone they believe they can mold into a QB for their system. They may talk themselves into looking past some things that they shouldn't, but it can be irresistible to have a potential #1 QB that can do everything on the field.

As far as the inaccuracy goes, there have been plenty of inaccurate college QBs that turned out great in the NFL (Favre and Drew Bledsoe, even Joe Montana), but at the same time, there have been even more massive busts. It's mostly about the ability to react quickly on the field and know what to do against defensive schemes. I have no idea how Allen is at this, but if he's being considered top-10, then some coaches must think he has something to him.

Can't wait to see where he goes. I'm guessing that Buffalo gets him, one way or another.

[FNQ]

The Buffalo Bills will draft Lamar Jackson at pick number 12.

I honestly do not believe he will be there at 12.The top 4 QBs should go in the top 6 picks (assuming IND is willing to trade down) meaning a QB needy team will need to jump in the top 10 to get Jackson, as they should. The Bucs, the Bears, the 9ers, and the Raiders all should be very interested in moving down, and teams like the Cardinals, Ravens, Bengals, and Dolphins all should be very interested in moving up to take a QB. With a dark horse being the Pats moving up. Also wouldnt shock me to see PIT or JAX move up.. but I'm pretty sure teams are looking at MIA/BUF and thinking that those are the teams they need to jump to get one of the top 5 QBs in this draft.

You're speaking for yourself, correct? Wild trade scenarios here. Draft day trades (to jump into Top 10) do not happen often. I don't know why those teams you listed will trade down. To get more picks? Is that all? Why? Most of them will stay pat and get their guy in the top 10. It's hard enough to get crack into Top 10 in the first place. Most teams don't trade down unless it's a big deal for a Top 10 pick.

I'm not worried about the Pats. They do not have enough in their draft pick stock pile to jump ahead of the Buffalo Bills to get Jackson.

Steelers don't have enough either to move up. They have the 28th pick. That's too low to trade up.

Jacksonville? They're set with Blake Bortles at QB. They have the 29th pick. That's too low to trade up past Buffalo.

Cardinals have the 15th pick. It's going to be very difficult for them to move up when Buffalo has the 12th pick work to trade, too.

Baltimore has 16th pick. Nope, don't see B-More trading up and they still have Joe Flacco at QB. I think they stick with him for another 2 years.

Cincy Bengals have Andy Dalton and the 21st pick. Nah, I don't see them making much trade noise.

The only true threats that can wreck Lamar Jackson to Buffalo Bills are Miami Dolphins and any team currently in the Top 10. Dolphins fan base and beat writers are big on Vita Vea, Roquan Smith, and Minkah Fitzpatrick. Their QB position is not high on their list according to them. The QB they want is Josh Rosen. Some want Lamar Jackson, but they're not screaming for him.

We'll see on Draft Night.

2016

Eagles started with the 13th pick
Rams started with the 15th pick

Eagles pick Wentz 2nd
Rams pick Goff first

When there is a glut of high end QBs, trades will happen. And as clearly shown, you do not need a top 10 pick to trade for a higher top 10 pick. Teams in the teens got the two best QBs just 2 years ago.

And the Jags aren’t set at QB, not are the Saints or Steelers. The Jags are going year to year with Bortles, and the other two teams have QBs teetering on the brink of retirement but otherwise have contending rosters.

[FNQ]

Now it’s leaking that Browns are cooling on Darnold and it’s Mayfield or Allen at #1.

And it’s not Allen. Barring a NYG trade, the Jets are going to land their #1 overall guy at #3. Brilliant move, so long as the Broncos and Giants don’t start talking

[Mich3006]

Now it’s leaking that Browns are cooling on Darnold and it’s Mayfield or Allen at #1.

And it’s not Allen. Barring a NYG trade, the Jets are going to land their #1 overall guy at #3. Brilliant move, so long as the Broncos and Giants don’t start talking

Mayfield with the #1 is just stupid tbh, but it´s the Browns, no surprise though.

Giants are really high on Barkley, it´d take a boatload of picks to get them off their #2.

[Bulltalk]

My lady is a Sooner, so I watch all Sooner games. Of the top five QB's, I would probably say that Mayfield is the least likely to be a bust, barring injuries. I'm not saying he'll be the best of the bunch, but I highly doubt he'll be the least of the bunch. Watching him the last few years, he hit everybody, be it in the pocket or on the move, long pass or short. The guy has Brett Favre confidence in himself, thinks he can make every play at any time. I know that can be a detriment at times, but you've got to love the self belief.

[anatomicbomb]

I honestly do not believe he will be there at 12.The top 4 QBs should go in the top 6 picks (assuming IND is willing to trade down) meaning a QB needy team will need to jump in the top 10 to get Jackson, as they should. The Bucs, the Bears, the 9ers, and the Raiders all should be very interested in moving down, and teams like the Cardinals, Ravens, Bengals, and Dolphins all should be very interested in moving up to take a QB. With a dark horse being the Pats moving up. Also wouldnt shock me to see PIT or JAX move up.. but I'm pretty sure teams are looking at MIA/BUF and thinking that those are the teams they need to jump to get one of the top 5 QBs in this draft.

You're speaking for yourself, correct? Wild trade scenarios here. Draft day trades (to jump into Top 10) do not happen often. I don't know why those teams you listed will trade down. To get more picks? Is that all? Why? Most of them will stay pat and get their guy in the top 10. It's hard enough to get crack into Top 10 in the first place. Most teams don't trade down unless it's a big deal for a Top 10 pick.

I'm not worried about the Pats. They do not have enough in their draft pick stock pile to jump ahead of the Buffalo Bills to get Jackson.

Steelers don't have enough either to move up. They have the 28th pick. That's too low to trade up.

Jacksonville? They're set with Blake Bortles at QB. They have the 29th pick. That's too low to trade up past Buffalo.

Cardinals have the 15th pick. It's going to be very difficult for them to move up when Buffalo has the 12th pick work to trade, too.

Baltimore has 16th pick. Nope, don't see B-More trading up and they still have Joe Flacco at QB. I think they stick with him for another 2 years.

Cincy Bengals have Andy Dalton and the 21st pick. Nah, I don't see them making much trade noise.

The only true threats that can wreck Lamar Jackson to Buffalo Bills are Miami Dolphins and any team currently in the Top 10. Dolphins fan base and beat writers are big on Vita Vea, Roquan Smith, and Minkah Fitzpatrick. Their QB position is not high on their list according to them. The QB they want is Josh Rosen. Some want Lamar Jackson, but they're not screaming for him.

We'll see on Draft Night.

2016

Eagles started with the 13th pick
Rams started with the 15th pick

Eagles pick Wentz 2nd
Rams pick Goff first

When there is a glut of high end QBs, trades will happen. And as clearly shown, you do not need a top 10 pick to trade for a higher top 10 pick. Teams in the teens got the two best QBs just 2 years ago.

And the Jags aren’t set at QB, not are the Saints or Steelers. The Jags are going year to year with Bortles, and the other two teams have QBs teetering on the brink of retirement but otherwise have contending rosters.

I've also seen in a couple of places that GMs are bullish on next year's QB crop (e.g., Patterson, Lock, Thorson), so they might wait out this year for their QB of the future. Could lead to more trade-downs, or just not that many being taken in the 1st. Regardless, with a number of highly rated QBs in this draft, and a dearth of them in the NFL (albeit this offseason is better than last, after the recent FA signings and the late blooming of a few pros during the 17-18 season), projecting the draft is comparable to guessing the lottery balls.

[righterwriter]

My ranking of the top-4 QBs

4) Allen --- Could end up #1 by a mile, but historically speaking about raw, talented QBs, the odds are against it. Should be the last of the 4 taken.

3) Mayfield --- I like a lot about him, but I honestly think that he's got two things against him: He's small. Not that this is impossible to overcome, but there are only a handful of 6'1, 215lb starting QBs in the league (R.Wilson, C.Keenum, and T.Taylor). And also I don't like his attitude. I don't have a problem with the crotch grab so much, but the cockiness bordering on disrespect is not good to see. Watch his self produced reality show on behindbaker.com . He's likable at times, but cringeworthy at others, so I could see him following Manziel in the self destructive role.

2) Darnold --- Safe pick. Will at the very least be an above average starting QB, but could be a Pro Bowl QB. That doesn't excite coaches/GMs much with a #1 pick, but he ought to be the #1 pick considering the state the Browns are in.

1) Rosen --- Can start next year and be a top-10 QB by the end of the season. I think he's super smart, focused, a great leader, hard working, and incredibly talented. Definitely the safest bet to get a Pro Bowl QB. Watch him on the NFL network reality show to learn a bit more about him as an individual. Very, very impressive. http://www.nfl.com/nflnetwork/main/network/features/destination-dallas

[FNQ]

Now it’s leaking that Browns are cooling on Darnold and it’s Mayfield or Allen at #1.

And it’s not Allen. Barring a NYG trade, the Jets are going to land their #1 overall guy at #3. Brilliant move, so long as the Broncos and Giants don’t start talking

Mayfield with the #1 is just stupid tbh, but it´s the Browns, no surprise though.

Giants are really high on Barkley, it´d take a boatload of picks to get them off their #2.

I disagree about Mayfield. The knock is his height and maturity.. but the off-field stuff wasn't ever that bad to me. He grabbed his crotch, so what. The only incident that's of concern was that he hoofed it from the police when they showed up while he was involved in a fight (claims to trying to break it up, I dont buy that, but w/e).

I think those are vastly different things. The crotch thing was vulgar and all but really means nothing. The running from the cops thing.. I mean, if you ever went to a HS or college party, you've probably ran from the cops on instinct once in your life. It's not a good sign that a supposedly mobile QB couldnt escape the police though

So all thats left is his height, and NFL scouts dramatically overplay these types of things. It's inconvenient for the QB, but if he can work around it like Russ, Tyrod, Flutie, even Brees.. the sky is the limit. And Mayfield has all the tools necessary to work around the lack of height. The bad part about picking him 1st is that I'm 90% sure the Browns believed he would be there at 4. And after the Jets trade, and their bluster about Mayfield/Rosen.. simply not an option.

As for Allen, has any other team expressed much interest in him in the top 5? I dont think they have. So if Allen truly was the Browns' guy, they could either trade the #1 for anyone who wanted to leapfrom the Jets (Darnold) or the Giants (Barkley) and still get their guy at 4. But Allen seems to be an obvious smokescreen at this point.

[FNQ]

I've also seen in a couple of places that GMs are bullish on next year's QB crop (e.g., Patterson, Lock, Thorson), so they might wait out this year for their QB of the future. Could lead to more trade-downs, or just not that many being taken in the 1st. Regardless, with a number of highly rated QBs in this draft, and a dearth of them in the NFL (albeit this offseason is better than last, after the recent FA signings and the late blooming of a few pros during the 17-18 season), projecting the draft is comparable to guessing the lottery balls.

I dont think that plays into decision making right now. For one, who knows where they project their pick would be next year. Who knows if those guys come out flat and show well in college. GMs in the NFL dont have time to kick things out an extra year unless they are a new regime. But the most QB needy teams are:

Cleveland - absolutely have to select a QB
NYG - new regime, and they are taking this tack
NYJ - GM was recently extended but they traded up, they are taking a QB
DEN - Elway likely not in danger, maybe can wait if he believes in Keenum that much, but likely wont be close to a top 5 pick again, so likely to go QB
BUF - traded Tyrod, armed with Peterson and McCarron.. they need a QB. Beane took lumps for not grabbing one before Peterson last year.
MIA - Tannehill coming off injury and never looked like a legit starting QB, likely to take a QB (if available). Grier is in year 3 and it looks grim.
ARI - Bradford and little behind him is a recipe for disaster, they need a QB. Keim (GM) is on the hot seat.

Then you have more safe GMs but very unstable QB positions long term: LAC, PIT, NE, NO, BAL, CIN. But anyways, the point being, most of the QB needy teams have potentially desperate GMs behind them, most notably BUF/MIA/ARI. They likely cant afford to wait another year.

But here's why you should expect top 10 trade downs: Teams 6-10 do not need QBs, and barring a CLE trade, there wont be 4 QBs going in the top 5. So 1 (plus Lamar Jackson) will slip, and someone is gonna pony up. My expectation is the Bills pony up to the Colts for the 6.

[nymets1]

We'll see what happens draft night but if the Browns don't take Barkley or possibly Bradley Chubb #1 overall, They are dummies. Browns should still be happy with a QB at their 4th pick. Again I would take Barkley 1st overall pick and than select QB with the 4th pick among who's available and which QB we highest on. There is no clear cut QB in this draft standing out. Allen, Darnold, Mayfield, Rosen and Lamar Jackson all seem about close to each other.

[FNQ]

We'll see what happens draft night but if the Browns don't take Barkley or possibly Bradley Chubb #1 overall, They are dummies. Browns should still be happy with a QB at their 4th pick. Again I would take Barkley 1st overall pick and than select QB with the 4th pick among who's available and which QB we highest on. There is no clear cut QB in this draft standing out. Allen, Darnold, Mayfield, Rosen and Lamar Jackson all seem about close to each other.

But they will get Barkley or Chubb no matter what anyways, so may as well pick your favorite QB 1st. Back when Indy held the 3, I’d agree. But now the Jets gave it and are taking a QB (Darnold) so the Browns will get whoever the Giants don’t take

[nymets1]

We'll see what happens draft night but if the Browns don't take Barkley or possibly Bradley Chubb #1 overall, They are dummies. Browns should still be happy with a QB at their 4th pick. Again I would take Barkley 1st overall pick and than select QB with the 4th pick among who's available and which QB we highest on. There is no clear cut QB in this draft standing out. Allen, Darnold, Mayfield, Rosen and Lamar Jackson all seem about close to each other.

But they will get Barkley or Chubb no matter what anyways, so may as well pick your favorite QB 1st. Back when Indy held the 3, I’d agree. But now the Jets gave it and are taking a QB (Darnold) so the Browns will get whoever the Giants don’t take

I guess its expected the Giants and Jets should both take a QB, but Barkley and Bradley Chubb look like they are going to be great prospects, so I wouldn't be shocked or surprised that Chubb and Barkley go 2nd and 3rd. If you think Chubb or Barkley is going to be better than any of the QB prospects, You better take Chubb or Barkley. Every team I think they should take BPA over filling a position need.

[FNQ]

We'll see what happens draft night but if the Browns don't take Barkley or possibly Bradley Chubb #1 overall, They are dummies. Browns should still be happy with a QB at their 4th pick. Again I would take Barkley 1st overall pick and than select QB with the 4th pick among who's available and which QB we highest on. There is no clear cut QB in this draft standing out. Allen, Darnold, Mayfield, Rosen and Lamar Jackson all seem about close to each other.

But they will get Barkley or Chubb no matter what anyways, so may as well pick your favorite QB 1st. Back when Indy held the 3, I’d agree. But now the Jets gave it and are taking a QB (Darnold) so the Browns will get whoever the Giants don’t take

I guess its expected the Giants and Jets should both take a QB, but Barkley and Bradley Chubb look like they are going to be great prospects, so I wouldn't be shocked or surprised that Chubb and Barkley go 2nd and 3rd. If you think Chubb or Barkley is going to be better than any of the QB prospects, You better take Chubb or Barkley. Every team I think they should take BPA over filling a position need.

It’s actually not expected that the Giants take a QB.. it is a 100% lock that the Jets take a QB though. You don’t trade that much for a DL or RB. So picks 1/3 are locks for QBs, leaving only the 2 for a position player, meaning Barkley or Chubb will be there at 4. Browns won’t gave their choice between the two, but either one is a fantastic asset to have. I think they prefer Chubb and likely will get Chubb

[righterwriter]

I think round 2 is the perfect time for Cleveland to take a RB. There will be a big time difference maker there still, most likely, who should top 1000 yds his rookie year. That might not be as good as what Barkley does, but if you can get a plus starter at RB in the 2nd and get a dominant DE or DB with that #4 pick as well, then that's a good situation.

[The Box Office]

I honestly do not believe he will be there at 12.The top 4 QBs should go in the top 6 picks (assuming IND is willing to trade down) meaning a QB needy team will need to jump in the top 10 to get Jackson, as they should. The Bucs, the Bears, the 9ers, and the Raiders all should be very interested in moving down, and teams like the Cardinals, Ravens, Bengals, and Dolphins all should be very interested in moving up to take a QB. With a dark horse being the Pats moving up. Also wouldnt shock me to see PIT or JAX move up.. but I'm pretty sure teams are looking at MIA/BUF and thinking that those are the teams they need to jump to get one of the top 5 QBs in this draft.

You're speaking for yourself, correct? Wild trade scenarios here. Draft day trades (to jump into Top 10) do not happen often. I don't know why those teams you listed will trade down. To get more picks? Is that all? Why? Most of them will stay pat and get their guy in the top 10. It's hard enough to get crack into Top 10 in the first place. Most teams don't trade down unless it's a big deal for a Top 10 pick.

I'm not worried about the Pats. They do not have enough in their draft pick stock pile to jump ahead of the Buffalo Bills to get Jackson.

Steelers don't have enough either to move up. They have the 28th pick. That's too low to trade up.

Jacksonville? They're set with Blake Bortles at QB. They have the 29th pick. That's too low to trade up past Buffalo.

Cardinals have the 15th pick. It's going to be very difficult for them to move up when Buffalo has the 12th pick work to trade, too.

Baltimore has 16th pick. Nope, don't see B-More trading up and they still have Joe Flacco at QB. I think they stick with him for another 2 years.

Cincy Bengals have Andy Dalton and the 21st pick. Nah, I don't see them making much trade noise.

The only true threats that can wreck Lamar Jackson to Buffalo Bills are Miami Dolphins and any team currently in the Top 10. Dolphins fan base and beat writers are big on Vita Vea, Roquan Smith, and Minkah Fitzpatrick. Their QB position is not high on their list according to them. The QB they want is Josh Rosen. Some want Lamar Jackson, but they're not screaming for him.

We'll see on Draft Night.

2016

Eagles started with the 13th pick
Rams started with the 15th pick

Eagles pick Wentz 2nd
Rams pick Goff first

When there is a glut of high end QBs, trades will happen. And as clearly shown, you do not need a top 10 pick to trade for a higher top 10 pick. Teams in the teens got the two best QBs just 2 years ago.

And the Jags aren’t set at QB, not are the Saints or Steelers. The Jags are going year to year with Bortles, and the other two teams have QBs teetering on the brink of retirement but otherwise have contending rosters.

Stop. Eagles and Rams gave up way more than that. You purposely left stuff out.

The Eagles traded three top 100 picks in 2016, a first round pick in 2017, and a second round pick in 2018 in order to move up in the draft order and get Wentz. 5 picks. That's a lot.

Rams gave up first-round pick (2016), two second-round picks (2016), a third-round pick (2016), a first-round pick (2017) and another third-round pick (2017). 6 draft picks. That's a lot.

If I were the Bills, I wouldn't do it. It's gonna take 5 high end draft picks minimum to get into Top 5. Bills' O-line is depleted, receiver corps is depleted, and LeSean McCoy is on the verge of 30, and Bills need a top LB really effin' bad.

The Bills will not make playoffs next year and will have a Top 10 pick and another first rounder. I wouldn't give that up for an unknown QB in this year's draft. If the Bills actually, do it, oh well. I just have to roll with it.

[FNQ]

Stop. Eagles and Rams gave up way more than that. You purposely left stuff out.

The Eagles traded three top 100 picks in 2016, a first round pick in 2017, and a second round pick in 2018 in order to move up in the draft order and get Wentz. 5 picks. That's a lot.

Rams gave up first-round pick (2016), two second-round picks (2016), a third-round pick (2016), a first-round pick (2017) and another third-round pick (2017). 6 draft picks. That's a lot.

If I were the Bills, I wouldn't do it. It's gonna take 5 high end draft picks minimum to get into Top 5. Bills' O-line is depleted, receiver corps is depleted, and LeSean McCoy is on the verge of 30, and Bills need a top LB really effin' bad.

The Bills will not make playoffs next year and will have a Top 10 pick and another first rounder. I wouldn't give that up for an unknown QB in this year's draft. If the Bills actually, do it, oh well. I just have to roll with it.

You just said teams need top 10 picks to move into the earlier top 10 to draft a QB. I just showed you that not more than 2 years ago, with a lot less on the “supply” side, that teams outside the top 10 got the top 2 picks. Regardless if you would do it or not, its been done, recently. So the take that you need a top 10 pick to get a QB is not true.

As for them giving up a lot and accusing me of leaving stuff out (ridiculous btw) the Jets gaveup 4 picks to move from 6 to 3. Which I bring up because it costs s lot, no matter where you are, to get QBs in the draft. But you didnt argue that, you said teams outside the top 10 dont have the assets to move up. And thats what I showed to be inaccurate

[Bulltalk]

Ha. Mel Kiper shifted the Brown's #1 pick to Baker Mayfield in his final mock draft.

[Cactus Jack]

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Pete throwing out Draft Clues...I need yawls help!!!

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Spoiler:

FWIW: Pete does this every year.