Did the Colts tank?

Celtsfan1980 · Post #1 » by **Celtsfan1980** » Mon Nov 5, 2012 3:52 pm

Manning went down with an injury before the season began last year. This has received most of the credit for their struggles, but the defense also had their worst season in years. Is this a coincidence, or was this an example of a football team tanking?

Colts' defense ranked 11th in 2008
Colts' defense ranked 18th in 2009
Colts' defense ranked 20th in 2010
Colts' defense ranked 25th in 2011
Colts' defense ranked 18th in 2012

Higga · Post #2 » by **Higga** » Mon Nov 5, 2012 4:09 pm

Na, they were just built so heavily around Manning. When he went down, the team went down. Luck may not be Prime Manning yet, but he's already really really good and that's why they're winning games again.

That's the value of a franchise QB in the NFL. Impossible to win without one, with one you're basically a playoff team automatically.

Jeff23 · Post #3 » by **Jeff23** » Mon Nov 5, 2012 9:27 pm

Even if they tanked, whats so bad about it? Also they had so many injuries on that team and dont forget they had Kerry Collins starting the season at QB and Curtis Painter/Tim Orlovsky finishing it. Orlovsky though started the last 3 games i think and IMO did a really solid job.

Celtsfan1980 · Post #4 » by **Celtsfan1980** » Mon Nov 5, 2012 10:44 pm

Which injuries did they have on defense?

Higga wrote:Na, they were just built so heavily around Manning. When he went down, the team went down.

It makes sense that their offense would be much worse, but why would their defense be a lot worse?

Post #5 » by **Worm Guts** » Tue Nov 6, 2012 12:11 am

Didn't everyone running the Colts last year get fired?

Bleeding Blue · Post #6 » by **Bleeding Blue** » Tue Nov 6, 2012 1:22 pm

Celtsfan1980 wrote:Which injuries did they have on defense?

Higga wrote:Na, they were just built so heavily around Manning. When he went down, the team went down.

It makes sense that their offense would be much worse, but why would their defense be a lot worse?

As a huge Colts fan I do not believe they tanked at all, Manning going down was huge and we did have a ton of injuries on both sides of the ball. The defense was built to rush the passer and play with the lead and that obviously didn't happen last year. That team was built around 1 player.

Luck, like Manning is hiding a TON of flaws on this team. Do not be fooled, this team is worse than their 5-3 record in my opinion. I love to see them doing well, but they are vastly overachieving. If they were playing the Broncos schedule they probably have 1-2 wins, maybe. The Colts schedule is incredibly easy this year.

Higga · Post #7 » by **Higga** » Tue Nov 6, 2012 4:53 pm

Celtsfan1980 wrote:Which injuries did they have on defense?

Higga wrote:Na, they were just built so heavily around Manning. When he went down, the team went down.

It makes sense that their offense would be much worse, but why would their defense be a lot worse?

Their Defense was built to play with a lead and rush the passer. With no QB they never scored points, and they went 3 and out a lot(I'm assuming). That means the D is on the field a lot more and has to defend both the run and the pass, and the Colts have always been a bad run D as they're built around small, fast players.

Bleeding Blue · Post #8 » by **Bleeding Blue** » Tue Nov 6, 2012 5:19 pm

Higga wrote:
Celtsfan1980 wrote:Which injuries did they have on defense?

Higga wrote:Na, they were just built so heavily around Manning. When he went down, the team went down.

It makes sense that their offense would be much worse, but why would their defense be a lot worse?

Their Defense was built to play with a lead and rush the passer. With no QB they never scored points, and they went 3 and out a lot(I'm assuming). That means the D is on the field a lot more and has to defend both the run and the pass, and the Colts have always been a bad run D as they're built around small, fast players.

Exactly, they also lost their starting MLB, FS, and #1 corner as well as many other guys.

Jeff23 · Post #9 » by **Jeff23** » Tue Nov 6, 2012 6:55 pm

God i remember that Eric Foster injury holy crap was that gross.

Bleeding Blue · Post #10 » by **Bleeding Blue** » Tue Nov 6, 2012 7:50 pm

Jeff23 wrote:God i remember that Eric Foster injury holy crap was that gross.

I actually forgot about that one, yeah that was awful. I havent heard anything about him, hopefully he makes it back to the league at some point.

Celtsfan1980 · Post #11 » by **Celtsfan1980** » Fri Nov 9, 2012 3:55 pm

They knew about Manning's injury a long time before the season began. Wouldn't they go after a real back-up? There were quarterbacks out there better than Collins.

Higga wrote:
Celtsfan1980 wrote:Which injuries did they have on defense?

Higga wrote:Na, they were just built so heavily around Manning. When he went down, the team went down.

It makes sense that their offense would be much worse, but why would their defense be a lot worse?

Their Defense was built to play with a lead and rush the passer. With no QB they never scored points, and they went 3 and out a lot(I'm assuming). That means the D is on the field a lot more and has to defend both the run and the pass, and the Colts have always been a bad run D as they're built around small, fast players.

The Baltimore Ravens had a bad offense when they won the Super Bowl and their defense still dominated. The Browns last year had a very bad offense, but their defense played well. Many teams have been a bad offensive team but the defenses still play well.

Post #12 » by **DJhitek** » Sat Nov 10, 2012 3:49 am

They also aged pretty quickly at key offensive positions. Even Reggie looked a step slow last season.

Their defense will always be an issue until they find the perfect weapons on offense to help Luck grow first. It will probably be a priority in drafts to come IMO.

Bleeding Blue · Post #13 » by **Bleeding Blue** » Mon Nov 12, 2012 2:13 pm

Celtsfan1980 wrote:The Baltimore Ravens had a bad offense when they won the Super Bowl and their defense still dominated. The Browns last year had a very bad offense, but their defense played well. Many teams have been a bad offensive team but the defenses still play well.

Are you really comparing the Colts defense to one of the greatest defenses ever? It isnt like the Colts defense was good to begin with, add in injuries and always playing from behind and its over. Im not saying it isnt possible for the defense to play well if the other side struggles, but it obviously didnt happen and I dont think it was because they tanked....they just sucked.

Celtsfan1980 · Post #14 » by **Celtsfan1980** » Mon Nov 12, 2012 9:01 pm

Who are all of the injuries they had on defense? Were they actually good players?

Post #15 » by **sunshinekids99** » Tue Nov 13, 2012 12:26 pm

The Colts lost their starting MLB, DT, and S from defense. Not to mention two left tackles, starting te, and rb. Could they have tried to get a better QB than Collins sure? But they were going to struggle regardless of the QB.

DarthBane · Post #16 » by **DarthBane** » Tue Dec 4, 2012 6:12 pm

It's a compounding effect which stems from a bad QB/Offense.

You can have a decent defense, but :

- If you're constantly in terrible field position, because your offense has to keep punting the ball away or throws interceptions, you're going to be tired.

- If you're tired all game, you're not going to be very effective.

- This is situational, but if you're losing, the offense can use the whole playbook against you. If you're winning, the offense usually throws more and it makes your job a little easier on defense.

I wonder if there is a break down of how long the defense was on the field (average) last year vs this year? I'd guess they are on the field a lot less this year with Luck managing the offense.

Fatty · Post #17 » by **Fatty** » Tue Dec 4, 2012 8:02 pm

no they just sucked.

I feel tanking overall is way way less prevalent in the NFL compared to the NBA. Mostly players play hard every possession because its a physical sport, you take a play off and you can get knocked on your ass. The salary cap is also different. There are less guaranteed contracts so a player has to play for his job on an every down basis or he can risk getting cut. the NFL can also have major turnarounds from a season to season basis, so if the owners feel the coach isnt winning, they know they know that they can spend 1 offseason and turn a 2 win team into a 10 win team with a new coach. Overall I also feel there is a greater sense of pride among players in the NFL. in the NBA, you ll see a lot of players and teams just coast. Although the amount of games played also factors into that. Bottom line is that NFL players and coaches are playing for their jobs every game so there is no incentive for them to lie down.

Fatty · Post #18 » by **Fatty** » Sat Dec 8, 2012 5:54 am

Getting a better draft position in the NFL is also less beneficial compared to the NBA. NBA 5 people play at once so 1 player contributes more than in the NFL, where out of the 22 positions, a player will only play 1.

sprint2thecup · Post #19 » by **sprint2thecup** » Fri Dec 21, 2012 5:43 pm

if you understand football, you know that your offense moving the ball actually has quite an effect on your defense's performance. manning being out really did affect the defense, because painter had the team constantly punting out of their endzone. a lot of 50 yard fields for the defense to deal with. it's not that hard to understand.