Turning around the Browns

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Turning around the Browns 

Post#1 » by Celtsfan1980 » Sun Oct 1, 2017 7:38 pm

Looking as bad as last year. Hue Jackson and Gregg Williams were supposed to be good signings. Through 4 games they're more part of the problem. Is it normal that the NFL takes this long to reinstate a player(Josh Gordon)? On the plus side Garrett is coming back soon.

Can a team this bad turn it around quickly? Starting with quarterback, would Jimmy Garoppolo want to be a Brown? Would Matt Moore want to be a Brown? He put up good numbers last year, better than Tannehill. Penn State's Saquon Barkley could be enough to attract a quarterback, even if they're not great. Signing Gordon would improve our receivers, and the three second round picks can be used on defense. Need depth at linebacker, cornerback, and safety. Is it wrong that I'm optimistic for next season?
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Re: Turning around the Browns 

Post#2 » by RavenMad31 » Sun Oct 1, 2017 7:56 pm

Just give up on Gordon. It's over. Hue Jackson is as good of a coach as they are going to attract. What promising coach is going to take that job if yet another coach is fired after two or fewer seasons? This is still a rebuilding year and theoretically, they aren't supposed to be much, if any better than last year. They really overhauled everything this time around in an effort to do things differently. I'd give this four years, even if it does end up being another dead end administration. Sucking with stability is at least marginally better than sucking with turmoil.
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Re: Turning around the Browns 

Post#3 » by bmurph128 » Mon Oct 2, 2017 5:19 pm

Normally when you see turnarounds or potential turnarounds, you can see it coming. The Jaguars and Rams are teams that have amassed a lot of talent and in some games this year you see it coming to fruition.

The Browns...their draft picks have been so bad the past few years that Hue Jackson has basically gut the team and is starting at zero here. Jackson will be the guy that hopefully stays for 4-5 years, hopefully they draft well and he gets the team up to winning 6-8 games by his last two years. The next coach will be the one to potentially make them into a decent team.

I like Hue - a lot - but they have so many issues that it's hard to see an NFL team sticking with a coach for 5 years of losing and IMO, that's how long it will take.
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Re: Turning around the Browns 

Post#4 » by Otis Driftwood » Tue Oct 3, 2017 3:07 pm

I really thought they would beat the Bengals. Saw enough upside along with the Bengals looking bad that I sensed it was time. That had to be disheartening to Browns fans. Not only to lose... but to lose that badly.
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Re: Turning around the Browns 

Post#5 » by LAKESHOW » Tue Oct 3, 2017 11:26 pm

They need to find Troy aikman. Ben rothlesberger. Aaron Rodgers. And the search continues...
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Re: Turning around the Browns 

Post#6 » by Im So NBAd out » Wed Oct 4, 2017 8:18 pm

1st 3 picks on defense?wait huh?

your 1st 3 picks should be WR QB WR you pick the order.Your defense is bad but your offense is worse
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Re: Turning around the Browns 

Post#7 » by Celtsfan1980 » Wed Oct 4, 2017 8:52 pm

bmurph128 wrote:Normally when you see turnarounds or potential turnarounds, you can see it coming. The Jaguars and Rams are teams that have amassed a lot of talent and in some games this year you see it coming to fruition.

The Browns...their draft picks have been so bad the past few years that Hue Jackson has basically gut the team and is starting at zero here. Jackson will be the guy that hopefully stays for 4-5 years, hopefully they draft well and he gets the team up to winning 6-8 games by his last two years. The next coach will be the one to potentially make them into a decent team.

I like Hue - a lot - but they have so many issues that it's hard to see an NFL team sticking with a coach for 5 years of losing and IMO, that's how long it will take.

You do realize they have 2 first round and three second round picks, correct? Drafting well with that many picks will help them win much quicker than you seem to think. They do have money to spend, so it is possible they can sign a quarterback, which could help the team greatly.
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Re: Turning around the Browns 

Post#8 » by FNQ » Wed Oct 4, 2017 10:56 pm

Gordon's not coming back.

As for Hue and Williams, they're fine. You have a 2nd round rookie starting at QB.. 3:8 TD/INT ratio. There's especially little talent at RB/WR/TE thats ready to play right now (Duke, Coleman, Njoku look like the future but the present is bleak).

The OL is solid, but not amazing. Joe Thomas is due to be dealt, but Bitonio still looks to be an elite-type player, and thats a start.

Defensively, they havent even unleashed their #1 overall pick yet. They have a good to great WLB/SLB duo in Collins/Kirksey. But outside of Jabril Peppers, that secondary minus Haden is a disaster.

So clearly they have spots to upgrade, but if anyone thought the Browns were going .500 this year, I assume this was a big wakeup call. They can't properly evaluate Kizer until they've given him some WR, and their defense is going to kill them most of the year. Figure they will be a solid run defense but will get shredded through the air. Not good when you can't keep up in the passing game.

Browns could easily wind up with Barkley/Ridley/Jordan Thomas/Cam Smith/Billy Price. That's QB/WR/CB/MLB/C.. boom. Now you have Ridley/Coleman as WR, Njoku/DeValve at TE, an elite RB, presumably still have Joe Thomas/Bitonio with a now stalwart C in Price, a #1 DB, and a guy who completes your LB corps. Make a decent signing at RT, FS, and CB.. that's a potentially good team. I still believe Kizer can be a Cam-like QB if you give him the talent to do so.
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Re: Turning around the Browns 

Post#9 » by bluejerseyjinx » Thu Oct 5, 2017 9:27 pm

The Browns need a big time QB. Until they solve that issue, nothing will get solved.
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Re: Turning around the Browns 

Post#10 » by Otis Driftwood » Thu Oct 5, 2017 10:10 pm

Celtsfan1980 wrote:
bmurph128 wrote:Normally when you see turnarounds or potential turnarounds, you can see it coming. The Jaguars and Rams are teams that have amassed a lot of talent and in some games this year you see it coming to fruition.

The Browns...their draft picks have been so bad the past few years that Hue Jackson has basically gut the team and is starting at zero here. Jackson will be the guy that hopefully stays for 4-5 years, hopefully they draft well and he gets the team up to winning 6-8 games by his last two years. The next coach will be the one to potentially make them into a decent team.

I like Hue - a lot - but they have so many issues that it's hard to see an NFL team sticking with a coach for 5 years of losing and IMO, that's how long it will take.

You do realize they have 2 first round and three second round picks, correct? Drafting well with that many picks will help them win much quicker than you seem to think. They do have money to spend, so it is possible they can sign a quarterback, which could help the team greatly.



And - there’s the problem. Drafting well. Something they have a history of not doing.
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Re: Turning around the Browns 

Post#11 » by bluejerseyjinx » Sun Oct 8, 2017 9:16 pm

I have a better idea. Sell the team and get the hell out of Cleveland.
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Re: Turning around the Browns 

Post#12 » by Celtsfan1980 » Sun Oct 8, 2017 11:16 pm

Britt doesn't play and Hogan plays in place of Kizer. The offense looks much better. It's shocking. I'm happy with what I saw today despite a loss. I'm optimistic for next season. Claims Peyton Manning will be a GM next year, and he is friends with Haslam:
https://scout.com/nfl/browns/Board/105323/Contents/Glazer-Peyton-Manning-will-be-back-in-NFL-next-year-as-GM-108619804
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Re: Turning around the Browns 

Post#13 » by RavenMad31 » Mon Oct 9, 2017 2:05 am

bluejerseyjinx wrote:I have a better idea. Sell the team and get the hell out of Cleveland.


They didn't sell, but it sure as hell worked last time. :lol:
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Re: Turning around the Browns 

Post#14 » by Cactus Jack » Mon Oct 9, 2017 5:31 am

bluejerseyjinx wrote:I have a better idea. Sell the team and get the hell out of Cleveland.


They just need to stick with the current plan & build through the draft. They've done a nice job of accumulating picks as of late. The last thing the club should do is completely start over again. The franchise could use some stability. They've had way too much turnover. Continue to build through the draft & eventually things will turn.
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Re: Turning around the Browns 

Post#15 » by Otis Driftwood » Mon Oct 9, 2017 11:50 am

Celtsfan1980 wrote:Britt doesn't play and Hogan plays in place of Kizer. The offense looks much better. It's shocking. I'm happy with what I saw today despite a loss. I'm optimistic for next season. Claims Peyton Manning will be a GM next year, and he is friends with Haslam:
https://scout.com/nfl/browns/Board/105323/Contents/Glazer-Peyton-Manning-will-be-back-in-NFL-next-year-as-GM-108619804
Sign me up.


Who's going to be your next HC?
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Re: Turning around the Browns 

Post#16 » by Celtsfan1980 » Mon Oct 9, 2017 6:08 pm

If the Browns have or will have a quarterback who can pass well in the red zone Hue Jackson may not look too bad. Assuming Hogan gets most of the playing time rather than Kizer the rest of the season I'd give Hue a third season. He should not be influencing our quarterback decisions though.
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Re: Turning around the Browns 

Post#17 » by Pharmcat » Tue Oct 10, 2017 7:06 pm

They could have had dak, wentz, or Watson

But they passed, that's the problem
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Re: Turning around the Browns 

Post#18 » by FNQ » Tue Oct 10, 2017 11:10 pm

Pharmcat wrote:They could have had dak, wentz, or Watson

But they passed, that's the problem


Think they wanted to build their other positions up before investing in a QB that high.

Which is completely understandable to a degree. If you introduce a good QB to the NFL by letting him get crushed by a lackluster OL, or give him no receivers or RB to take the pressure off.. you could be creating a bad one. It would shock me if the Browns didnt take a QB high in the 1st round next year, though. With Darnold dropping and a slew of picks in the 1st 2 rounds, the Browns could wind up with an elite position player (Barkley or Ridley) and one of the best QBs in the draft (Darnold, Rosen, Jackson, Thorson)

Time will tell if it works out for them, but there are so few offensive weapons on that team now, that I doubt many QBs could win more than a handful of games there. I thought Kizer could eventually work the kinks out and settle down, but I think he'll have to re-earn that chance next year at this point. Hogan looked a lot better than Kizer did, and he probably has more experience working with guys like Louis and Njoku than Kizer did.
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Re: Turning around the Browns 

Post#19 » by Pharmcat » Tue Oct 10, 2017 11:18 pm

you cant win in the NFL without the QB, they had multiple chances to land a star and blew it. They are just infatuated with acquiring draft capital but fail to realized that its not just about quantity but also about quality. This new regime has been here for a couple of years and has nothing to show for it
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Re: Turning around the Browns 

Post#20 » by FNQ » Wed Oct 11, 2017 12:24 am

Pharmcat wrote:you cant win in the NFL without the QB, they had multiple chances to land a star and blew it. They are just infatuated with acquiring draft capital but fail to realized that its not just about quantity but also about quality. This new regime has been here for a couple of years and has nothing to show for it


In 2 years, they have acquired multiple future draft picks, and drafted:

Corey Coleman (starting WR)
Manny Ogbah (starting DE/EDGE)
Carl Nassib (sub DE/EDGE)
Shon Coleman (starting RT)
Cody Kessler (backup QB)
Joe Schobert (best suited as backup/ST)
Ricardo Louis (new starting WR)
Derrick Kindred (starting FS)
Seth Devalve (blocking TE)
Spencer Drango (swing G)
Myles Garrett (starting DE)
Jabril Peppers (starting SS)
David Njoku (pass-catching TE)
DeShone Kizer (upside QB, not looking good ATM)
Caleb Brantley (rotational DT)


That's actually really solid. I dont know why people expected a quick turnaround.. they had literally nothing a couple years ago except a couple veteran 'stars' in Haden, Gipson, Thomas and TJ Ward.. traded who they could, and had to rebuild from scratch. Just like Reggie with the Raiders, people want to evaluate by wins and losses amidst the rebuild. We started Terrell Pryor for a year at QB.

The Browns FO is doing it right, building a team that can support a star QB first before landing one. I doubt Wentz or Watson would look anywhere near as good without the situations they landed in. Dak.. I dont see why anyone would count that, every single team passed on him.

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