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Here's why I think he's so easily not the GOAT (at least as of now):
I understand that he's never had the greatest supporting cast, but his team goes from 131-61 in the regular season to 9-9 in the playoffs.

Comeback Joe = GOAT

And of course it's certainly arguable that Tom Brady is very close to Manning.
3 rings + another ring

The Brady Super Bowl teams were all about defense. Harrison, Seymour, Bruschci, Ty Law, Asante Samuel etc etc...Manning never had a D like that, the current Colts D is prpbably the best its been for his entire career.. Colts are still young and draft well, they have a good young core of WRs and DBs...Mannning will still have the chance to win more Superbowls.

The defense argument is moot, because manning had the superior offensive weapons. You switch players on teams, and maybe manning has the rings and brady has the stats.

Regular season
Manning has been better than brady.

Postseason
Brady has been better than manning.

It's a great debate to have. Lets get to this first though, is there anyone out there who think the two cannot compare? Because believe it or not, before this superbowl, before the playoffs, I had an argument with fans on realgm saying brady couldn't sniff peytons jockstrap. Which is comical. It's a magic vs bird debate. Everyone should know that by now.

Brady's been on better overall teams. For about half of his career, Manning has had to score 30 points for his team to win the game. You can pull "the better weapons card", but there's also a lot of pressure when you know you can't make a mistake (I'd also like to point out that the Pats have no one to blame but themselves, they took Terry Glenn over Marvin Harrison). I mean the Colts played a playoff game where they never punted and ended up winning the game by like 6 points.

there is a guy out of california named JOHN ELWAY!

a physical specimen who could whip the ball a million yards down field.

has the running ability to get yards needed.

a strong paul bunyan of a man.

accuracy. deadly accurate on the run, stand still, goin backwards.

played and won in different offensive systems.

there is simply no one. AND THE SHOW MEANS NO ONE, who was better than JOHN ELWAY. period.

LAKESHOW wrote:there is a guy out of california named JOHN ELWAY!

a physical specimen who could whip the ball a million yards down field.

has the running ability to get yards needed.

a strong paul bunyan of a man.

accuracy. deadly accurate on the run, stand still, goin backwards.

played and won in different offensive systems.

there is simply no one. AND THE SHOW MEANS NO ONE, who was better than JOHN ELWAY. period.

Agreed, sort of.

Elway gets left out of the conversation and he would be the best all time, but I would put Montana on the same level kind of like a 1a,1b thing rather than 1,2. He is one of the toughest guys to ever play the game, and has the most final drive and comeback wins in NFL history. Plus the guy still put his body on the line at 37 years old I would like to see Brady or Manning do that. Hell I'd like to see Manning get hit period and Brady to not cry after he gets hit.

Manning is the best man, jesus. The Saints were a more talented and more balanced team, not beating a team that is better than yours isn't a downgrade.

It's not his Fault Tom Brady was on the best team in the league 3 times.

NO-KG-AI wrote:Manning is the best man, jesus. The Saints were a more talented and more balanced team, not beating a team that is better than yours isn't a downgrade.

It's not his Fault Tom Brady was on the best team in the league 3 times.

Wasnt the argument earlier in the decade that Peyton had the better Offense and thats why he put up all those numbers vs Brady having reche caldwells/david pattens/david givens/etc...? And then when Brady finally got a great offense he put up monster numbers and then everyone shut up about the whole "system quarterback" argument?


In fact, Peyton's super bowl team probably had a better total offense then the patriots did in any of their super bowl wins (on paper).


Now we're defending Peyton for not having "great" teams as compared to Brady? What? Am i missing something? Wasnt part of Brady's greatness making average players look good?

Manning will go down as the best Regular Season QB since Marino, but the playoff record is shaky at best. That will count against him. Before they won 4 games and the Super Bowl in '06 he was just 3-6, after that Super Bowl he has gone 2-3. As of right now that will hold him back from the best QB top spot.

NO-KG-AI wrote:Manning is the best man, jesus. The Saints were a more talented and more balanced team, not beating a team that is better than yours isn't a downgrade.

It's not his Fault Tom Brady was on the best team in the league 3 times.

Manning has lost a lot of playoff games where he was favored, including this Super Bowl. Manning's great, but if you're comparing him to someone to like Montana how do you ignore the fact that Montana was so much more proficient in big games?

BDutch48 wrote:Manning will go down as the best Regular Season QB since Marino, but the playoff record is shaky at best. That will count against him. Before they won 4 games and the Super Bowl in '06 he was just 3-6, after that Super Bowl he has gone 2-3. As of right now that will hold him back from the best QB top spot.

Marino isn't even in the top 10 regular season QBs of the last 25 years. He simply threw the ball a lot more than anyone else in his time and everyone thinks that made him great. Manning >>>>>Marino.

Playoff records are tricky because a lot of times it's out of the control of the QB. Like last year--it sure wasn't Warner's fault the Cardinals didn't win. But because it's so pronounced with Manning even going back to his Tennessee days, it's real hard to overlook. He's certainly the best regular-season QB of my football lifetime, and I'm old enough to have watched Bradshaw and Staubach.

I heard Trent Dilfer (who has the same amount of rings as Manning and one more than Marino!) talking about why he thinks Manning loses so many playoff games. He was talking about how Peyton can't do all the pre-snap histrionics when pressed for time and that throws off his rhythm. Plus he doesn't have all that time to pick up all the little coverage nuances or to make sure the receiver sees the same things. He compared that to Brady and Favre, who both thrive in the 2-minute drill because they can more quickly recognize things and aren't afraid to make mistakes. I find a lot of validity in that point.

Well out of all QB's just based on regular season and not playoff wins I would say Marino is easily 2nd and not too far away from Peyton. Again this is just my opinion but it seems Marino would be close. I didn't say he was the best but Peyton is the best since him. Again, this is just my opinion.

NO-KG-AI wrote:Manning is the best man, jesus. The Saints were a more talented and more balanced team, not beating a team that is better than yours isn't a downgrade.

It's not his Fault Tom Brady was on the best team in the league 3 times.

The Saints were more talented...not sure I'm with you on that one. Personally I think the Colts are deeper team than the Saints, he lost a game that they should have won. He had a huge pick in that game as well.

Tom Brady's team was the best in the league 3 times? Perhaps you want to go back and look at those years. Nobody on the earth would have said the Pats were better than the Rams. They also were not the clear cut favs in their second Super Bowl either.

Peyton Manning is the best quarterback to ever play the game. He just had some bad luck in the playoffs. If Garcon or Wayne do not drop those balls, we are crowning him as the GOAT right now.

I don't believe it was on them, if he didn't throw that INT they would have probably tied the game, and if it wasn't for Jenkins rock hands he would have been intercepted 2 plays earlier. I don't wanna say this because it will probably get flamed but he choked just as much as Garcon and Wayne.

you need a more complete team to win in the playoffs, manning is a great quaterback, better than brady.

LAKESHOW wrote:there is a guy out of california named JOHN ELWAY!

a physical specimen who could whip the ball a million yards down field.

has the running ability to get yards needed.

a strong paul bunyan of a man.

accuracy. deadly accurate on the run, stand still, goin backwards.

played and won in different offensive systems.

there is simply no one. AND THE SHOW MEANS NO ONE, who was better than JOHN ELWAY. period.

QFT

UrbanLegendMD wrote:Peyton Manning is the best quarterback to ever play the game. He just had some bad luck in the playoffs. If Garcon or Wayne do not drop those balls, we are crowning him as the GOAT right now.

And if the pats corners or safetys don't drop the ball in 07 superbowl, brady would be ahead of manning by far.

can't use ifs and buts in this debate.

When Brady went down for the season his team still won 10 games, if Manning were to go down the Colts would win 5-6 games at best. The Patriots could plug many QB's in and still make the playoffs, the Colts not so much. This, in my mind makes Manning better than Brady.

Bleeding Blue wrote:When Brady went down for the season his team still won 10 games, if Manning were to go down the Colts would win 5-6 games at best. The Patriots could plug many QB's in and still make the playoffs, the Colts not so much. This, in my mind makes Manning better than Brady.

I very much agree. We all saw Matt Cassel just suck in KC and he won 10 games with what Brady has around him.