Backup Center

[zeebneeb]

Interesting to have Livers starting at PF. He and Cade are almost identical size-wise(Livers is listed at 230lbs. If Cade did put on the "summer 15" he and Livers would be exact)

That would be a potentially damn good shooting squad that's for sure. 5 legitimate threats from deep, and some damn good defense. Hopefully Bey even gets back to how he played defense in his rookie year, and that could be a damn good lineup.

Cade 6'7 215-230lbs
Ivey 6'4 195lbs
Bey 6'7 215lbs
Livers 6'7 230lbs
Stewart 6'8 250lbs

Very switchable that's for damn sure.

[grpistons]

Interesting to have Livers starting at PF. He and Cade are almost identical size-wise(Livers is listed at 230lbs. If Cade did put on the "summer 15" he and Livers would be exact)

That would be a potentially damn good shooting squad that's for sure. 5 legitimate threats from deep, and some damn good defense. Hopefully Bey even gets back to how he played defense in his rookie year, and that could be a damn good lineup.

Cade 6'7 215-230lbs
Ivey 6'4 195lbs
Bey 6'7 215lbs
Livers 6'7 230lbs
Stewart 6'8 250lbs

Very switchable that's for damn sure.

I know Livers is listed at 230, and Bey at 215, but Bey is noticeably heavier than Livers.

[NYPiston]

Of course things can change depending on what happens in preseason but it seems likely to me that the 4 man PF/C rotation to start will be Bagley, Stewart, Olynyk and Noel with Duren either getting spot minutes or starting in the G League (which is where I prefer he starts as opposed to end of the bench minutes). Backup center seems to be Noel, for now, although I wouldn't be shocked if he starts alongside Stewart.

[zeebneeb]

Interesting to have Livers starting at PF. He and Cade are almost identical size-wise(Livers is listed at 230lbs. If Cade did put on the "summer 15" he and Livers would be exact)

That would be a potentially damn good shooting squad that's for sure. 5 legitimate threats from deep, and some damn good defense. Hopefully Bey even gets back to how he played defense in his rookie year, and that could be a damn good lineup.

Cade 6'7 215-230lbs
Ivey 6'4 195lbs
Bey 6'7 215lbs
Livers 6'7 230lbs
Stewart 6'8 250lbs

Very switchable that's for damn sure.

I know Livers is listed at 230, and Bey at 215, but Bey is noticeably heavier than Livers.

Most of those weights are from their rookie season, so I'll bet your accurate. I'd put Bey anywhere between 225-240. It's hard to tell, but he's built more like Stewart, then Cade.

[bstein14]

Livers is my pick for starting forward. You can call him a SF and Bey a SF or vice versa doesn't matter.

#1. Livers plays winning basketball. He's a high IQ player and often makes the right play for teammates. This will help Cade and Ivey.

#2. He's a good shooter. As good as Bey most likely but he hasn't had the same volume so we'll see where he goes with it this year in a bigger role hopefully.

#3. He's a better defender than most of the guys on the team. Bey and Bagley were both bottom 25 defenders in the entire league for players that played 20+ MPG last season so you can put Livers on the opposing team's better player at the 3/4 spot and Bey on the weaker or slower player.

#4. As mentioned above, Livers gives you a very switchable starting unit that you don't get from having Bagley out there.

#5. The concern overall might be lack of rebounding, but I have a feeling that Ivey and Cade will end up being one of the better rebounding starting backcourts in the NBA that will make up for some of that. Also, Livers is a better per minute rebounder than Jerami Grant anyways. Livers got 3 RPG in 20 MPG last year and Grant got 4 in 30 so overall per minute Livers is better even though he's smaller and spends more time on the perimeter on offense (and defense).

[whitehops]

Livers is my pick for starting forward. You can call him a SF and Bey a SF or vice versa doesn't matter.

#1. Livers plays winning basketball. He's a high IQ player and often makes the right play for teammates. This will help Cade and Ivey.

#2. He's a good shooter. As good as Bey most likely but he hasn't had the same volume so we'll see where he goes with it this year in a bigger role hopefully.

#3. He's a better defender than most of the guys on the team. Bey and Bagley were both bottom 25 defenders in the entire league for players that played 20+ MPG last season so you can put Livers on the opposing team's better player at the 3/4 spot and Bey on the weaker or slower player.

#4. As mentioned above, Livers gives you a very switchable starting unit that you don't get from having Bagley out there.

#5. The concern overall might be lack of rebounding, but I have a feeling that Ivey and Cade will end up being one of the better rebounding starting backcourts in the NBA that will make up for some of that. Also, Livers is a better per minute rebounder than Jerami Grant anyways. Livers got 3 RPG in 20 MPG last year and Grant got 4 in 30 so overall per minute Livers is better even though he's smaller and spends more time on the perimeter on offense (and defense).

#2. yeah livers is great in catch and shoot situations, but bey is able to get his shot off in many more ways (hence the volume) which is more valuable, even if his 3P% is lower.

#5. defensive rebounding is a team responsibility and somewhat schematic. i'm guessing they'll want ivey to crash defensive boards a lot so he can push the ball in transition. plus it's not exactly like bagley is a stud rebounder, he's pretty comparable to guys like lyles, olynyk and diallo despite his athleticism.

[zeebneeb]

Livers is my pick for starting forward. You can call him a SF and Bey a SF or vice versa doesn't matter.

#1. Livers plays winning basketball. He's a high IQ player and often makes the right play for teammates. This will help Cade and Ivey.

#2. He's a good shooter. As good as Bey most likely but he hasn't had the same volume so we'll see where he goes with it this year in a bigger role hopefully.

#3. He's a better defender than most of the guys on the team. Bey and Bagley were both bottom 25 defenders in the entire league for players that played 20+ MPG last season so you can put Livers on the opposing team's better player at the 3/4 spot and Bey on the weaker or slower player.

#4. As mentioned above, Livers gives you a very switchable starting unit that you don't get from having Bagley out there.

#5. The concern overall might be lack of rebounding, but I have a feeling that Ivey and Cade will end up being one of the better rebounding starting backcourts in the NBA that will make up for some of that. Also, Livers is a better per minute rebounder than Jerami Grant anyways. Livers got 3 RPG in 20 MPG last year and Grant got 4 in 30 so overall per minute Livers is better even though he's smaller and spends more time on the perimeter on offense (and defense).

#2. yeah livers is great in catch and shoot situations, but bey is able to get his shot off in many more ways (hence the volume) which is more valuable, even if his 3P% is lower.

#5. defensive rebounding is a team responsibility and somewhat schematic. i'm guessing they'll want ivey to crash defensive boards a lot so he can push the ball in transition. plus it's not exactly like bagley is a stud rebounder, he's pretty comparable to guys like lyles, olynyk and diallo despite his athleticism.

I am still not sold on the Cade/Ivey combo working, but the one way that I can see it working is in the fast-break. Cade loves to grab the rebound himself (much like Doncic) and play 4-up(again, much like Doncic)and Ivey with his insane speed will give Cade a ton of potential 3/4 court passes to the opposing rim for dunks, and layups as he loves to leak out ahead of the pack.

The oddball pairing of these two may end up being beneficial to both players, but I gotta see it to believe it.

[bstein14]

Livers is my pick for starting forward. You can call him a SF and Bey a SF or vice versa doesn't matter.

#1. Livers plays winning basketball. He's a high IQ player and often makes the right play for teammates. This will help Cade and Ivey.

#2. He's a good shooter. As good as Bey most likely but he hasn't had the same volume so we'll see where he goes with it this year in a bigger role hopefully.

#3. He's a better defender than most of the guys on the team. Bey and Bagley were both bottom 25 defenders in the entire league for players that played 20+ MPG last season so you can put Livers on the opposing team's better player at the 3/4 spot and Bey on the weaker or slower player.

#4. As mentioned above, Livers gives you a very switchable starting unit that you don't get from having Bagley out there.

#5. The concern overall might be lack of rebounding, but I have a feeling that Ivey and Cade will end up being one of the better rebounding starting backcourts in the NBA that will make up for some of that. Also, Livers is a better per minute rebounder than Jerami Grant anyways. Livers got 3 RPG in 20 MPG last year and Grant got 4 in 30 so overall per minute Livers is better even though he's smaller and spends more time on the perimeter on offense (and defense).

#2. yeah livers is great in catch and shoot situations, but bey is able to get his shot off in many more ways (hence the volume) which is more valuable, even if his 3P% is lower.

#5. defensive rebounding is a team responsibility and somewhat schematic. i'm guessing they'll want ivey to crash defensive boards a lot so he can push the ball in transition. plus it's not exactly like bagley is a stud rebounder, he's pretty comparable to guys like lyles, olynyk and diallo despite his athleticism.

I am still not sold on the Cade/Ivey combo working, but the one way that I can see it working is in the fast-break. Cade loves to grab the rebound himself (much like Doncic) and play 4-up(again, much like Doncic)and Ivey with his insane speed will give Cade a ton of potential 3/4 court passes to the opposing rim for dunks, and layups as he loves to leak out ahead of the pack.

The oddball pairing of these two may end up being beneficial to both players, but I gotta see it to believe it.

They should be great in transition for sure. This year, they are also getting rid of the intentional foul to stop a fast break so hopefully our D turns into some exciting run and gun offense.

Wether or not the two of them end up pairing well in the backcourt will depend a lot on whether or not Ivey ends up having a decent catch and shoot game. I know he'll be good off at the ball cuts like Diallo with that athleticism, but in reality it will be new for Ivey to have the ball a lot less.... part of the reason I think Ivey being first out with him then coming back in to rest Cade and run the offense with the 2nd unit might work out well for him and his development.

[DET_Athletics]

Noel is the backup start of the season until Duren gets his bearings. Then Noel looks decent enough at the trade deadline and we can package him and hopefully Burke's, Olynk and Hamido with picks for an upgrade for Sg and Pf if we over-perform.

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[DET_Athletics]

Interesting to have Livers starting at PF. He and Cade are almost identical size-wise(Livers is listed at 230lbs. If Cade did put on the "summer 15" he and Livers would be exact)

That would be a potentially damn good shooting squad that's for sure. 5 legitimate threats from deep, and some damn good defense. Hopefully Bey even gets back to how he played defense in his rookie year, and that could be a damn good lineup.

Cade 6'7 215-230lbs
Ivey 6'4 195lbs
Bey 6'7 215lbs
Livers 6'7 230lbs
Stewart 6'8 250lbs

Very switchable that's for damn sure.

Very little shot Blocking, Stewart is better weak-side clean up, doesn't have the height to be a true Anchor. But that would be a deadly offensive lineup.

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[Cowology]

Shot-blocking is at an all time low in terms of importance. Gotta be able to switch in todays league.

Not saying shotblocking isn't important, but I wouldn't get too hung up on it either. I forget exactly, but I think like 3 of the top 4 defensive teams last season where below average shot blocking.

[zeebneeb]

Interesting to have Livers starting at PF. He and Cade are almost identical size-wise(Livers is listed at 230lbs. If Cade did put on the "summer 15" he and Livers would be exact)

That would be a potentially damn good shooting squad that's for sure. 5 legitimate threats from deep, and some damn good defense. Hopefully Bey even gets back to how he played defense in his rookie year, and that could be a damn good lineup.

Cade 6'7 215-230lbs
Ivey 6'4 195lbs
Bey 6'7 215lbs
Livers 6'7 230lbs
Stewart 6'8 250lbs

Very switchable that's for damn sure.

Very little shot Blocking, Stewart is better weak-side clean up, doesn't have the height to be a true Anchor. But that would be a deadly offensive lineup.

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True on the shot-blocking, but Piston fans are always going to use defense as a measuring stick because of how good historically their teams are defensively. The 03-07 teams blocked every damn thing, while also being amazing defensively.

Not a fair comp. With that said, I fully expect Duren, at some point, to be near the top of the league in that category. Stewart at 25mpg is already at 1.1bpg, so if he does indeed end up as a starting 4, alongside Duren, it'll be close.

Cade is also way, way above average at his position for BPG, and Ivey has shown he loves to trail as a defender to block a shot.

The real issue is Bey, who is no Prince on that end.

[Manocad]

Interesting to have Livers starting at PF. He and Cade are almost identical size-wise(Livers is listed at 230lbs. If Cade did put on the "summer 15" he and Livers would be exact)

That would be a potentially damn good shooting squad that's for sure. 5 legitimate threats from deep, and some damn good defense. Hopefully Bey even gets back to how he played defense in his rookie year, and that could be a damn good lineup.

Cade 6'7 215-230lbs
Ivey 6'4 195lbs
Bey 6'7 215lbs
Livers 6'7 230lbs
Stewart 6'8 250lbs

Very switchable that's for damn sure.

Very little shot Blocking, Stewart is better weak-side clean up, doesn't have the height to be a true Anchor. But that would be a deadly offensive lineup.

Sent from my SM-S908U using RealGM mobile app

True on the shot-blocking, but Piston fans are always going to use defense as a measuring stick because of how good historically their teams are defensively. The 03-07 teams blocked every damn thing, while also being amazing defensively.

Not a fair comp. With that said, I fully expect Duren, at some point, to be near the top of the league in that category. Stewart at 25mpg is already at 1.1bpg, so if he does indeed end up as a starting 4, alongside Duren, it'll be close.

Cade is also way, way above average at his position for BPG, and Ivey has shown he loves to trail as a defender to block a shot.

The real issue is Bey, who is no Prince on that end.

You got that right. Bey currently is on the opposite end of the spectrum from Prince relative to defensive capability.

Not that Prince's defense should ever be the measuring stick for Bey, of course. Prince was a legit 6'9" with great athleticism while Bey is 6'7" with below average athleticism for his position. Regardless of how well Bey plays defense relative to developing great instincts and footwork, he's never going to be Prince based on height/athleticism alone.