Trade deadline thread

[Invictus88]

I want to preface this by saying this is going to be an unpopular opinion.

What I want to hold onto with Wiseman is that it's very realistic that he hasn't had the opportunity to develop yet:

1. He was basically a high school player coming into the NBA due to his suspension a handful of games into his only college season
2. He played 39 games his first year which was shortened by a meniscus injury
3. He had surgery for that and was out the entirety of the following year
4. This year he has been limited to garbage time minutes (averaging 12.5 minutes over only 21 appearances) as Golden State has been largely focusing on playing vets instead.

So it's 60 total games. The first 40 or so after basically being in high school and the next 20 coming off being away for over a year from the game of basketball.

Now am I saying that he is guaranteed in any way to pan out? No. But there's a lot of reasons to explain away the difficulties he has had so far.


Then I take a look at Saddiq Bey:

He's shot below the league average in 3pt shooting the last 2 years (which was 35-36%, Saddiq: 34.5) and way below in 2pt% (47% vs Saddiq's 40%). He's tried to compensate for that by getting free throws but that requires fairly high usage in order to be effective. Basically you need to put the ball in the hands of a sub-par shooter and hope he gets fouled while shooting.

And his defense is absolutely positively terrible -- which is surprising given his tough attitude. You would have figured that would somehow translate to improvement but that never came.

In his current form he was not ever going to be part of the Pistons long-term future. I don't think there's a lot more headroom in terms of potential there and it's difficult to justify paying big dollars to effectively this generation's version of a volume shooter.

So Weaver flipped him for someone he believes highly in that didn't ever get a real chance to develop. We get a year to see if that happens. If opportunity was indeed the issue then his upside is way higher than Saddiq's.

Fire away.

[breezypeezy]

Saddiq never impressed me, he turned himself into a non defending inefficient chucker that didnt contribute on the boards. Sure hed have a good game every 4th or 5th outing, but Casey thought he was some super important cog to a winning future which was delusional.
Id much rather gamble on Wisemans upside.

We could very well have an elite big man platoon with Duren and Wiseman owning the paint for 48 minutes.
Bey was never all that imo.

[CDM_Stats]

I want to preface this by saying this is going to be an unpopular opinion.

What I want to hold onto with Wiseman is that it's very realistic that he hasn't had the opportunity to develop yet:

1. He was basically a high school player coming into the NBA due to his suspension a handful of games into his only college season
2. He played 39 games his first year which was shortened by a meniscus injury
3. He had surgery for that and was out the entirety of the following year
4. This year he has been limited to garbage time minutes (averaging 12.5 minutes over only 21 appearances) as Golden State has been largely focusing on playing vets instead.

So it's 60 total games. The first 40 or so after basically being in high school and the next 20 coming off being away for over a year from the game of basketball.

A reasoned approach, and I do want to add a little context to pts 2 and 4:

2) Our team was a mess at this point. We had just added Wiggins, who was nowhere near the defender he was last year, and we also added Kelly Oubre, who was a much, much worse player for us than rookie Wiseman. Our defense requires high BBIQ, especially on the perimeter, and Wiggins took a while to learn off-ball whereas Oubre was a destructive force to our perimeter defense, which meant rookie Wiseman was having established NBA starters go after his head after essentially being a HSSR. Nevertheless, tracking showed he was improving noticeably before the injuries started derailing (not including the big meniscus injury)

4) After an 18 month layoff, Wiseman was dropped into a rotation with a bunch of players who hadnt played together, and saw a lot of the same issues: we would be beat way more often on the perimeter, and Wiseman - now with a toned upper body and weak lower body due to injury - was off-balance and not immediately successful. 10 games guys. And people used that, and the rookie season, as evidence that he's a total bust.

If you want to venture over to the W's board, myself and a couple others were watching his GL games this year - as well as NBA games. And there is one consistent thing with him thats plain as day to see: if he's healthy and playing ball, he improved quite a bit. Offense and defense. That doesnt negate his questionable hands and his terrible rebounding instincts, but as I said before: this is one of the better buy-lows I've seen in a long time, and I think the Pistons took advantage of the Warriors' questionable developmental strategies in making this happen. I dont know how Detroit operates at all, but when a guy steps into the game with his PnR and makes Ty Jerome, Ty **** Jerome, run that play at an elite level.. when that same guy becomes a rotationally sound C in our switch-heavy system (though he's way better at the drop coverage).. that's a player worth an individual effort to develop. If the Pistons do that, I think they just fleeced the Warriors, for a player that seemed to have fallen out of favor here

[edmunder_prc]

Saddiq never impressed me, he turned himself into a non defending inefficient chucker that didnt contribute on the boards. Sure hed have a good game every 4th or 5th outing, but Casey thought he was some super important cog to a winning future which was delusional.
Id much rather gamble on Wisemans upside.

We could very well have an elite big man platoon with Duren and Wiseman owning the paint for 48 minutes.
Bey was never all that imo.

Weaver drafted some guys and Bey was the only one that really seemed to be a normal basketball player with an identifiable position and set of skills.

The other draftees were a PG that couldn't dribble or shoot and a way undersized C with bad hands that couldn't shoot. At least Bey was a SF that scored points. That's why he played a ton.

Didnt we have a "CORE FOUR" of Hayes, Bey, Stewart and Saben Lee?

[Manocad]

I love it for the sole reason that posters here don't.

[bstein14]

Just read who the draft guru Weavers top guy was in 2020 if we won the lotto.

"Wiseman, who was the No. 2 overall pick in 2020, has long had fans in Detroit’s front office. According to team sources who were granted anonymity to speak freely, Wiseman was the top player on the Pistons’ big board during the 2020 NBA Draft process."

https://theathletic.com/4173719/2023/02/09/pistons-trade-james-wiseman-bey/

What was that based off of? Didn't Wiseman only play a few games in college and was pretty normal looking big man?

Most GMs are really bad at their jobs. In 2-3 years Weaver will likely (be honest here) not be the GM or we will all have our pitchforks out because Cade/Ivey/Duren still only put the Pistons as the 8th seed and we blew a ton of money on more Plumlee type signings.

Funny thing is, the Hornets got a 2nd rounder for taking Plumlee for us, and he's been a pretty solid center for them for the $$$ he makes.... and then since they are tanking this year they got another 2nd rounder for trading him to the Clippers so a win/win for them.

[detroitKG]

Buckle up?

Read on Twitter

[Piston Pete]

Just take GP2 out. Seems easy

[detroitKG]

I would have to think that GS sends it through anyway because of the money they save...but who knows

[bstein14]

I'm not sure how that works... for GS it was going to be costly to get GP2 but they won't want all that extra luxury tax payments if he can't be healthy for the playoffs this season.

Can teams "rework" a trade if one player fails a physical? Could GS just take Bey + Knox instead? Probably not. Originally the trade was reported without Portland and then they were added to it with the 5 2nd rounders from Atlanta going to Portland instead but I'm not sure how likely it is for a trade like this to be reworked.

[bstein14]

From the latest tweet.... GS had until tomorrow to either approve the physical or the entire 4 team trade falls through. It can't be reworked with other things going to other places after the trade deadline.

[DBC10]

From the latest tweet.... GS had until tomorrow to either approve the physical or the entire 4 team trade falls through. It can't be reworked with other things going to other places after the trade deadline.

Hilarious

[Canadafan]

Way to go you negative jack asses lol. You jinxed the trade! Wiseman will now become a perennial all star with the Warriors

[440BB]

Way to go you negative jack asses lol. You almost jinxed the trade! Wiseman will now become a perennial all star with the Pistons

FTFY, optimistically.