Woj: THJ to Det

[flow]

Not a bum at this point. But that might look like a Middleton trade a few years from now.

And he's done nothing to fortify the team, which could be done with very little effort.

Nothing to fortify the team? I mean, that Beasley fella has been a decent acquisition, and the Monty to Bickerstaff upgrade is not nothing.

I didn't like the Grimes trade either but he's not some Middleton level player that the Pistons will forever regret trading, the guy has been traded 3 times in a year for a reason I'd think.

I mean since the season began, since Ivey went down....

[thesack12]

Not sure why Langdon is beyond reproach.

Sure you can choose to grade based on the conglomerate so far, but that doesn't mean a bad move is undeserving of criticism. Gifting Grimes to Dallas was a bad move then and looks worse now.

I hear people saying Grimes, didn't want to be in Detroit. So what? Holland obviously didn't want to come to Detroit, and they drafted him anyways. Besides, even if you want to play that card why was it required to gift him to Dallas before the offseason even officially started? Detroit had months to move him, and teams are always looking for 3 & D prospects.

[Kalamazoo317]

and looks worse now.

I dunno. Not sure I'm fully convinced of that. Do you really think our w/l record would be fundamentally different with Grimes on our team instead of THJ?

[thesack12]

and looks worse now.

I dunno. Not sure I'm fully convinced of that. Do you really think our w/l record would be fundamentally different with Grimes on our team instead of THJ?

I don't think those are mutually exclusive situations.

[Kalamazoo317]

and looks worse now.

I dunno. Not sure I'm fully convinced of that. Do you really think our w/l record would be fundamentally different with Grimes on our team instead of THJ?

I don't think those are mutually exclusive situations.

Agreed, they're fairly inclusive of each other in fact. How the trade looks (your metric) has a lot to do with impact on winning, and it's hard to argue against THJ's acquisition having had a positive impact on winning so far.

[thesack12]

I dunno. Not sure I'm fully convinced of that. Do you really think our w/l record would be fundamentally different with Grimes on our team instead of THJ?

I don't think those are mutually exclusive situations.

Agreed, they're fairly inclusive of each other in fact. How the trade looks (your metric) has a lot to do with impact on winning, and it's hard to argue against THJ's acquisition having had a positive impact on winning so far.

Seeing as how Hardaway was a straight salary dump, and Dallas was antsy to get that done before Day 1 of the new league year, I'm pretty confident that you could have got Hardaway without sending any assets to Dallas. Let alone, Grimes who was the best asset involved in that deal.

[hoophabit]

The record says the vet acquistions haven't been entirely futile. THJ does deserve credit for his charges taken numbers. Not coming close to 28 straight losses has been great. Of course, I wish they were better.

[flow]

and looks worse now.

I dunno. Not sure I'm fully convinced of that. Do you really think our w/l record would be fundamentally different with Grimes on our team instead of THJ?

Who cares about this season? When you're the worst team in the league and starving for young talent to build around a young star, you're not making a trade for the next season. You're striving to build a competitive team for the near future. You don't trade away a budding young 3 & D talent (which is what we've been crying for here. defense and shooting in the same player) for an aging, decent, one-dimensional player when you're in that position. Now, I understand that Grimes didn't show last season what he has shown this season offensively. But to say you opposed the trade at the time but are fine with it now makes no sense. Hardaway is not part of the future here, and he's not a needle-mover.

[Snakebites]

Yep. Grimes truly has become the new Christian Wood of this franchise.

A wholly unremarkable player who, yeah, we could have kept around, but one certain subsets of the fanbase have now developed an obsession with.

TL isn't above reproach but this is a small thing.

[Kalamazoo317]

and looks worse now.

I dunno. Not sure I'm fully convinced of that. Do you really think our w/l record would be fundamentally different with Grimes on our team instead of THJ?

Who cares about this season? When you're the worst team in the league and starving for young talent to build around a young star, you're not making a trade for the next season. You're striving to build a competitive team for the near future. You don't trade a budding young 3 & D talent (which is what we're been crying for here. defense and shooting in the same player) for an aging, mediocre one-dimensional player when you're in that position. Now, I understand that Grimes didn't show last season what he has shown this season offensively. But to say you opposed the trade at the time but are fine with it now makes no sense. Hardaway is not part of the future here, and he's not a needle-mover.

Well, no, it's not. Because I *do* care about this season. What doesn't make any sense to me is if you don't.

We're building a culture and dragging our franchise out of the cellar and helping cement our franchise player as a star. All of that is about this season and the improvement we've made this season and all of that has great value to fans, to the franchise, to the players, and to the future. And, like it or not, THJ has been a significant part of all of that.

If nobody cares about this season or should care about this season, then we should all be mad they're not tanking for Cooper Flagg.

[thesack12]

Yep. Grimes truly has become the new Christian Wood of this franchise.

A wholly unremarkable player who, yeah, we could have kept around, but one certain subsets of the fanbase have now developed an obsession with.

TL isn't above reproach but this is a small thing.

I guess some folks' determination of what an "obsession" entails, is pretty loose these days.

[Snakebites]

Yep. Grimes truly has become the new Christian Wood of this franchise.

A wholly unremarkable player who, yeah, we could have kept around, but one certain subsets of the fanbase have now developed an obsession with.

TL isn't above reproach but this is a small thing.

I guess some folks' determination of what an "obsession" entails, is pretty loose these days.

You can call it something different if it suits you. I think he's getting more attention than he deserves. Just like Christian Wood.

[DetroitSho]

Yep. Grimes truly has become the new Christian Wood of this franchise.

A wholly unremarkable player who, yeah, we could have kept around, but one certain subsets of the fanbase have now developed an obsession with.

TL isn't above reproach but this is a small thing.

I probably disagree with 95% of what you post, but I'll be damned if this ain't about the most accurate description you could give. I had honestly forgotten about Grimes until he was traded. Man, talk about "just a guy." SHEESH!

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[thesack12]

Yep. Grimes truly has become the new Christian Wood of this franchise.

A wholly unremarkable player who, yeah, we could have kept around, but one certain subsets of the fanbase have now developed an obsession with.

TL isn't above reproach but this is a small thing.

I guess some folks' determination of what an "obsession" entails, is pretty loose these days.

You can call it something different if it suits you. I think he's getting more attention than he deserves. Just like Christian Wood.

I mean, the thread was dormant for 7 months until a player who Detroit previously moved was involved in another transaction. Its not like guys were in here posting Grimes' box scores and advanced stats on a regular basis.

I personally see it as completely valid to re-evaluate the Grimes move seeing as how he was just involved in another trade. Its not like the thread was bumped completely out of left field. Or bumped for the explicit reason to curse the franchise for trading away the guy.

If other folks don't think its valid, that's completely fine. However, it would be hypocritical of them to discuss or re-visit any previous Pistons' transaction whenever a new relevant event to that transaction takes place.

[DetroitSho]

I guess some folks' determination of what an "obsession" entails, is pretty loose these days.

You can call it something different if it suits you. I think he's getting more attention than he deserves. Just like Christian Wood.

I mean, the thread was dormant for 7 months until a player who Detroit previously moved was involved in another transaction. Its not like guys were in here posting Grimes' box scores and advanced stats on a regular basis.

I personally see it as completely valid to re-evaluate the Grimes move seeing as how he was just involved in another trade. Its not like the thread was bumped completely out of left field. Or bumped for the explicit reason to curse the franchise for trading away the guy.

If other folks don't think its valid, that's completely fine. However, it would be hypocritical of them to discuss or re-visit any previous Pistons' transaction whenever a new relevant event to that transaction takes place.

Sooooo you're saying it's getting bumped when he signs his contract in the summer, and when he's traded again in a year or 2, etc?

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[the_l_train]

Just to reiterate for the people on Grimes bandwagon:

THE DUDE DIDN'T WANT TO BE HERE.