Game 9. (3-5) @ Los Angeles Lakers (4-7). 9:30PM ET.

[E-Z]

The game was infuriating to watch. Is the overall combination of IQ and maturity that low for this team? A lot of turnovers weren't forced by the Lakers at all. Detroit was just giving up the ball and didn't get back on defense for whatever reason. That's what bothered me the most.

Detroit's pick and roll defense looked slightly more consistent tonight. However, all of the sagging into the lane by virtually everyone is highly annoying. Also, the allowance of dribble penetration from guys like Steve Blake and Jordan Farmar is embarrassing. Detroit places so much emphasis on forcing turnovers, yet they have an infrequent rate of conversion.

Detroit doesn't force turnovers in a conventional matter. Miami traps ball handlers in the corner and other teams feature elite ball hawks that don't compromise team defense. I don't see either within the Pistons. I would like to see less gambling and more communication, more staying with your man, and less helping others. Monroe, Smith, and Drummond should be able to play their opponents straight up.

Help defense is fine, as long as the offense cannot easily make one pass or skip the ball over to the weak-side. I saw Gasol dart the ball to the opposite corner one possession; simply because he clearly saw the double coming. That's a staple of bad defense.

I turned the game off when the Lakers ended the 3rd on a 7-something run. I just checked the box-score throughout the remainder of the game, and just shook my head as the Lakers' lead increased. That shouldn't have occurred by any stretch. However, it did. Detroit is completely the inverse of what they're supposed to be and I can't envision the team winning more than 30 games at this rate.

[Clarity]

Drummond makes Ben Wallace look like Hakeem offensively.

drummond is one of the worst defenders in the nba.

lol... ahh fans

[Clarity]

I love it how some fans are using the "LA just got hot" bull crap of an excuse. Yeah, just like Portland and Golden State just randomly got hot too right? At some point, have to realize teams are getting hot for a reason. Starts with Drummond to be honest, dude has been terrible this season. On a bad team with no expectations, you can go through the motions of a game, grab 11 rebounds, dunk a few times and receive all the praise in the world. But on a team with actual expectations, it's not going to fly. I can't think of one game, NOT ONE GAME, this season where he put everything together for a full game and looked like the Drummond everyone was so high on last year.

And people talk about how soft Blake Griffin is but Monroe makes Blake Griffin look like Charles Oakley out there.

Difference being some of you guys clearly had unrealistic expectations.

I'm starting to think some of you guys had wayyyyyyyyyyy unrealistic expectations in fact, either that or this is the most emotional group of people i've ever seen in my life. lol

[MrBigShot]

Everything thus far has been Dre relying only on athleticism. He has the potential to be the best bigman in the NBA. Guys like Dirk, KG and Duncan are starting to get closer to retirement. There really aren't any "great" big men right now. Dwight is not the same athletically as he was in Orlando. Griffin/Love/LMA/Bosh/Hibbert are good, but not the type of players who can completely dominate a game.

Yeah he's putting up 12/12/2/1 on 66% from the field, but I haven't seen discipline, intensity, and awareness from him. It's not enough just to coast on physical talent...6'10, 280lbs and yet quicker than most bigmen, and a freak athlete. Those stats feel empty.

[E-Z]

Everything thus far has been Dre relying only on athleticism. He has the potential to be the best bigman in the NBA. Guys like Dirk, KG and Duncan are starting to get closer to retirement. There really aren't any "great" big men right now. Dwight is not the same athletically as he was in Orlando. Griffin/Love/LMA/Bosh/Hibbert are good, but not the type of players who can completely dominate a game.

Yeah he's putting up 12/12/2/1 on 66% from the field, but I haven't seen discipline, intensity, and awareness from him. It's not enough just to coast on physical talent...6'10, 280lbs and yet quicker than most bigmen, and a freak athlete. Those stats feel empty.

Drummond is far from pure athleticism. Offensively, he's efficient as ever. He is more athletic version of Tyson Chandler on that side of the ball. He makes intelligent reads on where the ball will be, and cuts to the basket when help collapses nearby. Defensively, his awareness is off.

Detroit easily becomes one of the worst offensive teams when he's not on the floor.

[MrBigShot]

Everything thus far has been Dre relying only on athleticism. He has the potential to be the best bigman in the NBA. Guys like Dirk, KG and Duncan are starting to get closer to retirement. There really aren't any "great" big men right now. Dwight is not the same athletically as he was in Orlando. Griffin/Love/LMA/Bosh/Hibbert are good, but not the type of players who can completely dominate a game.

Yeah he's putting up 12/12/2/1 on 66% from the field, but I haven't seen discipline, intensity, and awareness from him. It's not enough just to coast on physical talent...6'10, 280lbs and yet quicker than most bigmen, and a freak athlete. Those stats feel empty.

Drummond is far from pure athleticism. Offensively, he's efficient as ever. He is more athletic version of Tyson Chandler on that side of the ball. He makes intelligent reads on where the ball will be, and cuts to the basket when help collapses nearby. Defensively, his awareness is off.

Detroit easily becomes one of the worst offensive teams when he's not on the floor.

Most of his offense comes from drop offs, put backs and alley oops. He's able to finish well because he's a freak athlete and very strong. That's why he's so efficient. I didn't expect him to come in to this season looking like Hakeem...but hopefully he can start to show a more consistent jump hook every once in a while as the year goes in.

[E-Z]

Everything thus far has been Dre relying only on athleticism. He has the potential to be the best bigman in the NBA. Guys like Dirk, KG and Duncan are starting to get closer to retirement. There really aren't any "great" big men right now. Dwight is not the same athletically as he was in Orlando. Griffin/Love/LMA/Bosh/Hibbert are good, but not the type of players who can completely dominate a game.

Yeah he's putting up 12/12/2/1 on 66% from the field, but I haven't seen discipline, intensity, and awareness from him. It's not enough just to coast on physical talent...6'10, 280lbs and yet quicker than most bigmen, and a freak athlete. Those stats feel empty.

Drummond is far from pure athleticism. Offensively, he's efficient as ever. He is more athletic version of Tyson Chandler on that side of the ball. He makes intelligent reads on where the ball will be, and cuts to the basket when help collapses nearby. Defensively, his awareness is off.

Detroit easily becomes one of the worst offensive teams when he's not on the floor.

Most of his offense comes from drop offs, put backs and alley oops. He's able to finish well because he's a freak athlete and very strong. That's why he's so efficient. I didn't expect him to come in to this season looking like Hakeem...but hopefully he can start to show a more consistent jump hook every once in a while as the year goes in.

I know how he scores his points. The fact is that he's efficient without his number being called. Detroit could use less players that need the ball in their hands. Not more. It's sad seeing Detroit incapable of knocking down spot up shots, but are capable of taking their man off the dribble for a much more difficult shot.

[need4detroit]

Everything thus far has been Dre relying only on athleticism. He has the potential to be the best bigman in the NBA. Guys like Dirk, KG and Duncan are starting to get closer to retirement. There really aren't any "great" big men right now. Dwight is not the same athletically as he was in Orlando. Griffin/Love/LMA/Bosh/Hibbert are good, but not the type of players who can completely dominate a game.

Yeah he's putting up 12/12/2/1 on 66% from the field, but I haven't seen discipline, intensity, and awareness from him. It's not enough just to coast on physical talent...6'10, 280lbs and yet quicker than most bigmen, and a freak athlete. Those stats feel empty.

Drummond is far from pure athleticism. Offensively, he's efficient as ever. He is more athletic version of Tyson Chandler on that side of the ball. He makes intelligent reads on where the ball will be, and cuts to the basket when help collapses nearby. Defensively, his awareness is off.

Detroit easily becomes one of the worst offensive teams when he's not on the floor.

Most of his offense comes from drop offs, put backs and alley oops. He's able to finish well because he's a freak athlete and very strong. That's why he's so efficient. I didn't expect him to come in to this season looking like Hakeem...but hopefully he can start to show a more consistent jump hook every once in a while as the year goes in.

He has an extremely High BBall IQ on offense. He's great at getting open. And does some little things that go unnoticed. Also, he is an elite screen-setter.

[Invictus88]

I love it how some fans are using the "LA just got hot" bull crap of an excuse. Yeah, just like Portland and Golden State just randomly got hot too right? At some point, have to realize teams are getting hot for a reason. Starts with Drummond to be honest, dude has been terrible this season. On a bad team with no expectations, you can go through the motions of a game, grab 11 rebounds, dunk a few times and receive all the praise in the world. But on a team with actual expectations, it's not going to fly. I can't think of one game, NOT ONE GAME, this season where he put everything together for a full game and looked like the Drummond everyone was so high on last year.

And people talk about how soft Blake Griffin is but Monroe makes Blake Griffin look like Charles Oakley out there.

Difference being some of you guys clearly had unrealistic expectations.

I'm starting to think some of you guys had wayyyyyyyyyyy unrealistic expectations in fact, either that or this is the most emotional group of people i've ever seen in my life. lol

This x 1 million.

I just can't understand how certain people can completely disregard prior events / repeated history and fully expect drastically different outcomes. I'm not saying that change is impossible -- just extremely unlikely in situations with lots of prior evidence to the contrary.

I'm just happy that the 2014 championship contenders thread hasn't made a reappearance on the front page...

[Clarity]

I saw the unrealistic expectations coming

I even saw the trade Monroe thing because aside from Lebron, every team has loons that try to trade their best player for no reason thinking the grass is greener on the other side.

I did not however see the turn on Drummond coming 80ish games into a pro career where he has FAR exceeded even the wildest expectations for him.

[Clarity]

I love it how some fans are using the "LA just got hot" bull crap of an excuse. Yeah, just like Portland and Golden State just randomly got hot too right? At some point, have to realize teams are getting hot for a reason. Starts with Drummond to be honest, dude has been terrible this season. On a bad team with no expectations, you can go through the motions of a game, grab 11 rebounds, dunk a few times and receive all the praise in the world. But on a team with actual expectations, it's not going to fly. I can't think of one game, NOT ONE GAME, this season where he put everything together for a full game and looked like the Drummond everyone was so high on last year.

And people talk about how soft Blake Griffin is but Monroe makes Blake Griffin look like Charles Oakley out there.

Difference being some of you guys clearly had unrealistic expectations.

I'm starting to think some of you guys had wayyyyyyyyyyy unrealistic expectations in fact, either that or this is the most emotional group of people i've ever seen in my life. lol

This x 1 million.

I just can't understand how certain people can completely disregard prior events / repeated history and fully expect drastically different outcomes. I'm not saying that change is impossible -- just extremely unlikely in situations with lots of prior evidence to the contrary.

I'm just happy that the 2014 championship contenders thread hasn't made a reappearance on the front page...

amen

[ImHeisenberg]

I did not however see the turn on Drummond coming 80ish games into a pro career where he has FAR exceeded even the wildest expectations for him.

That has been a little surprising for me as well. I understand a lot of people and pundits picked him to have a breakout season. But, I think the personal expectations were too high.

But, people who complained that Smith and Jennings were misfits for this team have been largely validated. Smith is a good player, but isn't being properly utilized on this team. It's like using a rake to mow the lawn. The rake's a damn fine tool, but isn't built to do the job you're expecting it to.

[Clarity]

I did not however see the turn on Drummond coming 80ish games into a pro career where he has FAR exceeded even the wildest expectations for him.

That has been a little surprising for me as well. I understand a lot of people and pundits picked him to have a breakout season. But, I think the personal expectations were too high.

But, people who complained that Smith and Jennings were misfits for this team have been largely validated. Smith is a good player, but isn't being properly utilized on this team. It's like using a rake to mow the lawn. The rake's a damn fine tool, but isn't built to do the job you're expecting it to.

Yeah expectations will always be high because of his ceiling but he is at 12 & 12 now which is outstanding & a significant bump from last year.

You know my feelings from the Summer on Josh.

[rock digger]

I did not however see the turn on Drummond coming 80ish games into a pro career where he has FAR exceeded even the wildest expectations for him.

That has been a little surprising for me as well. I understand a lot of people and pundits picked him to have a breakout season. But, I think the personal expectations were too high.

But, people who complained that Smith and Jennings were misfits for this team have been largely validated. Smith is a good player, but isn't being properly utilized on this team. It's like using a rake to mow the lawn. The rake's a damn fine tool, but isn't built to do the job you're expecting it to.

I think from a numbers standpoint that Drummond has fully met expectations, but people are angry at the lack off effort shown from Drummond, and rightly so. Last year, Drummond gave it his full effort and so people became accustomed to seeing a hard working, young, talented franchise player. He still has all the ability he had last year and built on it on the statsheet, but his lack of intensity is somewhat frustrating. I don't think expecting the same amount of effort that he put in last year is setting personal expectations too high.

[Q00]

I did not however see the turn on Drummond coming 80ish games into a pro career where he has FAR exceeded even the wildest expectations for him.

That has been a little surprising for me as well. I understand a lot of people and pundits picked him to have a breakout season. But, I think the personal expectations were too high.

The thing is he IS having a breakout season. 12 points, 12 rebounds, 2 steals, and a league-leading 65% FG is a breakout season for a player who avg 7 and 7 last year off the bench. Even people with high expectations have to be happy with Drummond thus far.

But, people who complained that Smith and Jennings were misfits for this team have been largely validated.

Not really, most people who said they wouldn't fit were referring strictly to offense, and said we would be great on defense. However, its actually been the exact opposite of what those people thought. They have fit fine on offense, but are worst in the league on defense. So not exactly validating anything, but that they were wrong.

I admit I was wrong about the defense because I thought they would be great too, but I expected them to fit offensively and they have thus far.

[hoophabit]

I did not however see the turn on Drummond coming 80ish games into a pro career where he has FAR exceeded even the wildest expectations for him.

That has been a little surprising for me as well. I understand a lot of people and pundits picked him to have a breakout season. But, I think the personal expectations were too high.

But, people who complained that Smith and Jennings were misfits for this team have been largely validated. Smith is a good player, but isn't being properly utilized on this team. It's like using a rake to mow the lawn. The rake's a damn fine tool, but isn't built to do the job you're expecting it to.

I think from a numbers standpoint that Drummond has fully met expectations, but people are angry at the lack off effort shown from Drummond, and rightly so. Last year, Drummond gave it his full effort and so people became accustomed to seeing a hard working, young, talented franchise player. He still has all the ability he had last year and built on it on the statsheet, but his lack of intensity is somewhat frustrating. I don't think expecting the same amount of effort that he put in last year is setting personal expectations too high.

I just don't see this lack of effort. He's being asked to play starter minutes and at the rate opposing players are getting into the paint he'd soon be fouled out if the went for everything. I think he's just trying to pick his spots. Drummond has a lot to learn, and can improve in every area, but I just don't see him dogging it. Gambling a little too much sometimes and ending up out of position, biting on pump fakes, and failing too often to block out, but not regularly failing to make an acceptable effort.

[Clarity]

I just don't see this lack of effort. He's being asked to play starter minutes and at the rate opposing players are getting into the paint he'd soon be fouled out if the went for everything. I think he's just trying to pick his spots. Drummond has a lot to learn, and can improve in every area, but I just don't see him dogging it. Gambling a little too much sometimes and ending up out of position, biting on pump fakes, and failing too often to block out, but not regularly failing to make an acceptable effort.

There is no lack of effort, thats the height of silliness. Some just cant have realistic expectations & they want Drummond to be a finished product 80 games in. Our perimeter defense has really been struggling on this road trip, nothing more, nothing less. Hopefully the Palace will help straighten that out.

Your post nailed it re Drum though, well said.

[Q00]

If I had to recap our season thus far in one 15 second gif, this would be it:



lol

[ImHeisenberg]

I think from a numbers standpoint that Drummond has fully met expectations, but people are angry at the lack off effort shown from Drummond, and rightly so. Last year, Drummond gave it his full effort and so people became accustomed to seeing a hard working, young, talented franchise player. He still has all the ability he had last year and built on it on the statsheet, but his lack of intensity is somewhat frustrating. I don't think expecting the same amount of effort that he put in last year is setting personal expectations too high.

Fair points. I think he's acclimating himself to playing starters minutes. He would go all-out in 20 minutes last season, and be pooped by the end of them. He can't go all-out for 40 minutes a night. Only a select few players can actually play like that.

And again, he's playing against the opposing team's fresh starters. So, his learning curve has become more steep.

Playing great defense isn't going "all out", it's more the mental aspect of the game and timing. This should come with experience. I'm not selling my Drummond stock just yet.