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KCP, Stanley and Ellenson for Middleton??

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Re: KCP, Stanley and Ellenson for Middleton?? 

Post#61 » by theBigLip » Sun Jul 10, 2016 11:36 pm

Todd3 wrote:Biggest difference between Stan's past teams and his Pistons teams is 3pt efficiency.

3pt%

2004: 7th
2005: 3rd
2008: 4th
2009: 7th
2010: 3rd
2011: 10th
2012: 3rd

Pistons

2015: 17th
2016: 22nd

It's undeniable that 3pt shooting was a major element to Stan's success with those teams, so I just don't understand how we're supposed to achieve the same success with average to below average shooting when they were elite every year.

Realistically, can a team 22nd in 3pt% become top 5-10 with the same personnel, or is it more likely that they'll need to add better shooters to do it?


There certainly has been better shooters added. I'll bet you we'll be better than 22nd this year for sure!
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Re: KCP, Stanley and Ellenson for Middleton?? 

Post#62 » by Todd3 » Sun Jul 10, 2016 11:48 pm

theBigLip wrote:
Todd3 wrote:Biggest difference between Stan's past teams and his Pistons teams is 3pt efficiency.

3pt%

2004: 7th
2005: 3rd
2008: 4th
2009: 7th
2010: 3rd
2011: 10th
2012: 3rd

Pistons

2015: 17th
2016: 22nd

It's undeniable that 3pt shooting was a major element to Stan's success with those teams, so I just don't understand how we're supposed to achieve the same success with average to below average shooting when they were elite every year.

Realistically, can a team 22nd in 3pt% become top 5-10 with the same personnel, or is it more likely that they'll need to add better shooters to do it?


There certainly has been better shooters added. I'll bet you we'll be better than 22nd this year for sure!


What better shooters have been added?

Leuer is the only shooter added at all that's expected to play next year, and he's just subbing in the Tolliver role, so we're really not gaining any shooting there.

Ish is also a downgrade from Blake from 3.

Playing Bullock more will help, but it'll be dependent on how much he actually plays. We might be better than 22nd, but the question is can we become top 5 with this current roster?
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Re: KCP, Stanley and Ellenson for Middleton?? 

Post#63 » by fpower » Mon Jul 11, 2016 12:27 am

BiGG RaBB wrote:I'm thinking SJ/Tobias/Baynes for Paul George



I'm in, lol.

But I don't think Indiana's in rebuild mode yet.
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Re: KCP, Stanley and Ellenson for Middleton?? 

Post#64 » by zeebneeb » Mon Jul 11, 2016 3:04 am

Todd3 wrote:
theBigLip wrote:
Todd3 wrote:Biggest difference between Stan's past teams and his Pistons teams is 3pt efficiency.

3pt%

2004: 7th
2005: 3rd
2008: 4th
2009: 7th
2010: 3rd
2011: 10th
2012: 3rd

Pistons

2015: 17th
2016: 22nd

It's undeniable that 3pt shooting was a major element to Stan's success with those teams, so I just don't understand how we're supposed to achieve the same success with average to below average shooting when they were elite every year.

Realistically, can a team 22nd in 3pt% become top 5-10 with the same personnel, or is it more likely that they'll need to add better shooters to do it?


There certainly has been better shooters added. I'll bet you we'll be better than 22nd this year for sure!


What better shooters have been added?

Leuer is the only shooter added at all that's expected to play next year, and he's just subbing in the Tolliver role, so we're really not gaining any shooting there.

Ish is also a downgrade from Blake from 3.

Playing Bullock more will help, but it'll be dependent on how much he actually plays. We might be better than 22nd, but the question is can we become top 5 with this current roster?
We added no shooters, and we actually got worse shooting overall for this year.

Leuer was an anomaly last year, and so was Bullock as he was just terrible for the better part of a year.

The Detroit Pistons are the worst shooting team in NBA, perhaps in league history.
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Re: KCP, Stanley and Ellenson for Middleton?? 

Post#65 » by Todd3 » Mon Jul 11, 2016 5:09 am

zeebneeb wrote:
Todd3 wrote:
theBigLip wrote:
There certainly has been better shooters added. I'll bet you we'll be better than 22nd this year for sure!


What better shooters have been added?

Leuer is the only shooter added at all that's expected to play next year, and he's just subbing in the Tolliver role, so we're really not gaining any shooting there.

Ish is also a downgrade from Blake from 3.

Playing Bullock more will help, but it'll be dependent on how much he actually plays. We might be better than 22nd, but the question is can we become top 5 with this current roster?
We added no shooters, and we actually got worse shooting overall for this year.

Leuer was an anomaly last year, and so was Bullock as he was just terrible for the better part of a year.

The Detroit Pistons are the worst shooting team in NBA, perhaps in league history.


We added Leuer and subtracted Tolliver. How much shooting did we gain in that trade? I'd say about even, right?

Bullock is the best shooter on the team, but we didn't add him. He was already here and barely played. If he's going to get big minutes and start, that would be adding shooting to the rotation, but not if he's just going to play 10-15 mpg off the bench again. Agree?

I'm not hating. I'm just trying to assess the team objectively.
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Re: Re: Re: KCP, Stanley and Ellenson for Middleton?? 

Post#66 » by Pharaoh » Mon Jul 11, 2016 6:34 am

Todd3 wrote:Biggest difference between Stan's past teams and his Pistons teams is 3pt efficiency.

3pt%

2004: 7th
2005: 3rd
2008: 4th
2009: 7th
2010: 3rd
2011: 10th
2012: 3rd

Pistons

2015: 17th
2016: 22nd

It's undeniable that 3pt shooting was a major element to Stan's success with those teams, so I just don't understand how we're supposed to achieve the same success with average to below average shooting when they were elite every year.

Realistically, can a team 22nd in 3pt% become top 5-10 with the same personnel, or is it more likely that they'll need to add better shooters to do it?


Top 5? No! Top 10? Yeah, probably

You worry about contending for a championship with our guys as they are right now - we're not contending though and that's already established and no one is arguing otherwise.

What people argue is that TWO years from now we really don't know WTF we'll have here and if we'll have the same personnel or if they'll develop or improve or not.

SVG is willing to wait and see though
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Re: KCP, Stanley and Ellenson for Middleton?? 

Post#67 » by theBigLip » Mon Jul 11, 2016 3:45 pm

Todd3 wrote:
zeebneeb wrote:
Todd3 wrote:
What better shooters have been added?

Leuer is the only shooter added at all that's expected to play next year, and he's just subbing in the Tolliver role, so we're really not gaining any shooting there.

Ish is also a downgrade from Blake from 3.

Playing Bullock more will help, but it'll be dependent on how much he actually plays. We might be better than 22nd, but the question is can we become top 5 with this current roster?
We added no shooters, and we actually got worse shooting overall for this year.

Leuer was an anomaly last year, and so was Bullock as he was just terrible for the better part of a year.

The Detroit Pistons are the worst shooting team in NBA, perhaps in league history.


We added Leuer and subtracted Tolliver. How much shooting did we gain in that trade? I'd say about even, right?

Bullock is the best shooter on the team, but we didn't add him. He was already here and barely played. If he's going to get big minutes and start, that would be adding shooting to the rotation, but not if he's just going to play 10-15 mpg off the bench again. Agree?

I'm not hating. I'm just trying to assess the team objectively.


If you're basing 22nd place on the whole season, then it also involves removing Jennings and adding Harris. And Leuer should get substantial minutes. And I would expect each of our young core to each improve at least slightly. I would hate to think they've all peaked around the age of 23.
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Re: KCP, Stanley and Ellenson for Middleton?? 

Post#68 » by BMatt07 » Mon Jul 11, 2016 4:58 pm

DBC10 wrote:That's...not going to happen.

KMid is literally their only real asset/talent outside Giannis and his contract is looking better each year.


I hear this guy is pretty good.... :reporter: :banghead:

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vnYKO1sf9EE[/youtube]
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Re: KCP, Stanley and Ellenson for Middleton?? 

Post#69 » by zeebneeb » Mon Jul 11, 2016 5:27 pm

Todd3 wrote:
zeebneeb wrote:
Todd3 wrote:
What better shooters have been added?

Leuer is the only shooter added at all that's expected to play next year, and he's just subbing in the Tolliver role, so we're really not gaining any shooting there.

Ish is also a downgrade from Blake from 3.

Playing Bullock more will help, but it'll be dependent on how much he actually plays. We might be better than 22nd, but the question is can we become top 5 with this current roster?
We added no shooters, and we actually got worse shooting overall for this year.

Leuer was an anomaly last year, and so was Bullock as he was just terrible for the better part of a year.

The Detroit Pistons are the worst shooting team in NBA, perhaps in league history.


We added Leuer and subtracted Tolliver. How much shooting did we gain in that trade? I'd say about even, right?

Bullock is the best shooter on the team, but we didn't add him. He was already here and barely played. If he's going to get big minutes and start, that would be adding shooting to the rotation, but not if he's just going to play 10-15 mpg off the bench again. Agree?

I'm not hating. I'm just trying to assess the team objectively.
I'm not arguing. I believe this version of the Pistons has reached its maximum potential and moves need to be made.

I don't see how anyone can honestly believe that any internal improvements will be substantial whatsoever. These players are who they are, and I believe it's time to move on.
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Re: KCP, Stanley and Ellenson for Middleton?? 

Post#70 » by Alexander » Mon Jul 11, 2016 5:43 pm

zeebneeb wrote:
Todd3 wrote:
zeebneeb wrote:We added no shooters, and we actually got worse shooting overall for this year.

Leuer was an anomaly last year, and so was Bullock as he was just terrible for the better part of a year.

The Detroit Pistons are the worst shooting team in NBA, perhaps in league history.


We added Leuer and subtracted Tolliver. How much shooting did we gain in that trade? I'd say about even, right?

Bullock is the best shooter on the team, but we didn't add him. He was already here and barely played. If he's going to get big minutes and start, that would be adding shooting to the rotation, but not if he's just going to play 10-15 mpg off the bench again. Agree?

I'm not hating. I'm just trying to assess the team objectively.
I'm not arguing. I believe this version of the Pistons has reached its maximum potential and moves need to be made.

I don't see how anyone can honestly believe that any internal improvements will be substantial whatsoever. These players are who they are, and I believe it's time to move on.

100%.
19 year old Henry Ellenson will never get stronger. Studies have shown that no amount of professional development can affect muscle fibers of tall white guys named Henry.
20 year old Stanley is a finished product. No matter how hard he tries, his shot form will always revert to that of the 15-16 season.
23 year old KCP would be drafted in the second round because he's already peaked in his old age.
23 year old Drummond is proof of the old adage that big men take less time to develop than guards.
24 year old Harris can't take his headband off even if he wanted it to. It's just, like, stuck there.
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Re: KCP, Stanley and Ellenson for Middleton?? 

Post#71 » by Han Solo » Tue Jul 12, 2016 4:02 am

The_Irony wrote:You're horrible,

Go away.

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Re: KCP, Stanley and Ellenson for Middleton?? 

Post#72 » by captainrebel » Tue Jul 12, 2016 4:39 am

Boi, leave the studio. You mad or what?

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