Is KCP another Courtney Lee? Is that OK?

[El Chivo]

I was. The last possession made me puke. Mook, you're not Melo

[edmunder_prc]

Another typical KCP game.

5/12 shooting, played 36 minutes, most for the team. 2/7 for 3 pointers, with several being bad misses on very good looks against the worst team in the league.

The reason this is "good" is because our bench play included Hilliard going 1/5 in 9 minutes and Bullock coming in for 2 minutes going 0/1 on a 3 pointer.

This team needs guards/wings that aren't below average. Even average guards/wings would make the team much better.

[Cowology]

While I'm totally on board with saying KCP needs to improve his shooting/shot selection people are also blowing it a bit out of proportion. He's 4th on the team in FGA despite leading the team in minutes. His 12 FGA per game is also right in line with what Prince gave us in that same role and fairly reasonable for a 4th option.

I agree that we need to add more offensive talent and reduce KCP's role offensively, but it's not like we have a ton of other options at the moment and some people are making it sound like he's going all Kobe out there and jacking 25 shots a game.

[ElectricMayhem]

While I'm totally on board with saying KCP needs to improve his shooting/shot selection people are also blowing it a bit out of proportion. He's 4th on the team in FGA despite leading the team in minutes. His 12 FGA per game is also right in line with what Prince gave us in that same role and fairly reasonable for a 4th option.

Echoing Cow's point re: the idea that KCP is a chucker (which the 76ers broadcasters were also insinuating today), FGA per 36:
1. Darrun Hilliard 20.7 fga/36
2. Reggie Jackson 18.9 fga/36
3. Andre Drummond 15.2 fga/36
4. Stanley Johnson 14.0 fga/36
5. Marcus Morris 12.5 fga/36
T-6. Ersan Ilyasova 11.8 fga/36
T-6. Kentavious Caldwell-Pope 11.8 fga/36
t-8. Spencer Dinwiddie 11.4 fga/36
t-8. Aaron Baynes 11.4 fga/36
10. Jodie Meeks 10.6 fga/36
11. Steve Blake 10.1 fga/36
T-12. Anthony Tolliver 8.4 fga/36
T-12. Reggie Bullock 8.4 fga/36
14. Joel Anthony 5.1 fga/36

The guy is shooting around the same number of shots per minute as Spencer Dinwiddie or Aaron Baynes. I don't exactly see how you can ask him to tone it down.

[Cowology]

Sooo... just to recap; Reggie, Dre, Stanimal, Morris & Ersan are all shooting more.

The players KCP is shooting more than are the guys he *should* be shooting more than; Dinwiddie, Baynes, Blake, Toliver & Anthony.

Sounds about right to me.

[edmunder_prc]

Thought I would bump my first forum post 4 years ago about KCP.

The honest truth is the Pistons GM staff have been idiots for a decade.

Look at KCP. We were all happy with KCP at 8-9 million, maybe. Pistons tried a 80 million/4 year contract.

Anyways fun to see that at least on this point my fan eye ball test knew more about basketball than a NBA GM making millions of dollars.

New to the forum, but a very long time lurker (10 years?).

I don't have a lot of anaylsis but I remember when Lee was on the Magic and they were playing well. SVG was there and he seems like a similar player, with similar low offensive production, similar inability to put the ball on the floor and do anything productive with it most of the time and similar above average defense (without stellar obvious defensive stats like steals/blocks). Plus he has played his career with a KCP like place on the team, meaning 4th or 5th offensive role.

I bring this up because C. Lee is an UFA next year. He has made 5-6 million a year for the last 4 years on the Celtics and now in the Grizzles for the last 3 years. Does KCP deserve more or should we go for a player like C. Lee.

Lets go to the stats:

KCP http://espn.go.com/nba/player/stats/_/id/2581018/kentavious-caldwell-pope

Last year and this year, offensively KCP isn't very good.

Last year: 12 shots a game, .401. 5.4 for 3-pointers, .345. A few rebounds, an assist, a steal a game.
This year: 12 shots a game, .401. 4.4 for 3-pointers, .292. A few rebounds, an assist, a steal and a half a game.

Not much improvement, though eye ball test he puts the ball on the floor much more frequently. Also eye-ball he has horrendous shooting nights that I don't remember the previous two years, I think because he wasn't given nearly the green like this year. I don't see much improvement even with a better PG in Jackson from the last two years.

Another thing, very few FTA each year, just doesn't go to the rim strong very often (though this year some highlight dunks).


How about Courtney Lee: http://espn.go.com/nba/player/stats/_/id/3445/courtney-lee

One thing that's striking about Lee is that he seems to be aware of his game or his lack of offensive skill. Something that KCP hasn't quite recognized yet.

9 years in the league and his stats are nearly the same every year.

Year one with the Magic: 7 shots a game .450. 2.6 3-pointers, .404. A couple rebounds, an assist, a steal a game.

Similar to KCP very few FTs over the 9 years, just 1.5 FTA over the 9 year career.

Already looking good, was in a solid offense with a clear role. Probably 5th option that year behind Nelson, Turk, Lewis and Howard.

If you look at his stats and I suggest you do, what you see is 7,8,9 shots a game with a .450 average over the years. Very clear role, especially on the Grizzlies team and from what I remember on the Magic team.


Im of the opinion that KCP is bad for our team. In fact, very bad. On this team there is a huge need for shooting, shot creation and attacking the rim. KCP gives none of those. For our bench, we also need those same things. He is not a good fit for our team, especially for the 10 million people are talking about.

I hope my first post is alright and adds some discussion.