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treefi wrote:Garza looks a lot better than Lyles, that's for sure.

wish I could and1 this x100

More blood lol

treefi wrote:Garza looks a lot better than Lyles, that's for sure.

This is the most important part, in no world should Lyles get backup minutes over Garza behind Stewart.

Why do people have to pick the Pistons players relentlessly? Can't you just say "atta boy" for a damn rookie stepping into the starting role, and doing well?

Nope. Gotta pick. Pick, pick, pick.

bstein14 wrote:

Manocad wrote:

bstein14 wrote:Garza gets some on offense it negates all those defensive deficiencies. He's a ridiculously skilled player offensively he's way ahead of Cade at the moment.

It's crazy that such a lousy defensive player could draw a charge and be +8 in 9 minutes.

He's a below average defender. That doesn't mean he can't take a charge. He's a high IQ player. Dedmon got a walk in dunk on him on a Butler pick and roll where he showed to stop the Butler penetration but couldn't recover quickly enough to get back to Dedmon.

Nope, he's not as bad defensively as you say he is.

There, that was easy. Didn't even need any stats to do it.

ComboGuardCity wrote::

Manocad wrote:

bstein14 wrote:Garza gets some on offense it negates all those defensive deficiencies. He's a ridiculously skilled player offensively he's way ahead of Cade at the moment.

It's crazy that such a lousy defensive player could draw a charge and be +8 in 9 minutes.

Why does everything have to be hyperbole? Are you saying Garza is even in the 30th percentile in defense?

Are you saying he's not? And have data to back that up?

[code][/code]

Manocad wrote:

ComboGuardCity wrote::

Manocad wrote:It's crazy that such a lousy defensive player could draw a charge and be +8 in 9 minutes.

Why does everything have to be hyperbole? Are you saying Garza is even in the 30th percentile in defense?

Are you saying he's not? And have data to back that up?

Yep I’m saying he’s not. Not even based on stats, based on watching him play. You’re entitled to your opinion

Good half, now keep it up in the 2nd half

ComboGuardCity wrote:

bstein14 wrote:Garza gets some on offense it negates all those defensive deficiencies. He's a ridiculously skilled player offensively he's way ahead of Cade at the moment.

The only thing he has over Cade is post play lol

Currently he's shooting better than Cade from 3. And from the field too, for that matter.

MotownMadness wrote:Good half, now keep it up in the 2nd half

Good half? Pistons should be up 20 if not for Garza's terrible defense.

ComboGuardCity wrote:[code][/code]

Manocad wrote:

ComboGuardCity wrote::
Why does everything have to be hyperbole? Are you saying Garza is even in the 30th percentile in defense?

Are you saying he's not? And have data to back that up?

Yep I’m saying he’s not. Not even based on stats, based on watching him play. You’re entitled to your opinion

It's not an opinion if you offer up a stat. I'm assuming that you have numbers to back up that worse than 30th percentile on defense? Tell me how that's defined.

Manocad wrote:

bstein14 wrote:

Manocad wrote:It's crazy that such a lousy defensive player could draw a charge and be +8 in 9 minutes.

He's a below average defender. That doesn't mean he can't take a charge. He's a high IQ player. Dedmon got a walk in dunk on him on a Butler pick and roll where he showed to stop the Butler penetration but couldn't recover quickly enough to get back to Dedmon.

Nope, he's not as bad defensively as you say he is.

There, that was easy. Didn't even need any stats to do it.

How bad defensively did I say he is? I said he's below average. He is a much better defender than Killian is at scoring the basketball. Garza isn't a bottom 5 defender in the league and Killian in back to back years has been bottom 5 TS% for rotation players.

I don't think Garza is horrible at defense but I also am not stupid enough to think he's a good defender right now either. That said, he is a skilled offensive player who plays hard and knows how to play. I'm a fan. He's still going to get scored on more than Stewart who is an above average defender and better at defending the pick and roll than Drummond ever was.

zeebneeb wrote:

MotownMadness wrote:Good half, now keep it up in the 2nd half

Good half? Pistons should be up 20 if not for Garza's terrible defense.

No doubt.

Diallo brings alot of energy something i don't think J.Jackson does

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Cade settles for too many 3's.

Manocad wrote:

ComboGuardCity wrote:[code][/code]

Manocad wrote:Are you saying he's not? And have data to back that up?

Yep I’m saying he’s not. Not even based on stats, based on watching him play. You’re entitled to your opinion

It's not an opinion if you offer up a stat. I'm assuming that you have numbers to back up that worse than 30th percentile on defense? Tell me how that's defined.

Why don’t you show me evidence he isn’t? I’ve been here long enough to realize how useless this debate is. Would love to see the metrics you have since you love to tout him. I personally don’t care enough to look any up.

bstein14 wrote:

Manocad wrote:

bstein14 wrote:
He's a below average defender. That doesn't mean he can't take a charge. He's a high IQ player. Dedmon got a walk in dunk on him on a Butler pick and roll where he showed to stop the Butler penetration but couldn't recover quickly enough to get back to Dedmon.

Nope, he's not as bad defensively as you say he is.

There, that was easy. Didn't even need any stats to do it.

How bad defensively did I say he is? I said he's below average. He is a much better defender than Killian is at scoring the basketball. Garza isn't a bottom 5 defender in the league and Killian in back to back years has been bottom 5 TS% for rotation players.

I don't think Garza is horrible at defense but I also am not stupid enough to think he's a good defender right now either. That said, he is a skilled offensive player who plays hard and knows how to play. I'm a fan. He's still going to get scored on more than Stewart who is an above average defender and better at defending the pick and roll than Drummond ever was.

Don't be intentionally obtuse; no one claimed Garza was a GOOD defender in the grand scheme. When you made your first post about how he needed to score to make up for his defensive deficiencies he had played 5 minutes, was +3 and had scored ZERO. You want to dump on the guy; go ahead. But that wasn't exactly a moment in time that backed up your argument.

im suprised to find garza is only 2 years younger than Lyles.

One thing that this game shows, and I challenge ANYONE to differ;

No matter how bad you think Garza's defense is, with Olynyk out, he should be the first big off the bench, not Lyles, who offers nothing.

johanliebert wrote:Cade settles for too many 3's.

Said it last game he's so much better being agressive going to the rim. Him shooting so well in college made him fall in love with the 3 ball.

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