Jerami Grant receiving a lot of trade interest- (Jake Fisher)

[NYPiston]

Sure. If it's confirmed that Grant absolutely has to be "the man" in order to be happy, trade him. But let's say hypothetically the Pistons keep Grant because he wants to stay, will adjust his style of play to benefit the team, etc. And in reality, that's literally a best case scenario for the Pistons assuming Grant actually does follow through with adjusting his style of play. Now, the way this board works people will of course jump to conclusions in that scenario and start hollering "Weaver is an idiot! Grant is going to screw everything up!" without having any idea what Grant's thinking or waiting for the results.

Grant is getting paid $20M a year and doesn't have a championship ring. I've argued many times in the past that NBA players want two things--money and a ring, preferably in that order. He's got the money. It seems very plausible to me that he could see the value of staying with the team and adapting his role to best suit the team knowing they've got a lot of cap space and a high draft pick on the way. That's a situation that players WANT to go to, and he's already here. And like I said, if that holds no value for him and his primary goal is to be the #1 option no matter what, trade him. Certainly he's aware that was a possibility from Day 1.

Absolutely. If he's willing to adapt and take on a lesser role differing more to others and becoming that two way supplemental scorer that he was in Denver then I'd be more than happy to have him be a part of the team going forward but from what we've seen thus far, he still tends to dominate the ball and the others differ to him as if he's "THE Guy". I'm concerned that this crisper ball movement we've been seeing since his absence (which could still use some work, but has improved) and ascension of guys like Bey and Diallo might be somewhat stunted when Grant returns if he doesn't adjust his game and especially going forward when the Pistons add more talented pieces.

To clarify my stance, Grant is a good player and can be a very useful player for this team going forward but he needs to adjust his game and start to accept a more complimentary role. If it's true that he wants a primary role on any team he potentially gets traded to, I'm skeptical that he'd be willing to adjust.
I think Weaver needs to have a really good talk with him to explain what his role might need to be going forward if he wants to be a part of this or they'd need to discuss trade options. Not as an ultimatum or anything like that but just to be on the same page about his future here or elsewhere, a level of transparency.

[flow]

Grant chose to come here not for money (Denver offered the same contract) or for a title (obviously), but for the opportunity to expand his role and become an offensive focal point rather than just the glue guy he saw himself as in Denver. That's a fact. Not conjecture or bs.

Now, that's not to say that he necessarily demands to be the #1 option, or would have an issue with having another focal point on the team.

[Manocad]

Sure. If it's confirmed that Grant absolutely has to be "the man" in order to be happy, trade him. But let's say hypothetically the Pistons keep Grant because he wants to stay, will adjust his style of play to benefit the team, etc. And in reality, that's literally a best case scenario for the Pistons assuming Grant actually does follow through with adjusting his style of play. Now, the way this board works people will of course jump to conclusions in that scenario and start hollering "Weaver is an idiot! Grant is going to screw everything up!" without having any idea what Grant's thinking or waiting for the results.

Grant is getting paid $20M a year and doesn't have a championship ring. I've argued many times in the past that NBA players want two things--money and a ring, preferably in that order. He's got the money. It seems very plausible to me that he could see the value of staying with the team and adapting his role to best suit the team knowing they've got a lot of cap space and a high draft pick on the way. That's a situation that players WANT to go to, and he's already here. And like I said, if that holds no value for him and his primary goal is to be the #1 option no matter what, trade him. Certainly he's aware that was a possibility from Day 1.

Absolutely. If he's willing to adapt and take on a lesser role differing more to others and becoming that two way supplemental scorer that he was in Denver then I'd be more than happy to have him be a part of the team going forward but from what we've seen thus far, he still tends to dominate the ball and the others differ to him as if he's "THE Guy". I'm concerned that this crisper ball movement we've been seeing since his absence (which could still use some work, but has improved) and ascension of guys like Bey and Diallo might be somewhat stunted when Grant returns if he doesn't adjust his game and especially going forward when the Pistons add more talented pieces.

To clarify my stance, Grant is a good player and can be a very useful player for this team going forward but he needs to adjust his game and start to accept a more complimentary role. If it's true that he wants a primary role on any team he potentially gets traded to, I'm skeptical that he'd be willing to adjust.
I think Weaver needs to have a really good talk with him to explain what his role might need to be going forward if he wants to be a part of this or they'd need to discuss trade options. Not as an ultimatum or anything like that but just to be on the same page about his future here or elsewhere.

I think you're getting a little hung up on this whole "This is NOT your team, this is Cade's team, you WILL defer to him, period" type of concept as to how Grant must be dealt with if he's going to stay. Cade is a rookie. As he showed last night, there ARE going to be times where he ISN'T "the man" and someone else needs to be. Can it be Bey in those instances? Possibly, but he's a second year player and we've certainly seen him put up his share of stinkers. Diallo? Nah. Nice player and I'd think he's a nice piece to have but I don't think you can expect him to be the "go to" guy; he's much more an opportunistic scorer than a "if you need a bucket right here, right now, he's your guy" sort of player. Grant can be. Is he a top tier go-to guy in the NBA? No, of course not. But he's the best option the Pistons have right now outside of Cade. I don't think he would need to adjust his game much at all; just the timing of his decision-making. No more "this one's on me, I need to score right here" hanging onto the ball for 15 seconds while trying to figure out how to score possessions. Catch the ball, make the decision to either attack or shoot because it's there, and if it isn't, keep the ball moving. Shoot, moving the ball around better may result in MORE and better opportunities for him.

In any case, if no good offers come along and Grant wants to stay, I don't think it's automatically a bad thing.

[Manocad]

Grant chose to come here not for money (Denver offered the same contract) or for a title (obviously), but for the opportunity to expand his role and become an offensive focal point rather than just the glue guy he saw himself as in Denver. That's a fact. Not conjecture or bs.

Now, that's not to say that he necessarily demands to be the #1 option, or would have an issue with having another focal point on the team.

Certainly no one would argue that Grant's motivation in signing with Detroit was a championship in his first year with the team.

[DetroitSho]

Sure. If it's confirmed that Grant absolutely has to be "the man" in order to be happy, trade him. But let's say hypothetically the Pistons keep Grant because he wants to stay, will adjust his style of play to benefit the team, etc. And in reality, that's literally a best case scenario for the Pistons assuming Grant actually does follow through with adjusting his style of play. Now, the way this board works people will of course jump to conclusions in that scenario and start hollering "Weaver is an idiot! Grant is going to screw everything up!" without having any idea what Grant's thinking or waiting for the results.

Grant is getting paid $20M a year and doesn't have a championship ring. I've argued many times in the past that NBA players want two things--money and a ring, preferably in that order. He's got the money. It seems very plausible to me that he could see the value of staying with the team and adapting his role to best suit the team knowing they've got a lot of cap space and a high draft pick on the way. That's a situation that players WANT to go to, and he's already here. And like I said, if that holds no value for him and his primary goal is to be the #1 option no matter what, trade him. Certainly he's aware that was a possibility from Day 1.

Absolutely. If he's willing to adapt and take on a lesser role differing more to others and becoming that two way supplemental scorer that he was in Denver then I'd be more than happy to have him be a part of the team going forward but from what we've seen thus far, he still tends to dominate the ball and the others differ to him as if he's "THE Guy". I'm concerned that this crisper ball movement we've been seeing since his absence (which could still use some work, but has improved) and ascension of guys like Bey and Diallo might be somewhat stunted when Grant returns if he doesn't adjust his game and especially going forward when the Pistons add more talented pieces.

To clarify my stance, Grant is a good player and can be a very useful player for this team going forward but he needs to adjust his game and start to accept a more complimentary role. If it's true that he wants a primary role on any team he potentially gets traded to, I'm skeptical that he'd be willing to adjust.
I think Weaver needs to have a really good talk with him to explain what his role might need to be going forward if he wants to be a part of this or they'd need to discuss trade options. Not as an ultimatum or anything like that but just to be on the same page about his future here or elsewhere.

I think you're getting a little hung up on this whole "This is NOT your team, this is Cade's team, you WILL defer to him, period" type of concept as to how Grant must be dealt with if he's going to stay. Cade is a rookie. As he showed last night, there ARE going to be times where he ISN'T "the man" and someone else needs to be. Can it be Bey in those instances? Possibly, but he's a second year player and we've certainly seen him put up his share of stinkers. Diallo? Nah. Nice player and I'd think he's a nice piece to have but I don't think you can expect him to be the "go to" guy; he's much more an opportunistic scorer than a "if you need a bucket right here, right now, he's your guy" sort of player. Grant can be. Is he a top tier go-to guy in the NBA? No, of course not. But he's the best option the Pistons have right now outside of Cade. I don't think he would need to adjust his game much at all; just the timing of his decision-making. No more "this one's on me, I need to score right here" hanging onto the ball for 15 seconds while trying to figure out how to score possessions. Catch the ball, make the decision to either attack or shoot because it's there, and if it isn't, keep the ball moving. Shoot, moving the ball around better may result in MORE and better opportunities for him.

In any case, if no good offers come along and Grant wants to stay, I don't think it's automatically a bad thing.

We fought for so many years and it's scary how much we think alike at this point on this topic. I'll take it a step further.

It's possible that there may have been conversations from the very beginning that by year 3 he'd possibly be #3 or 2b behind the 2 young players that would be added over his first 2 years but in the meantime he'd be able to grow his game and expand until the young guys grow. And at that point they reevaluate the future of him with this team. Being a 2nd or 3rd option is still having a prominent role in the offense so I really struggle with why people think he's demanding #1 option status.

Do people not realize that depending on how you look at it, either Chauncey or Rasheed was our 3rd option? And Rasheed had to basically be begged to shoot more. The extremes this board lives in is frustrating.

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[Manocad]

Absolutely. If he's willing to adapt and take on a lesser role differing more to others and becoming that two way supplemental scorer that he was in Denver then I'd be more than happy to have him be a part of the team going forward but from what we've seen thus far, he still tends to dominate the ball and the others differ to him as if he's "THE Guy". I'm concerned that this crisper ball movement we've been seeing since his absence (which could still use some work, but has improved) and ascension of guys like Bey and Diallo might be somewhat stunted when Grant returns if he doesn't adjust his game and especially going forward when the Pistons add more talented pieces.

To clarify my stance, Grant is a good player and can be a very useful player for this team going forward but he needs to adjust his game and start to accept a more complimentary role. If it's true that he wants a primary role on any team he potentially gets traded to, I'm skeptical that he'd be willing to adjust.
I think Weaver needs to have a really good talk with him to explain what his role might need to be going forward if he wants to be a part of this or they'd need to discuss trade options. Not as an ultimatum or anything like that but just to be on the same page about his future here or elsewhere.

I think you're getting a little hung up on this whole "This is NOT your team, this is Cade's team, you WILL defer to him, period" type of concept as to how Grant must be dealt with if he's going to stay. Cade is a rookie. As he showed last night, there ARE going to be times where he ISN'T "the man" and someone else needs to be. Can it be Bey in those instances? Possibly, but he's a second year player and we've certainly seen him put up his share of stinkers. Diallo? Nah. Nice player and I'd think he's a nice piece to have but I don't think you can expect him to be the "go to" guy; he's much more an opportunistic scorer than a "if you need a bucket right here, right now, he's your guy" sort of player. Grant can be. Is he a top tier go-to guy in the NBA? No, of course not. But he's the best option the Pistons have right now outside of Cade. I don't think he would need to adjust his game much at all; just the timing of his decision-making. No more "this one's on me, I need to score right here" hanging onto the ball for 15 seconds while trying to figure out how to score possessions. Catch the ball, make the decision to either attack or shoot because it's there, and if it isn't, keep the ball moving. Shoot, moving the ball around better may result in MORE and better opportunities for him.

In any case, if no good offers come along and Grant wants to stay, I don't think it's automatically a bad thing.

We fought for so many years and it's scary how much we think alike at this point on this topic. I'll take it a step further.

It's possible that there may have been conversations from the very beginning that by year 3 he'd possibly be #3 or 2b behind the 2 young players that would be added over his first 2 years but in the meantime he'd be able to grow his game and expand until the young guys grow. And at that point they reevaluate the future of him with this team. Being a 2nd or 3rd option is still having a prominent role in the offense so I really struggle with why people think he's demanding #1 option status.

Do people not realize that depending on how you look at it, either Chauncey or Rasheed was our 3rd option? And Rasheed had to basically be begged to shoot more. The extremes this board lives in is frustrating.

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Absolutely it's believable that those discussions already took place. Anyone who thinks that conversation went something like this:

Grant: Ok, so I get to be the man, right?
Weaver: Yes.
Grant: Right now and as long as I'm here, right? No matter what happens in the future?"
Weaver: Yes.
Grant: Cool. Let's do it.

Is delusional. Like I had said, Weaver PUBLICLY STATED that Grant could potentially be flipped as a trade asset later. I would bet my house that he said that to Grant before he ever said it to the media. Point being, since you can logically assume it was discussed as a possibility, one can logically assume that WHY it would become a possibility, i.e. team changes/development, was also discussed. And thus the possibility that the Pistons drafted a young player who became a star while Grant was still here, and how that would affect Grant's role with the team, was discussed.

[NYPiston]

I think you're getting a little hung up on this whole "This is NOT your team, this is Cade's team, you WILL defer to him, period" type of concept as to how Grant must be dealt with if he's going to stay. Cade is a rookie. As he showed last night, there ARE going to be times where he ISN'T "the man" and someone else needs to be. Can it be Bey in those instances? Possibly, but he's a second year player and we've certainly seen him put up his share of stinkers. Diallo? Nah. Nice player and I'd think he's a nice piece to have but I don't think you can expect him to be the "go to" guy; he's much more an opportunistic scorer than a "if you need a bucket right here, right now, he's your guy" sort of player. Grant can be. Is he a top tier go-to guy in the NBA? No, of course not. But he's the best option the Pistons have right now outside of Cade. I don't think he would need to adjust his game much at all; just the timing of his decision-making. No more "this one's on me, I need to score right here" hanging onto the ball for 15 seconds while trying to figure out how to score possessions. Catch the ball, make the decision to either attack or shoot because it's there, and if it isn't, keep the ball moving. Shoot, moving the ball around better may result in MORE and better opportunities for him.

In any case, if no good offers come along and Grant wants to stay, I don't think it's automatically a bad thing.

But I'm not saying that it needs to be Cade's team right now or that Grant should always defer to Cade. In fact, I don't think Cade is ready for that alpha role yet but what I'm saying that Grant needs to realize that he's not the alpha and to learn to play within a team concept or at least Casey needs to coach it up.

Too often you see the ball movement stop when it's in Grant's hands and he's either barreling into the defenders towards the rim or shooting a tough pull up and the young guys tend to hand it off to him and basically tell him to get his shot. When watching the team, it still feels like Grant's team and I think that needs to change for the long term benefit of the franchise. Hopefully he can adjust if he's here past the deadline which I think is likely.

[Cowology]

I think you're getting a little hung up on this whole "This is NOT your team, this is Cade's team, you WILL defer to him, period" type of concept as to how Grant must be dealt with if he's going to stay. Cade is a rookie. As he showed last night, there ARE going to be times where he ISN'T "the man" and someone else needs to be. Can it be Bey in those instances? Possibly, but he's a second year player and we've certainly seen him put up his share of stinkers. Diallo? Nah. Nice player and I'd think he's a nice piece to have but I don't think you can expect him to be the "go to" guy; he's much more an opportunistic scorer than a "if you need a bucket right here, right now, he's your guy" sort of player. Grant can be. Is he a top tier go-to guy in the NBA? No, of course not. But he's the best option the Pistons have right now outside of Cade. I don't think he would need to adjust his game much at all; just the timing of his decision-making. No more "this one's on me, I need to score right here" hanging onto the ball for 15 seconds while trying to figure out how to score possessions. Catch the ball, make the decision to either attack or shoot because it's there, and if it isn't, keep the ball moving. Shoot, moving the ball around better may result in MORE and better opportunities for him.

In any case, if no good offers come along and Grant wants to stay, I don't think it's automatically a bad thing.

But I'm not saying that it needs to be Cade's team right now or that Grant should always defer to Cade. In fact, I don't think Cade is ready for that alpha role yet but what I'm saying that Grant needs to realize that he's not the alpha and to learn to play within a team concept or at least Casey needs to coach it up.

Too often you see the ball movement stop when it's in Grant's hands and he's either barreling into the defenders towards the rim or shooting a tough pull up and the young guys tend to hand it off to him and basically tell him to get his shot. When watching the team, it still feels like Grant's team and I think that needs to change for the long term benefit of the franchise. Hopefully he can adjust if he's here past the deadline which I think is likely.

Reminiscent of the Jerry Stackhouse era.

[DetroitSho]

I think you're getting a little hung up on this whole "This is NOT your team, this is Cade's team, you WILL defer to him, period" type of concept as to how Grant must be dealt with if he's going to stay. Cade is a rookie. As he showed last night, there ARE going to be times where he ISN'T "the man" and someone else needs to be. Can it be Bey in those instances? Possibly, but he's a second year player and we've certainly seen him put up his share of stinkers. Diallo? Nah. Nice player and I'd think he's a nice piece to have but I don't think you can expect him to be the "go to" guy; he's much more an opportunistic scorer than a "if you need a bucket right here, right now, he's your guy" sort of player. Grant can be. Is he a top tier go-to guy in the NBA? No, of course not. But he's the best option the Pistons have right now outside of Cade. I don't think he would need to adjust his game much at all; just the timing of his decision-making. No more "this one's on me, I need to score right here" hanging onto the ball for 15 seconds while trying to figure out how to score possessions. Catch the ball, make the decision to either attack or shoot because it's there, and if it isn't, keep the ball moving. Shoot, moving the ball around better may result in MORE and better opportunities for him.

In any case, if no good offers come along and Grant wants to stay, I don't think it's automatically a bad thing.

But I'm not saying that it needs to be Cade's team right now or that Grant should always defer to Cade. In fact, I don't think Cade is ready for that alpha role yet but what I'm saying that Grant needs to realize that he's not the alpha and to learn to play within a team concept or at least Casey needs to coach it up.

Too often you see the ball movement stop when it's in Grant's hands and he's either barreling into the defenders towards the rim or shooting a tough pull up and the young guys tend to hand it off to him and basically tell him to get his shot. When watching the team, it still feels like Grant's team and I think that needs to change for the long term benefit of the franchise. Hopefully he can adjust if he's here past the deadline which I think is likely.

Reminiscent of the Jerry Stackhouse era.

And then there was 2001-02 Stackhouse, a player that people doubted could happen. Played within a team concept, defended and made plays for others while still getting his.

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[Invictus88]

It's hard.

Earlier this season he was the #1 option and did dominate possessions. They would end as soon as he got the ball as he went iso for long stretches. At first it was out of pure necessity; then there was this weird dichotomy of usage between him and Cade as Cade started to come into his own.

It's pretty much irrefutable that the ball movement significantly improved when he left and our young guys took big steps forward.

The big question is what would happen if he comes back. Do the Pistons largely regress to what they were previously or do Grant and those playing around him adjust with Grant assuming a more peripheral role?

I think either is plausible. I do think that there is significant risk to the Pistons future if it regresses backward. I also think that Grant's trade value is at risk to go way down as well. It's for those reasons I'd prefer if he was traded before he came back.

I do also think that we as a franchise have much more to benefit from this clearly becoming Cade's team and him developing into and playing the prominent superstar role. It's not a guarantee but he's definitely tracking that way.

I think it's also apparent that if that happens then he will get the others on the court involved in the offense. That's just his play style. He is an astronomically better playmaker / distributor than Grant.

While I don't think any of what you wrote is implausible, I will say it completely overlooks the idea that Grant can and is willing to adapt his style of play to benefit the team.

What I'll add is a general comment in the same vein...stop with the BS of "Jerami came here to be THE MAN and there's no way he'd accept a diminished role, blah blah blah." No one knows what Jerami is thinking or will/won't accept or adapt to. Look at it this way--even with Diallo and Bey starting to ramp things up, what's everyone still saying? The team needs another star-level player to team with Cade. Why can't that be Grant? Who says the team can't be successful with a core of Cade, Diallo, Bey, Grant, and a serviceable center, or ultimately even a star center? Cade is already doing his thing, Diallo is too, Bey is still hitting 3's but trying to score more in iso situations and he is NOT as good at it as Grant--PERIOD. So keep Bey doing what he does best, shooting 3's, and keep Grant doing what he does best which is taking guys one on one. Obviously that doesn't mean that's all either of them will do, i.e. Bey's man bodies him up so he takes it to the rack or Grant's man sags off him so he takes a jumper, but I don't think it's ridiculous to assume that a Cade/Diallo/Bey/Grant core isn't capable of putting up their current averages every night while playing together. Now, does that assume Grant may have to swallow some ego and buy into the team concept for the greater good? Sure. But that's required for EVERY high level team these days since more and more the best teams are made up of multiple stars.

Don't forget, "black city, black coach, blah blah blah". You pretty much covered it, nobody's refuting the ball movement has changed...duh. The Warriors ball movement was better whenever Durant was out of the lineup. When you have a guy with iso ability miss significant time and you provide more opportunities to your mostly catch and shoot guys, ummm yeah, ball movement will increase. Those guys generally hot potato the ball if they don't an immediate shot on the catch. Nobody's refuting that it's moved better since he's been out. I'm refuting that he's unwilling or unable to fit into the better ball movement.

You swapped out a guy in Grant who was heavy on iso and inserted the guy that moves without the ball the most of anybody on the team in Diallo. Yeah I'd like to see that guy WITH Grant. Can you imagine if Bey was still shooting the same as he was prior to Grant going down? We wouldn't be having this convo.

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Replying to DetroitSho:
So... with Grant in the lineup prior to injury: ball movement was worse, Bey iso'd more and shot worse.

And then when Grant left, Diallo came in and distributed the ball better, played well off-ball. Bey iso'd less and shot more catch and shoot threes... and shot them better.

This is what I am hearing you say. Just making sure.

Because then why would you want to put Grant back in the lineup at all?

The Durant mention with the Warriors isn't relevant. If Grant shot the ball like Durant then nobody would be having any conversation about anything; because most possessions would end up with made field goal attempts and we'd be winning basketball games.

It isn't a coincidence that Bey started shooting better after Grant went down. There was better ball movement. He didn't to try to get shots off from iso situations as much. He could instead move to an open space and someone on the team would find him. The team was more in rhythm and it's easier to shoot in that type of environment.

Other Notes in reply to Manocad:
While it's fairly reasonable to posit that Grant may adapt his playing style from this point forward to adapt to the growth of the young guys and spread the ball around more, it's completely accurate to say that he was not doing this up to the point in which he was injured. The difference in ball movement was stark and came instantaneously afterwards. That's the closest to actual data that we have. It can definitely change to go the other way. There's just not precedent for it on the Pistons where it has been stated that he came here to be The Guy.

I haven't really seen much in the way of synergy between Cade and Grant's play styles thus far. That isn't to say that it won't develop in the future. However, if anything it has clashed up until this point. Cade standing around watching while Grant dribbles the ball in isolation for 10 seconds and hoisting up shots isn't synergy.

I don't buy at all the idea that it is a good thing for our team to have Grant constantly taking guys one on one as is stated above. If anything Grant has been a huge letdown in terms of delivering iso baskets this year in the clutch. Rather than have the offense in such situations stagnate I'd much rather have someone like Cade take it and distribute elsewhere after drawing defenders.

Bey wasn't doing what he does best when Grant was on the floor with him. I think there's a direct correlation there in terms of ball movement that allows Bey the freedom to benefit from more passing; instead of devolving into iso ball all of the time.

I don't know if I really have the motivation to go back and forth in a long discussion about this stuff though. I think I've said what I wanted to say. Thanks for reading and responding.

[Cowology]

Causation or correlation? Assuming that other players will regress when Grant returns seems like a jump in logic. One which precludes the possibility for those other players having made sustainable improvement when given the opportunity. In an ideal world you can now re-insert your #1 option with an improved roster and everybody can learn to adapt. This could be a good thing for Grant because other people are now threats. If they can all adapt.

Or I could just like to argue. Sometimes that's fun.

[DetroitSho]

Wow, I didn't realize I'd have to go slow, but since you pretty much got everything I said wrong, ok here it goes. At the beginning of the season up until Grant went out, this team was shooting like crap. Do you not remember the discussions of wanting to send Bey to the bench and even the G League just as recently as 60 days ago? Because that's what we do here, we vilify players and throw them away as soon as the next good looking thing (in this case, Diallo) comes along. But I digress.

I'm not sure where you're getting I said Bey is iso'ing less, I didn't even bring that up. But since we're here, he's iso'ing more. MUCH more. Quiet as kept, his game right now is extremely similar to the Grant type game that everybody has turned on, the only difference is he's such a good shooter those 3 point bombs are outweighing the pathetic iso attempts.

I brought up Durant in Golden State to say that people are going to complain about an iso scorer bogging down the offense no matter who it is. Fact of the matter is I don't care how great the ball movement is and otherworldly the shooting is, you will NEED someone (preferably someONES) to be able to get you an iso score when things get tight.

As for why would I want to integrate Grant back into the new and improved version of the lineup? Because I'm not under some ignorant assumption that Grant can't excel back in this lineup with how things are going. If anything, in order for people to stop complaining about him going iso, he NEEDED Bey to finally start hitting wide open shots like he is now. He NEEDED a people mover like Diallo to sneak up the baseline on the back cut while the defense was paying attention to him, as opposed to no people movement. He NEEDED Cade to figure out how to attack an aggressive defense which has led to more open jumpers now. So now, yes, why tf wouldn't I want to add a guy who can get you 20 on or off the ball, shoot high 30s from 3 and get shots for his teammates too?

Like seriously, what type of monster are y'all trying to turn Grant into? It's almost like we're discussing Josh Smith or something. WTF?

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[sfballa13]

There hasnt been this much trade interest in a Pistons' player in over a decade

We need to take advantage of that and clear out as much salary as possible (KO/Joseph)

Grant+KO+Joseph gone would be nearly 40M in space to throw at a player that fits Cade's timeline better

[DetroitSho]

Causation or correlation? Assuming that other players will regress when Grant returns seems like a jump in logic. One which precludes the possibility for those other players having made sustainable improvement when given the opportunity. In an ideal world you can now re-insert your #1 option with an improved roster and everybody can learn to adapt. This could be a good thing for Grant because other people are now threats. If they can all adapt.

Or I could just like to argue. Sometimes that's fun.

Come on fam, now you know that's too logical. It's THIS year. We have THIS year's new thing so you're supposed to throw away last year's new thing. Rinse repeat.

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[DetroitSho]

There hasnt been this much trade interest in a Pistons' player in over a decade

We need to take advantage of that and clear out as much salary as possible (KO/Joseph)

Grant+KO+Joseph gone would be nearly 40M in space to throw at a player that fits Cade's timeline better

That's a whole different argument but all the recent narratives that have been created doesn't begin to pass the smell test for trading Grant.

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[sfballa13]

There hasnt been this much trade interest in a Pistons' player in over a decade

We need to take advantage of that and clear out as much salary as possible (KO/Joseph)

Grant+KO+Joseph gone would be nearly 40M in space to throw at a player that fits Cade's timeline better

That's a whole different argument but all the recent narratives that have been created doesn't begin to pass the smell test for trading Grant.

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There have been some stupid takes regarding Grant that's for sure but he is in high demand, Pistons need to seize the day and make this trade

[440BB]

Although I've seen Grant as a ball stopper this season, how he works with Cunningham is still a work in process. They had no training camp or preseason to develop any chemistry due to that ankle, followed by a bad shooting start to the season. Top it off with Olynyk going down early and there's been little time for the new lineup to gel.

Picture Grant returning to the lineup a few games before the trade deadline, fitting in to the flow and we win those games. Will heads explode?

[Piston Pete]

I agree, the best time to trade Grant is right now.

Same goes for KO. A lot of teams will be looking for a good stretch-5 for their playoff run

[DetroitSho]

There hasnt been this much trade interest in a Pistons' player in over a decade

We need to take advantage of that and clear out as much salary as possible (KO/Joseph)

Grant+KO+Joseph gone would be nearly 40M in space to throw at a player that fits Cade's timeline better

That's a whole different argument but all the recent narratives that have been created doesn't begin to pass the smell test for trading Grant.

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There have been some stupid takes regarding Grant that's for sure but he is in high demand, Pistons need to seize the day and make this trade

Can't fight you on that.

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[mattao313]

Grant is a role player at his best. People see that 20ppg a game and fall in love but he's doing that with mediocre efficiency and little to no playmaking. Do people really want a 2nd/3rd option that cant create for others and is a mediocre efficiency scorer? I'd pass I rather get a pick and/or a young guy with some potential.

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