Official 2020 Nba Draft Thread

[mattao313]

Donovan Mitchell isn't even a good defender in the NBA

Only the Pistons fans.

He isn't yall just gassing the guy cause we passed on him and to compare him to Okoro. Good player though not say he isn't.

[Crymson]

Okoro will most likely end up much more similar to Jimmy Butler and Kawhi Leonard than Andre Roberson & MKG.

That claim is as arbitrary as it is grandiose. He has marked similarities to Roberson and Kidd-Gilchrist, yet he's more likely to become a superstar-level offensive creator?

He has an elite, outlier 2 point percentage

His two-point percentage was largely the product of easy buckets in the paint, created by others rather than himself.

Hes better at driving to the rim from the wing and finishing than anybody in this draft.

Okoro managed a very mediocre .875 PPP against NCAA oppositions on isolation, so that isn't true. Nor was he tasked with attempting these on high volume.

It would be largely irrelevant in any event if he cannot shoot. NBA defenses are far more potent than those found in the NCAA; and if he cannot shoot, they will exploit that weakness far more effectively.

His assist/turnover ratio being greater than 1 is also a good sign of his iq.

His ATO is exactly one, which is not good for a handler. No offense, but why should we have this discussion if you aren't willing to do even the most basic research?

He also has the same 3pt percentage as Anthony Edwards and Lamelo Ball, the number 1 and 2 picks this year.

Edwards, who was tasked with creating a tremendous share of his team's offense, took a great deal of difficult, contested, or outright bad threes off the dribble. His shot selection was an issue, but so was the difficult nature of the shots he attempted. Okoro was almost exclusively attempting spot-up three-pointers.

LaMelo has an awful jumpshot and likewise suffered from poor shot selection. I'm surprised to see him brought up here; like Okoro, his poor shooting is one of his major weaknesses and his chief question mark where his future in the NBA is concerned.

His team trusted him to take game winners so theres something there. Towards the end of the year his 3 point percentage was noticeably better.

His percentage was better as the season went on, yes, against NCAA opposition, on open looks, and from a shorter three-point line. His shot form remained bad, his performance unreliable, and his overall percentage poor.

He'll be fine as the next Piston. Defense still wins championships.

Defense does not still win championships. This is not a matter of opinion, but rather a matter of fact. Offense wins championships.

[Crymson]

I did ask "Or are you just gonna take every opportunity to talk down Okoro as a prospect?" You certainly answered that question man! Kid is 19 and you've written him off already. Yeah ok it's possible he ends up as the next Winslow or SJ but it is possible that he doesn't. You're just not willing to entertain that despite continuing to post that "wings matter"

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Is it simply me, or are we discussing the draft? When it comes to the draft, do teams draft based on probabilities or based on theoretical possibilities? The answer is the former and absolutely not the latter. We're trafficking in data here, not in what's conceivably possible.

No point stating facts or showing stats man. He's dead against Okoro by any means necessary.

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That's ironic, given that his post was quite literally composed entirely of claims either arbitrary, lacking in context, or factually false. You ought to look into the facts yourself before endorsing posts simply because they suit your point of view. You've essentially said here, "Way to go, man! You're supporting my narrative!" Does that become you?

Donovan Mitchell isn't even a good defender in the NBA

He's solid enough, but he hasn't been a standout.

He also doesn't compare at all to Okoro on the offensive end. He averaged 35.5% from three on high volume in his final NCAA season (this included a fair proportion of pull-up jumpers) and his shot mechanics were solid.

[vic]

Okoro will most likely end up much more similar to Jimmy Butler and Kawhi Leonard than Andre Roberson & MKG.

That claim is as arbitrary as it is grandiose. He has marked similarities to Roberson and Kidd-Gilchrist, yet he's more likely to become a superstar-level offensive creator?

He has an elite, outlier 2 point percentage

His two-point percentage was largely the product of easy buckets in the paint, created by others rather than himself.

Hes better at driving to the rim from the wing and finishing than anybody in this draft.

Okoro managed a very mediocre .875 PPP against NCAA oppositions on isolation, so that isn't true. Nor was he tasked with attempting these on high volume.

It would be largely irrelevant in any event if he cannot shoot. NBA defenses are far more potent than those found in the NCAA; and if he cannot shoot, they will exploit that weakness far more effectively.

His assist/turnover ratio being greater than 1 is also a good sign of his iq.

His ATO is exactly one, which is not good for a handler. No offense, but why should we have this discussion if you aren't willing to do even the most basic research?

He also has the same 3pt percentage as Anthony Edwards and Lamelo Ball, the number 1 and 2 picks this year.

Edwards, who was tasked with creating a tremendous share of his team's offense, took a great deal of difficult, contested, or outright bad threes off the dribble. His shot selection was an issue, but so was the difficult nature of the shots he attempted. Okoro was almost exclusively attempting spot-up three-pointers.

LaMelo has an awful jumpshot and likewise suffered from poor shot selection. I'm surprised to see him brought up here; like Okoro, his poor shooting is one of his major weaknesses and his chief question mark where his future in the NBA is concerned.

His team trusted him to take game winners so theres something there. Towards the end of the year his 3 point percentage was noticeably better.

His percentage was better as the season went on, yes, against NCAA opposition, on open looks, and from a shorter three-point line. His shot form remained bad, his performance unreliable, and his overall percentage poor.

He'll be fine as the next Piston. Defense still wins championships.

Defense does not still win championships. This is not a matter of opinion, but rather a matter of fact. Offense wins championships.

And this is why there are so few teams that win championships. I really hope lots of other GMs and fans think like this.

Check his actual assist/turnover ratio vs other wings on your list, past and future. Its not research, its basic math. Greater than 1 is a good start for Okoro.

His 2 point percentage is elite because he is elite at getting to the rim... duh. He has a 2 point percentage thats closer to the Bigs while he played as a wing.

But I'll leave it at that obviously you hate Okoro. But people that know the game know what they see in Okoro.

[Pharaoh]

I did ask "Or are you just gonna take every opportunity to talk down Okoro as a prospect?" You certainly answered that question man! Kid is 19 and you've written him off already. Yeah ok it's possible he ends up as the next Winslow or SJ but it is possible that he doesn't. You're just not willing to entertain that despite continuing to post that "wings matter"

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Is it simply me, or are we discussing the draft? When it comes to the draft, do teams draft based on probabilities or based on theoretical possibilities? The answer is the former and absolutely not the latter. We're trafficking in data here, not in what's conceivably possible.

No point stating facts or showing stats man. He's dead against Okoro by any means necessary.

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That's ironic, given that his post was quite literally composed entirely of claims either arbitrary, lacking in context, or factually false. You ought to look into the facts yourself before endorsing posts simply because they suit your point of view. You've essentially said here, "Way to go, man! You're supporting my narrative!" Does that become you?

Donovan Mitchell isn't even a good defender in the NBA

He's solid enough, but he hasn't been a standout.

He also doesn't compare at all to Okoro on the offensive end. He averaged 35.5% from three on high volume in his final NCAA season (this included a fair proportion of pull-up jumpers) and his shot mechanics were solid.

No it doesn't become me tbh

The facts I referred to are his ratio, his FG% being high due to shots at the rim and his 3% being just as bad as Edwards and Ball (if memory serves all 3 are pretty poor).

As stated I'm willing to entertain the idea that Okoro doesn't improve offensively and ends up being a role player - that seems to be where you sit with him.

Not sure why you're unwilling to entertain the idea that a 19 year old Okoro couldn't improve offensively to the point he's a strong #2, #3 or #4 option on a good team.

One thing that hasn't been taken into account when comparing offensive numbers is the low usage rate for Okoro.

Seems he was more of a glue guy to start the college season but as it progressed his role expanded to include more iso, more handling, more playmaking and shooting attempts.

As I've stated for years: we have no idea what work these kids are doing behind closed doors and don't know what is going on mentally.

And those 2 things are incredibly important for anyone in any situation.

Anyway we seem to have discussed Okoro for days, might be time to dive deep on Hayes or Vassell or Okongwu.


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[The_Irony]

Jaylen brown is the only player thats comparable to okoro when looking at play style & college stats (both sub 30% 3 pt shooters)

He could turn out to be fine but the odds seem to be against him to be anything more than a nice bench piece or a defensive specialist on a contender. I think people in general dont factor in fit and team culture enough and he could shine bright if hes in the right environment..whatever that may be.

[Pharaoh]

Jaylen brown is the only player thats comparable to okoro when looking at play style & college stats (both sub 30% 3 pt shooters)

He could turn out to be fine but the odds seem to be against him to be anything more than a nice bench piece or a defensive specialist on a contender. I think people in general dont factor in fit and team culture enough and he could shine bright if hes in the right environment..whatever that may be.

I think there's a lot of guys in the league you can compare Okoro to and not take it to the Kawhi/Jimmy v Stanimal/Roberson extremes.

Guys like Iggy, Crowder, Brown, bigger Bledsoe etc

Guess I'm always optimistic that whatever kids we draft will get the development and focus they should as multi-million dollar assets...

Yet this organisation has consistently failed to do that!

Hopefully that's something Weaver can change


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[jakebernat]

i’d definitely prefer to avoid okoro. i’m not even sure he’ll be better than Bruce brown overall, and they have pretty much the same physical measurements.

[Pharaoh]

https://youtu.be/O6ZtJw1k3bk

Devin Vassell - listed as a wing but physically I can't see him matching up well with the 3s dominating the league right now.

Dude looks like a gun SG though and at his height with his wingspan he'd be a tough match up for most 2s in the league, especially on the move.

He can really shoot it from the perimeter and at worst you've got a quality floor spacer.

At best he gains some weight and strength without losing anything athletically and can handle switching to the 3 or 4 on the perimeter.

Kid looks just as capable as anyone in this Draft.

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[vic]

Actual champions leaking intelligence

https://sports.yahoo.com/steve-kerr-discusses-type-player-205555929.html

"You're really trying to dig aren't you (laughter)?" Kerr jokingly answered. "Well, we learned a lot from our own journey over the last five years. You got a guy like Steph Curry -- who has other-worldly skill -- and if there's somebody like that out there, you gotta consider him no matter what.


"If there's nobody with that kind of skill, then you really gotta look at the playoffs and think, 'What's winning? What's winning at the highest level?' And these days it's not really any secret -- versatility, switchability, guys who can guard multiple positions and stand up to the physicality.


Refreshing to hear championship basketball IQ speaking out. Unless theres otherworldly skill available, you need athletic defenders to win. The final 2 rounds of the playoffs show us that every year. Weaver please take note!

Love Vassell if Okoro is not available. Would love to somehow get both actually

[rmfc]

https://www.nbcsports.com/boston/celtics/2020-nba-mock-draft-80-why-first-round-depth-could-benefit-celtics

This one's a little unique.
Edwards at #5
Haliburton at #7
Cole Anthony at #8
Hayes at #9


Another decent one has us picking Haliburton over Hayes.
https://www.nba.com/article/2020/08/20/2020-consensus-mock-draft

[AdonalFoyle4Prez]

Hey guys, just wondering: Would you guys do the following?:

2020 #2 + Jordan Poole for Luke Kennard + 2020 #7?

[chrbal]

Hey guys, just wondering: Would you guys do the following?:

2020 #2 + Jordan Poole for Luke Kennard + 2020 #7?

I absolutely would.

[AdonalFoyle4Prez]

Hey guys, just wondering: Would you guys do the following?:

2020 #2 + Jordan Poole for Luke Kennard + 2020 #7?

I absolutely would.

Anything to note about Kennard? And, if you guys were to get the #2 pick, who are you looking to draft? BPA?

[rmfc]

Hey guys, just wondering: Would you guys do the following?:

2020 #2 + Jordan Poole for Luke Kennard + 2020 #7?

I'd make the trade in an instant if Edwards is still on the board.

[chrbal]

Hey guys, just wondering: Would you guys do the following?:

2020 #2 + Jordan Poole for Luke Kennard + 2020 #7?

I absolutely would.

Anything to note about Kennard? And, if you guys were to get the #2 pick, who are you looking to draft? BPA?

Honestly. It’s the first time I saw a 2 for 7 that didn’t involve Wiggins and/or the pistons getting taken to the cleaners.

I think we’re looking at best player available regardless of where we pick. Luke could be a strong shooter/secondary ball handler.

I don’t think Detroit would be all about this in reality

[The_Irony]

At this point Im not convinced the #2 pick will be any better than the 7th pick

[ByeByeDre]

Actual champions leaking intelligence

https://sports.yahoo.com/steve-kerr-discusses-type-player-205555929.html

"You're really trying to dig aren't you (laughter)?" Kerr jokingly answered. "Well, we learned a lot from our own journey over the last five years. You got a guy like Steph Curry -- who has other-worldly skill -- and if there's somebody like that out there, you gotta consider him no matter what.


"If there's nobody with that kind of skill, then you really gotta look at the playoffs and think, 'What's winning? What's winning at the highest level?' And these days it's not really any secret -- versatility, switchability, guys who can guard multiple positions and stand up to the physicality.


Refreshing to hear championship basketball IQ speaking out. Unless theres otherworldly skill available, you need athletic defenders to win. The final 2 rounds of the playoffs show us that every year. Weaver please take note!

Love Vassell if Okoro is not available. Would love to somehow get both actually

The other thing Kerr has talked about in the past is wingspan - at one time, his Warriors has the best wingspan/height ratio on the league.

Which reminds me of Jay Bilas when Pistons drafted Luke.....

“Kennard is 6’6” with a 6’4” wingspan....... wait, how’s that even possible?!?!?”

[The_Irony]

Actual champions leaking intelligence

https://sports.yahoo.com/steve-kerr-discusses-type-player-205555929.html

"You're really trying to dig aren't you (laughter)?" Kerr jokingly answered. "Well, we learned a lot from our own journey over the last five years. You got a guy like Steph Curry -- who has other-worldly skill -- and if there's somebody like that out there, you gotta consider him no matter what.


"If there's nobody with that kind of skill, then you really gotta look at the playoffs and think, 'What's winning? What's winning at the highest level?' And these days it's not really any secret -- versatility, switchability, guys who can guard multiple positions and stand up to the physicality.


Refreshing to hear championship basketball IQ speaking out. Unless theres otherworldly skill available, you need athletic defenders to win. The final 2 rounds of the playoffs show us that every year. Weaver please take note!

Love Vassell if Okoro is not available. Would love to somehow get both actually

All this stuff seems obvious to me. Guys like ellenson and kennard are not players you pick when you are desperate for effective starters to begin a run of success

Pistons need to invest in athletic wings and guards more than almost anyone in the league. Stanley johnson didnt even fit the criteria. He can barely dunk. Its embarrassing how behind out of touch this team has been as it relates to modern nba play style and fans eat it up and hold out hope for the players we do pick

[Invictus88]

At this point Im not convinced the #2 pick will be any better than the 7th pick

This. There's just so many glaring flaws at the top of this draft. The fact that there's no real consensus after #1 (and even he has faults) is pretty telling.

I'd much rather keep Kennard and possibly flip him for a pick in 2021. It's his contract year. He averaged 15.5 last year and shot 40% from behind the arc.

It's kind of funny just how little people want to unload him for. "A bag of chips fo Kennard?" "I'd do that deal in a heartbeat!"