RealGM

OK - Minny fan here, but I was just wondering what you thought about absorbing Brand's massive contract. He may have more value to your team than many others, making him "less" of a negative trade value guy because of morem inutes. You also were wise in your use of McDyess in the twilight of his career. However, before you jump at it, let me show you some numbers:

Let's suppose you had cap space for Brand, and you wanted to estimate how much you'd lose if you made the trade.

Now I think that we can all agree that because of age, Brand's numbers are likely to stay the same or go down. He'll hopefully glide into an Antonio McDyess role of "useful vet off the bench." Now let's say that in the market, you can get a no-upside replacement for Brand who puts up 13/6 for about $5-6 mil. Brand's price goes up while his production declines. What would that production cost in the open market?)

2009-10 Elton Brand (age 31) $15 mil ... 13 PPG, 6 RPG is about $6 mil
2010-11 Elton Brand (age 32) $16 mil ... ??? PPG, ??? RPG is about $5 mil?
2011-12 Elton Brand (age 33) $17 mil ... ??? PPG, ??? RPG is about $4? mil
2012-13 Elton Brand (age 34) $18 mil ... ??? PPG, ??? RPG is about $4? mil

2009-10 Brand (-$9 mil)

2010-11 Brand (-$11 mil)
2011-12 Brand (-$13 mil)
2012-13 Brand (-$14 mil)
----------------------------------
$38 mil in lost production

Anyway it would be tough for a team to win with that much of their payroll being unproductive, so keep that in mind when you get stars in your eyes over Evan Turner (like we do in MIN). And PHI couldn't disappoint fans and do the deal like this anyway .. they'd need a legit pick and or good player.

I just posted to see what type of deal DET would look for to take on the extremely expensive Brand .. maybe in a three-way with MIN.

Rip, Max, 7 for Brand, 2

Is probably the best offer Detroit would put out there

princeofpalace wrote:Rip, Max, 7 for Brand, 2

Is probably the best offer Detroit would put out there

That would be the absolute best deal value wise the Pistons could offer.
Max was putting up nearly 10 and 10 in the second half of the season. No reason to pay double for a slightly more productive player.
I'd rather keep Max and the pick and try and move Rip for something more economically friendly.

The pistons have been getting younger and more athletic over the last few years, bringing in Brand wouldn't go with that direction.

I'm thinking rip and the pick wouldn't get it done so maybe we send Tay and the 7 for brand and the 2 then send the 2 + rip to the wolves for Jefferson and their pick and nab cousins or favors

princeofpalace wrote:Rip, Max, 7 for Brand, 2

Is probably the best offer Detroit would put out there

I like this trade and it seems to be a win-win scenario. If I'm Dumars, I take Cousins at #2, not Turner, (or maybe trade down a few slots and still get Cousins and pick up another asset).

Pistons
Stuckey/Bynum (if resigned)
Gordon/Stuckey
Prince (who can still get traded)/JJ/Daye
Brand/CV/JJ
Cousins/Brand

I like that lineup a lot more than we have now. And trading down a couple of slots, and/or moving Prince could make that even better.

SAKURABA216 wrote:I'm thinking rip and the pick wouldn't get it done so maybe we send Tay and the 7 for brand and the 2 then send the 2 + rip to the wolves for Jefferson and their pick and nab cousins or favors

So we're paying around $95mill over 3 years for the PF position???
And thats not including the $14 each year for CV and Max.
I'd rather do the Prince and 7 for Jefferson and move Rip for expirings.
Thats too much payroll for what you get.

theBigLip wrote:

princeofpalace wrote:Rip, Max, 7 for Brand, 2

Is probably the best offer Detroit would put out there

I like this trade and it seems to be a win-win scenario. If I'm Dumars, I take Cousins at #2, not Turner, (or maybe trade down a few slots and still get Cousins and pick up another asset).

Pistons
Stuckey/Bynum (if resigned)
Gordon/Stuckey
Prince (who can still get traded)/JJ/Daye
Brand/CV/JJ
Cousins/Brand

I like that lineup a lot more than we have now. And trading down a couple of slots, and/or moving Prince could make that even better.

Cousins will not go #2. Nor would I take on Brand to get him. Cousins I think will still be there at 5.

Stuck/Turner/Prince/Brand/Wallace

If you realy want the deal its going to look like

#7, JJ, Rip for #2 and Brand

You then take Turner or trade him to the Wolves and bring back Cousins, #16, Flynn

dvs33 - remember, Max is part of the original trade and no longer on our payroll. And if we can move CV, that would be great.

I also agree with everyone's comments that Cousins will not go #2, and most "experts" are thinking 4 or 5. We could easily grab Turner and then start making deals depending on how Cousins would go. Like I said, pick up another asset (or dump another contract, like CV).

I wonder what the Sixers want in return for absorbing Brands contract - expiring contracts or talent that also makes a good chunk of money? I'd guess that they would want expiring contracts and young talent, not somebody like Hamilton (IMO he's not all that overpaid, but he's still an older player with an eight figure contract that doesn't expire for a couple more seasons). They would probably want Prince in any deal involving us, although I'm not sure what adding Minnesota to the deal would do to it.

Warspite wrote:If you realy want the deal its going to look like

#7, JJ, Rip for #2 and Brand

You then take Turner or trade him to the Wolves and bring back Cousins, #16, Flynn

I'd rather swap Daye for JJ in the first trade if we're going to take Turner, and I really don't see Minnesota giving up that much for Turner.

If rumors about the team being for sale are true (and it makes sense if they are) I think that leaves just about any deal involving us taking on more salary pretty much unthinkable.

I hope dumars jumps all over this. i think brand has A LOT left in his tank. he was sooo misused in philly. if we can get him along with evan turner, who i think is the best player in the draft, that would be awesome. i don't think philly would take rip though because hes on a long expensive contract just like brand. however, if they did do rip, jj, and #7 for brand and #2 then we could package stuckey and prince for a center like kaman or okafor.

gordon
turner
daye
brand
kaman

DetroitPistons wrote:...then we could package stuckey and prince for a center like kaman or okafor.

gordon
turner
daye
brand
kaman

Kaman, and especially Okafor (and his horrilbe albatross contract) are not even close to being worth Stuckey and Prince. Those are our two most valuable trade assets on the team. If we move them, we better get something better than that in return.

FYI, we cannot go into the season with Gordon at the point. If you think Stuckey is a bad point guard, you'll have "fun" watching Gordon play the position.

2tough wrote:

DetroitPistons wrote:...then we could package stuckey and prince for a center like kaman or okafor.

gordon
turner
daye
brand
kaman

Kaman, and especially Okafor (and his horrilbe albatross contract) are not even close to being worth Stuckey and Prince. Those are our two most valuable trade assets on the team. If we move them, we better get something better than that in return.

FYI, we cannot go into the season with Gordon at the point. If you think Stuckey is a bad point guard, you'll have "fun" watching Gordon play the position.

Sorry, i should of been a little more clear. i wasn't suggesting trading both stuckey AND prince for kaman or okafor, i was saying we should put together a package centering around one or the other.

and turner would play PG most of the time, which he is more than capable of doing. this has been discussed in another thread and some people disagree with me. the thing is, most people have stuckey as our starting PG next season yet turner would be a much better ball handler and playmaker than him.

If the goal of the Sixers is to get out of Brand's bad contract why would they take on Maxiell and Rip's bad contracts in return ????? . . . It would probably take at least Prince , 7 and and either Daye or Jerebko for Brand + 2 . . . lets be realistic.

I'd give up Prince and their choice of either JJ or Daye +7 for Brand and 2.

i'd do anything for a chance to select Turner.He's #1 on my board.

I think (hope) that they would would be more interested in Daye than JJ. That said I would be fine with inculding Tay over Rip. I would much prefer Rip, but I'd be fine with using Tay in this trade if we were sure that we could flip the 2 back to Minny or New Jersey for another asset. We have all stated that we need to use Tay to get a real #1 player in the frontcourt, and this does it.

I'd rather just deal with Minny. #7 + Prince for #4

R. Stuckey/W. Bynum
R. Hamilton/B. Gordon
J. Jerebko/A. Daye
C. Villanueva/J. Maxiell
D. Cousins/B. Wallace

Still needs work, but it's a start.

Liqourish wrote:I'd rather just deal with Minny. #7 + Prince for #4

R. Stuckey/W. Bynum
R. Hamilton/B. Gordon
J. Jerebko/A. Daye
C. Villanueva/J. Maxiell
D. Cousins/B. Wallace

Still needs work, but it's a start.

Minny won't trade the 4 for that. That deal will get us jefferson.

theBigLip wrote:dvs33 - remember, Max is part of the original trade and no longer on our payroll. And if we can move CV, that would be great.

I also agree with everyone's comments that Cousins will not go #2, and most "experts" are thinking 4 or 5. We could easily grab Turner and then start making deals depending on how Cousins would go. Like I said, pick up another asset (or dump another contract, like CV).

My bad forgot that one.

Do you think Jefferson and brand could play together??
If we get a guy like jefferson or Brand, I like CV as a complimentary guy. He has a different skill set that would help.