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On Insider:

Dumars the real problem in Detroit

Some section headers (you can easily fill in the content):
Coaching hires
Free-agency miscues
Overvaluing his own players
Questionable trades

And the final lines:
The failure to effectively evaluate existing NBA talent (either by basketball fit or contractual worth) has set the organization back far further than it would have had Dumars done the opposite (effectively managing the cap and free agency and making faulty draft selections).

At some point, ownership has to take a good whiff and suggest a bath rather than a new brand of deodorant.

Amen. Has damaged this franchise more in the last five years than is imaginable. I'd be laughing about him still being GM if it wasn't so sad

Who?

Last offseason was the straw that broke the camels back IMO. He had a high pick and a lot of capspace and instead of turning it into something productive- he went out and overpaid for two guys who don't really fit with the team. Part of that blame is of course on Gores and his playoff mandate but Joe still needs to go and Gores needs to let us rebuild.

theBigLip wrote:On Insider:

Dumars the real problem in Detroit

Some section headers (you can easily fill in the content):
Coaching hires
Free-agency miscues
Overvaluing his own players
Questionable trades

And the final lines:
The failure to effectively evaluate existing NBA talent (either by basketball fit or contractual worth) has set the organization back far further than it would have had Dumars done the opposite (effectively managing the cap and free agency and making faulty draft selections).

At some point, ownership has to take a good whiff and suggest a bath rather than a new brand of deodorant.

I think we've seen this to be the case.

The team that let Monroe drop to us with a questionable pick (Golden State) and the team that let Drummond drop to us with a questionable pick (Toronto) are BOTH in much better shape than the Pistons are right now.

Who?

Too bad it's only an insider article so it won't get nearly the viewership that it should.

The article is fairly spot on and echoes a lot of sentiment on these boards.

Gery Woelfel: NBA sources claim Pistons GM Joe Dumars is walking on perilously thin ice. Twitter @GeryWoelfel

This guy is the Milwaukee insider who first reported about the Jennings/Knight trade weeks before it happened.

^Cheeks being fired without a complete house cleaning reflects very poorly on Gores and he's going to start being seen as a dunce as well. There is no remotely acceptable rationale to keep Dumars on when firing a first year coach mid-season. You clean house, fire everybody and start your GM search now, and then that GM can start his coaching search in the off-season.

We have a lame duck coach for the rest of the season, just one the players might like better, and a lame duck GM who is in the last year of his contract and all the writing seems to be on the wall with him.

You fire Joe and bring in a new GM and players know there is accountability there and a new boss they need to impress.

The ONLY hope in this situation is that Dumars was kept around to get the Pistons through the trade deadline - with Gores having final say and having to sign off on every potential move, rather than having no GM less than two weeks out from the trade deadline. But then the counter argument is - why not keep Cheeks around for the three or so more games as well? Why fire the two separately?

Rumors had it Dumars was also still in Cheeks' corner until Gores played the owner card and pulled the plug. I think the writing is on the wall. Dumars is FINALLY gone.

If he's not fired at some point this season (which I doubt, anyway), it seems quite evident now that he's not going to be extended afterward either....

I'd be surprised if Dumars is fired.

I believe they'll keep him on and quietly and cleanly cut ties in the offseason.

You have my permission to quote this if I turn out to be wrong, but I'm fairly certain on this one.

If it weren't for "The Playoff Mandate" (and assuming Joe D has the sense of an average internet fanboy) then we would be IN THE PLAYOFFS. Drummond with a team built around him couldn't help but make the playoffs in the East this year.

Who?

If we end up letting Dumars walk and hire some lame stat nerd, I think I'll probably walk away from this team too.

Piston Pete wrote:Rumors had it Dumars was also still in Cheeks' corner until Gores played the owner card and pulled the plug. I think the writing is on the wall. Dumars is FINALLY gone.

If he's not fired at some point this season (which I doubt, anyway), it seems quite evident now that he's not going to be extended afterward either....

Dumars should quit if this is the case.

Yeah, I don't see Dumars accepting a puppet or figurehead type of role. There also is nothing but downside from an organizational standpoint to such a scenario. Only makes sense from a preseving Dumars' legacy standpoint. But he can keep that in tact by resigning.

IMO, he still has power... For now

thesack12 wrote:Yeah, I don't see Dumars accepting a puppet or figurehead type of role. There also is nothing but downside from an organizational standpoint to such a scenario. Only makes sense from a preseving Dumars' legacy standpoint. But he can keep that in tact by resigning.

IMO, he still has power... For now

Nope

Dumars is essentially a puppet now.

Piston Pete wrote:

thesack12 wrote:Yeah, I don't see Dumars accepting a puppet or figurehead type of role. There also is nothing but downside from an organizational standpoint to such a scenario. Only makes sense from a preseving Dumars' legacy standpoint. But he can keep that in tact by resigning.

IMO, he still has power... For now

Nope

Dumars is essentially a puppet now.

Source?

thesack12 wrote:

Piston Pete wrote:

thesack12 wrote:Yeah, I don't see Dumars accepting a puppet or figurehead type of role. There also is nothing but downside from an organizational standpoint to such a scenario. Only makes sense from a preseving Dumars' legacy standpoint. But he can keep that in tact by resigning.

IMO, he still has power... For now

Nope

Dumars is essentially a puppet now.

Source?

Using my eyes/ears

Piston Pete wrote:
Using my eyes/ears

In other words, your opinion.

And thats fine, your allowed to express your opinion. Its basically the reason message boards were created

Opinion....I guess some.

But mostly, the reports that Dumars wanted to keep Cheeks until Gores over-ruled him = Dumars the puppet.

Piston Pete wrote:Opinion....I guess some.

But mostly, the reports that Dumars wanted to keep Cheeks until Gores over-ruled him = Dumars the puppet.

There are no reports that say that. I think somebody just started saying that on RealGM. (Maybe there are reports, but I know PP will link me if I'm wrong)