RealGM

i'm not sure and just to clear the air for anybody else who isn't sure....

now?
after Sac selects?
after Cha selects?
after the 60th pick?
July?
other?

the rule is that you can't trade 2 consecutive future 1st's.

and even then I might be dreaming...

Draft night 2015 I believe.


Sent from my iPhone using RealGM Forums

As we lost our pick, we couldn't trade our 2015 until we selected a player with it. We could then trade the rights to that player to another team. But, we technically cannot trade our 2015 draft pick.

We can trade our 2016 draft pick right now.

The rule is you can't not have a 1st rd round in two consecutive drafts. So it doesn't really matter how many you've traded in a row, as long as you pick up another somehow before that draft to have a 1st rd pick, then you're good

For example, if we somehow trade into the first round this year (maybe by packaging 38 w/ a player), even if its only for the 30th pick, then yes we can trade the 2015 pick because we wouldn't technically have gone two consecutive years without a first round pick.

If not though and we don't have a #1 pick this year, the earliest 1st rd pick we can trade is 2016.

That could be another incentive to move back into the 1st this year though, even if its just buying a late first from a team looking to save money. Gaining that option to trade the 2015 pick could be the difference between trading for a superstar or not this summer.

Personally, I think the Pistons are in the situation now where draft picks have more value as trade assets than to use ourselves. We have as much young talent as any team in the league. Draft picks are most valuable to teams rebuilding who have no young talent, or old contendes who are trying to get younger. We are neither of those teams. We're already past that phase of rebuilding team trying to stock up on young talent. Its time to develop the guys we have and add proven vets around them, in my opinion. So if trading the 2015 pick gets us Rondo or Carmelo for example, that's better for this team right now than the rookie we would get with that pick instead.

They can trade it after Charlotte picks this year.

The rule is you can't trade consecutive future first round picks. So you can't trade Smith + 2015 1st + 2016 1st for Player X. It has to be Smith + 2015 + 2017 to have the one year gap.

There is absolutely no rule from you trading your pick every year though, as long as you do it after the draft. Because after the draft the pick the Pistons traded this year is no longer a future pick. So after Charlotte picks the Pistons can trade their 2015 pick. Right after the 2015 draft they could trade the 2016 pick. After the 2016 draft they could trade the 2017 pick, so on and so on.

Irate wrote:They can trade it after Charlotte picks this year.

The rule is you can't trade consecutive future first round picks. So you can't trade Smith + 2015 1st + 2016 1st for Player X. It has to be Smith + 2015 + 2017 to have the one year gap.

There is absolutely no rule from you trading your pick every year though, as long as you do it after the draft. Because after the draft the pick the Pistons traded this year is no longer a future pick. So after Charlotte picks the Pistons can trade their 2015 pick. Right after the 2015 draft they could trade the 2016 pick. After the 2016 draft they could trade the 2017 pick, so on and so on.

After reading more I think you're right. It only applies to future picks. So they don't need to acquire another pick this year in order to trade the 2015 pick like I mentioned above. That's great to know.

That means after the draft we can now package Monroe with our 2015 pick for Love, Rondo, Carmelo, etc if we want. We wouldn't have been able to do that had we kept our pick this year. In the end it might prove to our advantage to give up that pick now. If it results in us being able to get a star for Monroe, that's better than anything we would've gotten at 9 in the draft this year.

Q00 wrote:

Irate wrote:They can trade it after Charlotte picks this year.

The rule is you can't trade consecutive future first round picks. So you can't trade Smith + 2015 1st + 2016 1st for Player X. It has to be Smith + 2015 + 2017 to have the one year gap.

There is absolutely no rule from you trading your pick every year though, as long as you do it after the draft. Because after the draft the pick the Pistons traded this year is no longer a future pick. So after Charlotte picks the Pistons can trade their 2015 pick. Right after the 2015 draft they could trade the 2016 pick. After the 2016 draft they could trade the 2017 pick, so on and so on.

After reading more I think you're right. It only applies to future picks. So they don't need to acquire another pick this year in order to trade the 2015 pick like I mentioned above. That's great to know.

That means after the draft we can now package Monroe with our 2015 pick for Love, Rondo, Carmelo, etc if we want. We wouldn't have been able to do that had we kept our pick this year. In the end it might prove to our advantage to give up that pick now. If it results in us being able to get a star for Monroe, that's better than anything we would've gotten at 9 in the draft this year.

Minnesota wouldn't take Monroe for Love and Moose wouldn't want to go there anyway, also don't think we can trade a pick with Monroe in a S&T.

sc8581 wrote:

Q00 wrote:

Irate wrote:They can trade it after Charlotte picks this year.

The rule is you can't trade consecutive future first round picks. So you can't trade Smith + 2015 1st + 2016 1st for Player X. It has to be Smith + 2015 + 2017 to have the one year gap.

There is absolutely no rule from you trading your pick every year though, as long as you do it after the draft. Because after the draft the pick the Pistons traded this year is no longer a future pick. So after Charlotte picks the Pistons can trade their 2015 pick. Right after the 2015 draft they could trade the 2016 pick. After the 2016 draft they could trade the 2017 pick, so on and so on.

After reading more I think you're right. It only applies to future picks. So they don't need to acquire another pick this year in order to trade the 2015 pick like I mentioned above. That's great to know.

That means after the draft we can now package Monroe with our 2015 pick for Love, Rondo, Carmelo, etc if we want. We wouldn't have been able to do that had we kept our pick this year. In the end it might prove to our advantage to give up that pick now. If it results in us being able to get a star for Monroe, that's better than anything we would've gotten at 9 in the draft this year.

Minnesota wouldn't take Monroe for Love and Moose wouldn't want to go there anyway, also don't think we can trade a pick with Monroe in a S&T.

You don't know where Love will be traded (or for what) or if Monroe would want to go there or not, so your opinion means as much mine.

As for packaging a pick with Monroe in a S&T, I'm not sure, but I know you can recieve picks back in a S&T, so I don't see why you couldn't send out a pick in the deal. I think the only thing you can't do is package other players with Monroe. Even if you can't package him with a pick though, they could just be done in separate deals if necessary. There's always workarounds.

Irate wrote:They can trade it after Charlotte picks this year.

The rule is you can't trade consecutive future first round picks. So you can't trade Smith + 2015 1st + 2016 1st for Player X. It has to be Smith + 2015 + 2017 to have the one year gap.

There is absolutely no rule from you trading your pick every year though, as long as you do it after the draft. Because after the draft the pick the Pistons traded this year is no longer a future pick. So after Charlotte picks the Pistons can trade their 2015 pick. Right after the 2015 draft they could trade the 2016 pick. After the 2016 draft they could trade the 2017 pick, so on and so on.

Thanks for posting this. Ive been kinda confused on whether or not we could trade it after the draft. Well thats good to know that we are free and clear completely after the draft.

It just seems pretty stupid to go 3 yrs in between 1st rd picks. Thats a really short-sighted strategy and will lead to serious cap problems later on having to replace 1st rd picks with more expensive FAs.

Q00 wrote:You don't know where Love will be traded (or for what) or if Monroe would want to go there or not, so your opinion means as much mine.

I think that it's pretty reasonable to suspect that the TWolves will want more than Monroe for Love, and that they'll get more than Monroe for Love(check the trade thread for Love offers-Boston can put together a ton of picks and young, quality PF replacements, much better than just Monroe). I think that it's also very reasonable to say that Monroe would rather go elsewhere, like say, NO his hometown or DC, where he played his college ball (two places reportedly actually interested in him, unlike Minnisota). Remember, S&Ts require Monroe to actually sign an offer sheet with the Wolves before we work out a deal. Why would the Wolves offer Monroe a contract anyways? They already have Pek as their no-defense post scorer, and he's a better post-scorer than Monroe right now.

We aren't getting Kevin Love.

Q00 wrote:As for packaging a pick with Monroe in a S&T, I'm not sure, but I know you can recieve picks back in a S&T, so I don't see why you couldn't send out a pick in the deal. I think the only thing you can't do is package other players with Monroe. Even if you can't package him with a pick though, they could just be done in separate deals if necessary. There's always workarounds.

You can receive more than two players in return in a S&T, but you can't trade another player with Monroe.

Why would you assume that it's different for draft picks?

I can't find anything related to this though.

I certainly don't WANT to trade the pick.

Rebuilding teams need first round picks. That's why they get them first.

Snakebites wrote:I certainly don't WANT to trade the pick.

Rebuilding teams need first round picks. That's why they get them first.

Yeah but it's good to have them available again, just in case a guy is on the market that's a no brainer.

Q00 wrote:

You don't know where Love will be traded (or for what) or if Monroe would want to go there or not, so your opinion means as much mine.

So his speculation based on common sense is worthless but the wild speculation you throw around on here everyday has substance.. Got it

Notanoob wrote:

Q00 wrote:You don't know where Love will be traded (or for what) or if Monroe would want to go there or not, so your opinion means as much mine.

I think that it's pretty reasonable to suspect that the TWolves will want more than Monroe for Love, and that they'll get more than Monroe for Love(check the trade thread for Love offers-Boston can put together a ton of picks and young, quality PF replacements, much better than just Monroe). I think that it's also very reasonable to say that Monroe would rather go elsewhere, like say, NO his hometown or DC, where he played his college ball (two places reportedly actually interested in him, unlike Minnisota). Remember, S&Ts require Monroe to actually sign an offer sheet with the Wolves before we work out a deal. Why would the Wolves offer Monroe a contract anyways? They already have Pek as their no-defense post scorer, and he's a better post-scorer than Monroe right now.

We aren't getting Kevin Love.

Q00 wrote:As for packaging a pick with Monroe in a S&T, I'm not sure, but I know you can recieve picks back in a S&T, so I don't see why you couldn't send out a pick in the deal. I think the only thing you can't do is package other players with Monroe. Even if you can't package him with a pick though, they could just be done in separate deals if necessary. There's always workarounds.

You can receive more than two players in return in a S&T, but you can't trade another player with Monroe.

Why would you assume that it's different for draft picks?

I can't find anything related to this though.

You should go back and read what you are responding to before responding next time.

I never suggested trading Monroe for Love straight up. I said this now gives us the opportunity to offer Monroe+2015 pick for Love, or Monroe+2015 for Rondo, or Monroe+2015 for Melo... Big difference there, and I don't know why you are fixated on the Love part of all that. The point was having the pick to package with Monroe could net us more in a trade now. So I guess you going on and on about why Monroe for Love straight up would never happen was a big waste of time on your part as its irrelevant to what I said.

Also, saying you think its reasonable to assume it won't happen and saying it won't happen are two different things. You can't just makes statements that something isn't going to happen if you know nothing about it (ie what MIN/Monroe is thinking) or else it makes you sound crazy.

To your question about why would Monroe want to play in MIN...same reason he would want to play for any team that offers him a max contract - money. If MIN were interested in the deal and willing to offer him max money, why wouldn't he be interested in playing there is the better question? As for why MIN would want him already having Pekovic, because I don't think Pek is their longterm plan at Center, Dieng is, and Monroe would fit better with him longterm.

And the reason I assume packaging draft picks with S&Ts could be different than packaging players, is because draft picks don't effect the salary structure of a deal. If you package a player it complicates matching salaries, but picks don't count when matching salaries. Again, I'm not certain on that rule, but I've never read anyone say you can't package a pick with a player in a S&T, so I'm assuming it can be done until someone says otherwise.

The only way you can offer Monroe for anything is if Monroe wants to play for that team.


You cant sign and trade him to a team you want to trade with. You can only S&T Monroe to a team he wants to play for. Monroe has all the leverage and the other team doesnt have to offer you anything but cap filler.

You are not getting any talent or value in a S&T for Monroe. The best you can hope for a TE and a future heavily protected 1st or some 2nds.

I can't find anything on draft picks being included with the sign-and-traded player. But I'm almost positive that can not happen.

If you want to build a package for Love around Monroe, the best bet is to sign Monroe and then wait until after December 15th and then make the trade. Then you can include more players and/or draft picks.

They have to be careful though. If Monroe signs an offer sheet with a team and the Pistons match it, they can't trade Monroe for one year without his consent. It essentially gives Monroe a 1 year trade veto.

Q00 wrote:

Notanoob wrote:

Q00 wrote:You don't know where Love will be traded (or for what) or if Monroe would want to go there or not, so your opinion means as much mine.

I think that it's pretty reasonable to suspect that the TWolves will want more than Monroe for Love, and that they'll get more than Monroe for Love(check the trade thread for Love offers-Boston can put together a ton of picks and young, quality PF replacements, much better than just Monroe). I think that it's also very reasonable to say that Monroe would rather go elsewhere, like say, NO his hometown or DC, where he played his college ball (two places reportedly actually interested in him, unlike Minnisota). Remember, S&Ts require Monroe to actually sign an offer sheet with the Wolves before we work out a deal. Why would the Wolves offer Monroe a contract anyways? They already have Pek as their no-defense post scorer, and he's a better post-scorer than Monroe right now.

We aren't getting Kevin Love.

Q00 wrote:As for packaging a pick with Monroe in a S&T, I'm not sure, but I know you can recieve picks back in a S&T, so I don't see why you couldn't send out a pick in the deal. I think the only thing you can't do is package other players with Monroe. Even if you can't package him with a pick though, they could just be done in separate deals if necessary. There's always workarounds.

You can receive more than two players in return in a S&T, but you can't trade another player with Monroe.

Why would you assume that it's different for draft picks?

I can't find anything related to this though.

You should go back and read what you are responding to before responding next time.

I never suggested trading Monroe for Love straight up. I said this now gives us the opportunity to offer Monroe+2015 pick for Love, or Monroe+2015 for Rondo, or Monroe+2015 for Melo... Big difference there, and I don't know why you are fixated on the Love part of all that. The point was having the pick to package with Monroe could net us more in a trade now. So I guess you going on and on about why Monroe for Love straight up would never happen was a big waste of time on your part as its irrelevant to what I said.

Also, saying you think its reasonable to assume it won't happen and saying it won't happen are two different things. You can't just makes statements that something isn't going to happen if you know nothing about it (ie what MIN/Monroe is thinking) or else it makes you sound crazy.

To your question about why would Monroe want to play in MIN...same reason he would want to play for any team that offers him a max contract - money. If MIN were interested in the deal and willing to offer him max money, why wouldn't he be interested in playing there is the better question? As for why MIN would want him already having Pekovic, because I don't think Pek is their longterm plan at Center, Dieng is, and Monroe would fit better with him longterm.

And the reason I assume packaging draft picks with S&Ts could be different than packaging players, is because draft picks don't effect the salary structure of a deal. If you package a player it complicates matching salaries, but picks don't count when matching salaries. Again, I'm not certain on that rule, but I've never read anyone say you can't package a pick with a player in a S&T, so I'm assuming it can be done until someone says otherwise.

It does NOT give us the opportunity to trade Monroe with a 2015 1st. Stop telling people their opinions don't mean much when your "facts" mean nothing.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using RealGM Forums mobile app

Clarity wrote:

Q00 wrote:

You don't know where Love will be traded (or for what) or if Monroe would want to go there or not, so your opinion means as much mine.

So his speculation based on common sense is worthless but the wild speculation you throw around on here everyday has substance.. Got it

Precisely

Sent from my SCH-I545 using RealGM Forums mobile app

We can trade the pick when we are sure it won't be another lottery pick.