Tolliver out the rotation?

aad · Post #1 » by **aad** » Mon Oct 19, 2015 3:26 pm

With illy and morris playing PF its hard to see tolliver in the rotation its looking more like we gonna have a nine man rotation to start the season with jackson,kcp,morris,illy,drummond as the starters with baynes,blake,stanley and meeks as the back ups

I can see tolliver getting minutes becuse of foul trouble I also can see bullock taking meeks role in the rotation so lets see how these last two preseason games play out 8 more days to the season starts im excited

Post #2 » by **dVs33** » Mon Oct 19, 2015 3:50 pm

I would think the rotations will be different when the real games start.
Johnsons minutes will drop down a bit and Morris will play more 3. That will open up minutes for Tolliver.

zeebneeb · Post #3 » by **zeebneeb** » Mon Oct 19, 2015 4:14 pm

We have to see what the actual starting lineup us going to be, and then see what the actual rotation is going to be first.

Stan has actually backed himself into a corner in several positions amazingly. I don't think he thought that so many players would play so well and now he has to make some tough damn decisions.

What's the starting lineup?

When Stan drafted umm, Stan, I don't think he knew just how nba ready Stanimal was/is. This isn't a case of spot minutes either this is a "holy hell the kid has to play significant minutes" problem. Now with the dynamic play of Morris this makes the resolution easier as you just start him at the 4. This presents a problem with Erson who I am certain Stan envisioned as a starter when he made that deal and now realizes that Morris can actually create his own offense while Erson cannot.

This also extends to bullock who has wowed everyone I'm sure.

I am almost certain that the starting lineup will be finalized as

Jackson
Pope
Johnson
Morris
Drummond

But the wrinkle is who sits first? If there is no foul trouble it will be Stanimal. Foul trouble morris. I'm not sure I see minutes for Tolliver at all unless several players are in deep foul trouble and that is also due to the play of baynes. I also can see Bullock playing some sf as well as he has the size otherwise he comes in for Pope but that squeezes meeks.

This team is deep as hell and not with non players.

Primary bench guys

Jennings
Blake
Meeks
Bullock
Stanimal?
Erson?
Baynes
Tolliver
Anthony

So in the end I typed alot and have no idea. It's going to be interesting though. All I know is any rotation that doesn't include Dinwiddie I'm okay with.

Spider156 · Post #4 » by **Spider156** » Mon Oct 19, 2015 9:39 pm

I don't think he's out of the rotation. I think Tolliver is a professional athlete like Meeks and you know what you're getting from him. I think Meeks has seen more playing time because our offense needs more guard play because Jennings and Blake are out. Dinwiddie has been playing the stats game and it's limiting our offense. I can't see him being part of the rotation by the middle of the year unless he outplays Blake somehow and knowing SVG likes veterans more because of their ability to recognize the game's importance, the only way Dinwiddie will see time is if he puts more effort defensively. I don't think we'll see Dinwiddie here by next year. There are plenty of guards that need a chance (Bullock) that can play better than Dinwiddie.

Joe Berry · Post #5 » by **Joe Berry** » Tue Oct 20, 2015 12:55 pm

No way Tolliver is the perfect benchplayer who brings energy off the bench (something this team often is still missing) and has one good skill(3 pt shooting). He will be part of the rotation unless SJ absolutely forces SVG hand and puts Morris almost fulltime at PF which i can't see right now.

Post #6 » by **Snakebites** » Tue Oct 20, 2015 1:18 pm

Tolliver tailed off towards the end of last year, particularly after Jerebko was traded and there was no more competition for him for backup PF minutes.

I could easily see his role greatly reduced or eliminated this year.

bballnmike · Post #7 » by **bballnmike** » Tue Oct 20, 2015 2:42 pm

As long as he hustles and is making his 3s, he'll play. Now if he goes through a really bad shooting slump, there's more competition that can stretch the floor so maybe he'd lose his spot. But as long as he does what he's expected to, I think Stan will find minutes for him.

hoophabit · Post #8 » by **hoophabit** » Tue Oct 20, 2015 3:08 pm

He's a decent 4 to have on the bench and go to occasionally for a heat check if you need some outside shooting. I think that's the more ideal role for him. As noted, his productivity decreased with increased usage. I think he'll get some run, and certainly wouldn't rule out the possibility of his being included in the right trade package.

Redeemed · Post #9 » by **Redeemed** » Tue Oct 20, 2015 4:07 pm

I like what SVG is building; a team with assets who can actually contribute. Is Tolliver out of the rotation? Perhaps.

Does that mean he will not contribute to the team in a meaningful way? No. Ersan hasn't been durable. He's bound to miss time. Tolliver will slide in to fill in the gap. In the event that there's foul trouble among the bigs, Tolliver could fill a role. In the case of small ball lineups he could also be utilized.

I like Tolliver's energy, defense, and shooting. He has a Joel Anthony-esque professionalism. He can sit out for extended periods and come in ready to contribute, unlike Jerebko who would pout.

Brapman · Post #10 » by **Brapman** » Wed Oct 21, 2015 7:25 pm

With Morris and Ersan starting, and SVG saying those two and Stanley would play the same amount of minutes, the main rotation players are established. It's Drummond, Morris, Ersan, KCP and Jackson. The main bench rotation players are Johnson, Meeks, Baynes and Blake or Dinwiddie as the backup PG. By midseason, the hope is Jennings is the backup PG.

That leaves Bullock, Tolliver and Anthony as guys who'll play spot minutes, and rotation minutes if there's an injury at the 4 (non-PG) positions they cover. We might not focus on this, but Bullock, Tolliver and Anthony are 3 of the best 10-12 guys the Pistons have had available to them in a lot of years.

zeebneeb · Post #11 » by **zeebneeb** » Wed Oct 21, 2015 9:27 pm

Brapman wrote:With Morris and Ersan starting, and SVG saying those two and Stanley would play the same amount of minutes, the main rotation players are established. It's Drummond, Morris, Ersan, KCP and Jackson. The main bench rotation players are Johnson, Meeks, Baynes and Blake or Dinwiddie as the backup PG. By midseason, the hope is Jennings is the backup PG.

That leaves Bullock, Tolliver and Anthony as guys who'll play spot minutes, and rotation minutes if there's an injury at the 4 (non-PG) positions they cover. We might not focus on this, but Bullock, Tolliver and Anthony are 3 of the best 10-12 guys the Pistons have had available to them in a lot of years.

I wouldn't be so sure about meeks. He and Bullock may flip roles as Bullock is a HELL of a better defender then "wave your arms frantically" Meeks. Based on preseason* Bullock can also shoot the lights out as well and is also taller then meeks.

*Preseason results are not typical. Please consult espn for directions on how you should feel.

Brapman · Post #12 » by **Brapman** » Wed Oct 21, 2015 10:03 pm

zeebneeb wrote:
Brapman wrote:With Morris and Ersan starting, and SVG saying those two and Stanley would play the same amount of minutes, the main rotation players are established. It's Drummond, Morris, Ersan, KCP and Jackson. The main bench rotation players are Johnson, Meeks, Baynes and Blake or Dinwiddie as the backup PG. By midseason, the hope is Jennings is the backup PG.

That leaves Bullock, Tolliver and Anthony as guys who'll play spot minutes, and rotation minutes if there's an injury at the 4 (non-PG) positions they cover. We might not focus on this, but Bullock, Tolliver and Anthony are 3 of the best 10-12 guys the Pistons have had available to them in a lot of years.
I wouldn't be so sure about meeks. He and Bullock may flip roles as Bullock is a HELL of a better defender then "wave your arms frantically" Meeks. Based on preseason* Bullock can also shoot the lights out as well and is also taller then meeks.

*Preseason results are not typical. Please consult espn for directions on how you should feel.

First, I love your tag line. That's funny - hadn't noticed it before.

I agree about the possibility of Bullock supplanting Meeks. Bullock's D gives Stan a huge weapon he's never had - a wing player off the bench who can play high level defense. I don't know how high his high level D gets. Is it possible that we have an elite defender on our hands? I'm not sure why not. He's a pretty great athlete, and he seems to have the aptitude for D, plus the size to guard 3's, not just 2's.

Meeks will get the first opportunity though. He has to play well, and the truth for him is with KCP, he might only be looking at 15 minutes a game or so. Jody will have to play efficiently - and shoot real well in limited minutes and touches. That isn't an easy thing to do. But he's the veteran, so it's his job to lose, I'd bet.