Worst possible scenario

[StunnaStan]

If the Pistons keep going at the pace there going, they'll either

A. Manage to get 8th seed (which essentially is 4-5 extra games before being eliminated) and end up with a #15 pick

Or

B. Miss the playoffs while winning too many games to get a high lottery pick

At this point, i think its clear as day that this current roster needs to be shaken up more. Drummond has exceeded everyones expectations thus far and the rest of the team lets it go in vain.

While reggie has struggled at some points this year due to playing at his own pace, the 3 players ive been most frustrated with most is kcp, morris, and ilyasova.

With ily, its as simple as bad defense and inconsistent shooting. Just because we wanted/needed a stretch 4 doesn't outweigh dude being undersized.

Marcus morris. Theres 2 sides to this. While im happy that we got him for dirt cheap and hes shown he can be a very useful player, AS OUR STARTING SF, IT AINT GONNA CUT IT. Hes very slow footed with a very slow ball handle. And with his favorite shot being the worst shot in basketball (long distance 2pointers) its further explains why our record is what it is.

Kcp. This dude is supposed to be Detroits 6man. We can't have this skinny dude with no ball handle and no triple threat our starting shooting guard. Khris middleton is a bum when you look at every starting sg league round and he's better than kcp. Kcp doesnt bring any type of threat to oppsing players. All kcp does is chuck 3's and long 2s. He only drives to the basket in stride and cant faceup his defender to make a move. This messes up reggies flow because the sg is supposed to be able to mix it up with scoring and kcp is only looking to chuck jumpers. Alot of times when kcp gets the ball, you see him pass it back to reggie within 3 or 4 seconds of having the ball. Then reggie ends up waiting/over-dribbling for a p&r with couple seconds left on the clock.

I think we should first look to get some type of pf that can play with andre. If you have paid any attention to philly this season, youve noticed they also have a monster in the paint named jahlil okafor. Hes been beastings centers his rookie year. Guess what though, next season joel embiid (who same if not bigger than drummond) is playing and that's gonna slide okafor to the power foward position. Imagine ily guarding okafor lmao. We need to do something similar and get bigger. We all saw nene give our bigs work in the paint.

Gotta go back to work now. What do yall think?

[The Penguin]

I'll believe Joel Embiid is playing in the NBA when I see him playing in the NBA.

We simply aren't going to be one of the worst teams in the league, Stan has publicly spoken out against tanking. It's a work in process, we aren't trying to win a title with this current roster, there are a lot of young guys on the team learning and growing. Plenty of championship caliber players have gone late in the lottery or even outside of the 1st round (Paul George, Kwahi Leonard, Draymond, Jimmy Butler just to name a few). Winning a little bit now will continue to raise the tide and make us a more attractive free agent destination. As Drummond continues to establish himself, it will draw interest from other great players. Rome wasn't built in a day and obviously there's still plenty of work to do.

[Cowology]

So..... you are advocating making changes to our lineup.... so that we can matchup with Philly? Did I read that correctly? Mkay.

[Todd3]

I agree with everything except that we need another C next to Drummond (been there, done that, no thanks), or that it would be bad to get the 8th seed. Part of our problem is inexperience. Having more SJs/KCPs next year isn't going to make us better. What we need is to get in the playoffs so we can start attracting proven vets in FA. We need to get proven veteran shooters around Drummond and Reggie, not more rookies.

It really shouldn't be a surprise that we aren't a good shooting team, because that was our main need in the offseason and we never really addressed it. Morris is a career 36% 3pt shooter, but that is basically average in todays game and adding 1 average 3pt shooter isn't going to make a bad shooting team suddenly good. Our lotto pick was used on an all around defensive player instead of a shooter. Ersan can shoot but he barely plays and you need more than one great shooter to improve a team. And that was basically our offseason additions around Dre & Reggie. We really didn't add much shooting around them when look at it.

Our 2-4 spots are more likely than not career bench players and are serviceable to probably be a .500 team with, but we need to get legit starters there that fit better longterm. We are set at the 2 most important positions though. We just need to continue building around them and just use this year to get them playoff experience together.

[hoophabit]

Okafor at PF? Will that be better than Monroe at PF? Embiid remains a great question mark. The Pistons have nothing to envy in the 76ers situation. SVG, while fretting and fuming, will do what is necessary to build the Pistons. Tanking $ucks all around, and generally doesn't help a franchise. I'd actually quit following them for a while if I thought they were tanking. For me, there would be nothing worth watching.

I agree though that a PF that can be some presence in the paint as well as shoot from the perimeter would be a huge help.

[bkseven]

What this team needs is a Ben Simmons/ Skal from the draft (assuming they don't bust out in their first year of college bball). Then, I'd put the Pistons next to the T-Wolves as the most promising young team in the league.

[Cowology]

I'm gonna go with what this team needs is to 1) get healthy, 2) continue developing it's youth 3) add depth through draft/FA.

Losing in the first round is FAR from a worst case scenario. In fact I'd say that's pretty damn good. Obviously I'd like to advance further than that, but it's crucial we make some advancement heading into next off-season. The draft pick doesn't really matter to me either way since it's time we start adding some vets to our young core.

Worst case is definitely we miss the playoffs and then Dre walks. Then we're ****.

[BadMofoPimp]

I reckon taking steps forward each and every year building towards a ship is not good enough.

[MrBigShot]

Making the 8th seed would be great. Tired of losing. We need to fix the losing culture that's accumuluated since Chauncey was traded and get back to a culture that strives to win, even if we don't have the talent to do more than get swept in the 1st round.

SVG will need to make some trades within the next year, because as is we just don't have enough talent. Stanley hasn't progressed as quickly as expected, Reggie/Dre are good but inconsistent in certain aspects of their games far too often Morris/Ilyasova are great bench players not starters, and our actual bench is putrid. And KCP is the only guy on the entire roster that you can count on effort 100% of the time.

Nabbing someone like Simmons in the draft is a pipe dream. We won't be bad enough to have a legit chance at getting a pick high enough to get someone with his potential even if we do miss the playoffs.

Still can't help but wonder what would've happened had Jennings not gotten injured.

[Cowology]

Making the 8th seed would be great. Tired of losing. We need to fix the losing culture that's accumuluated since Chauncey was traded and get back to a culture that strives to win, even if we don't have the talent to do more than get swept in the 1st round.

SVG will need to make some trades within the next year, because as is we just don't have enough talent. Stanley hasn't progressed as quickly as expected, Reggie/Dre are good but inconsistent in certain aspects of their games far too often Morris/Ilyasova are great bench players not starters, and our actual bench is putrid. And KCP is the only guy on the entire roster that you can count on effort 100% of the time.

Nabbing someone like Simmons in the draft is a pipe dream. We won't be bad enough to have a legit chance at getting a pick high enough to get someone with his potential even if we do miss the playoffs.

Still can't help but wonder what would've happened had Jennings not gotten injured.

1) Stanley was only projected to "progress quickly" after his pre-season overhype. Many of us have been saying all along that we're looking towards the All-Star break to see if he can crack the starting lineup. SVG doesn't gift anything to rookies.

2) If Jennings doesn't get injured we probably don't make a play for Reggie. I'm still hopeful we can resign Jennings, but no telling if he's willing to accept a super-sub role. Could depend on what sort of contract he's able to command on the open market, which obviously will depend heavily on his play the 2nd half of the season. I could maybe see a 2 year deal with a player option.

3) Agree 100% on the necessity of building a winning culture. This team needs to start winning games. Not at the expense of our core guys obviously, but we need to prove we're going to be a playoff team and building towards championship contention and we need to do it now.

[Ghost]

Philly can take it to the bank, top-5 pick this year to Finals next year.
We had Drummond and Monroe, that worked so well... you need shooters, a bench, a coach and of course chemistry. I think we will be alright this year, especially once Jennings and Meeks come back. If we are the 7/8 seed or even 9, I won't worry to much, we are on the way up. It's not like it is some problem that we are now getting better, SVG hasn't had that much time to fix what he started with IMO. Relax...
This season could still pan out better then expected with us over performing in the playoff picture

[Blkbrd671]

If the Pistons keep going at the pace there going, they'll either

A. Manage to get 8th seed (which essentially is 4-5 extra games before being eliminated) and end up with a #15 pick

Or

B. Miss the playoffs while winning too many games to get a high lottery pick

At this point, i think its clear as day that this current roster needs to be shaken up more. Drummond has exceeded everyones expectations thus far and the rest of the team lets it go in vain.

While reggie has struggled at some points this year due to playing at his own pace, the 3 players ive been most frustrated with most is kcp, morris, and ilyasova.

With ily, its as simple as bad defense and inconsistent shooting. Just because we wanted/needed a stretch 4 doesn't outweigh dude being undersized.

or simply not shooting open shots, he cost us at least 6-9 points a game by passing up a perfectly open shot.

Marcus morris. Theres 2 sides to this. While im happy that we got him for dirt cheap and hes shown he can be a very useful player, AS OUR STARTING SF, IT AINT GONNA CUT IT. Hes very slow footed with a very slow ball handle. And with his favorite shot being the worst shot in basketball (long distance 2pointers) its further explains why our record is what it is.

i disagree. What your overlooking is his defense which i think has been better than advertised. KCP and him have quite a chemistry on switching on picks, its actually fun to watch those 2 defensively. While his shots aren't exactly efficient per NBA averages, he makes them one on one at a pretty high clip and gets us important buckets. He needs to improve his spot up shooting, coming off the screen and take it to the damn rim. For what ever reason he's shy'd away from driving which i think is actually pretty decent. Part of the reason Marcus Struggles is because we fail to get him the ball in positions of strength and instead have trying to make a play

Kcp. This dude is supposed to be Detroits 6man. We can't have this skinny dude with no ball handle and no triple threat our starting shooting guard. Khris middleton is a bum when you look at every starting sg league round and he's better than kcp. Kcp doesnt bring any type of threat to oppsing players. All kcp does is chuck 3's and long 2s. He only drives to the basket in stride and cant faceup his defender to make a move. This messes up reggies flow because the sg is supposed to be able to mix it up with scoring and kcp is only looking to chuck jumpers. Alot of times when kcp gets the ball, you see him pass it back to reggie within 3 or 4 seconds of having the ball. Then reggie ends up waiting/over-dribbling for a p&r with couple seconds left on the clock

.

AGain you ignoring defense. KCP is our stopper and is assigned to the best player most nights. Playing good D is really quite exerting. What i do agree with is that he needs to be more assertive and imposing. KCP seems to be gettign what he wants when he's confident enough to try it. When he's not confident he dissappears. Rj's responsibility is to get players like him going(to a certain extent) i really think RJ has failed in that aspect of getting the offense going. I think most nights he's trying to get his first

I think we should first look to get some type of pf that can play with andre. If you have paid any attention to philly this season, youve noticed they also have a monster in the paint named jahlil okafor. Hes been beastings centers his rookie year. Guess what though, next season joel embiid (who same if not bigger than drummond) is playing and that's gonna slide okafor to the power foward position. Imagine ily guarding okafor lmao. We need to do something similar and get bigger. We all saw nene give our bigs work in the paint.

Gotta go back to work now. What do yall think?

What is there record? i'd be more inclined to go with the GSW model of versatile forwards that can defend multiple positions

[coordinator0]

Philadelphia is already playing a big frontcourt with Okafor and Noel. The latter is struggling mightily at power forward though. If Embiid comes back I wouldn't bet on him starting right away but he would at last offer a better jumper to compliment either of the other two.

Still, Detroit had that the past few seasons with Drummond and Monroe and it wasn't good at all. No need to try that experiment again. If you can get a big power forward that can shoot and defend well then sure, but guys with all of those qualities are extremely rare.

[bjones521]

I agree...The 2 Big system is as good as dead in todays NBA if both can't defend and shoot bc spacing is key and ball movement.

The more is see KCP and Stanley play I could see the Pistons trying to snag Harrison barnes from GS if he doesn't resign. They'd have to overpay but that would be a great fit with move Stanley to the 2.

[bkseven]

I agree...The 2 Big system is as good as dead in todays NBA if both can't defend and shoot bc spacing is key and ball movement.

The more is see KCP and Stanley play I could see the Pistons trying to snag Harrison barnes from GS if he doesn't resign. They'd have to overpay but that would be a great fit with move Stanley to the 2.

Stanley at the 2, no thanks.

[Cowology]

We are set at the 1, 2, 3 and 5 spots. We may even be set at PF depending on how well Reggie, KCP, Stanley & Dre develop. IF we were going to make a run at a big time FA this off-season it would have to be somebody like Horford, but I personally advocate for adding 2-3 starting caliber players to our bench. If you can resign Jennings and then add a quality(15 & 7) type backup forward I'd be all over it. Another 3 & D swing player, especially given Meeks can't seem to stay healthy and we have a pretty solid crew.

A lot really just depends on internal growth, but people are already panicking and freaking out over some early season play. Expected I suppose, but unnecessary.

[Todd3]

Kcp. This dude is supposed to be Detroits 6man. We can't have this skinny dude with no ball handle and no triple threat our starting shooting guard. Khris middleton is a bum when you look at every starting sg league round and he's better than kcp. Kcp doesnt bring any type of threat to oppsing players. All kcp does is chuck 3's and long 2s. He only drives to the basket in stride and cant faceup his defender to make a move. This messes up reggies flow because the sg is supposed to be able to mix it up with scoring and kcp is only looking to chuck jumpers. Alot of times when kcp gets the ball, you see him pass it back to reggie within 3 or 4 seconds of having the ball. Then reggie ends up waiting/over-dribbling for a p&r with couple seconds left on the clock

.

AGain you ignoring defense. KCP is our stopper and is assigned to the best player most nights. Playing good D is really quite exerting. What i do agree with is that he needs to be more assertive and imposing. KCP seems to be gettign what he wants when he's confident enough to try it. When he's not confident he dissappears. Rj's responsibility is to get players like him going(to a certain extent) i really think RJ has failed in that aspect of getting the offense going. I think most nights he's trying to get his first

KCP is apparently 226th in the league in defensive real plus/minus.
http://espn.go.com/nba/statistics/rpm/_/page/6/sort/DRPM

He is obviously a great defender and better than 226th from an individual perspective, but with this stat measuring more from a team perspective, it does make you wonder how valuable his individual defense really is to the team.

Opponents shoot 41% FG against him which is awesome, but with so few superstars at the SG position anymore, how much of an effect does a shutdown SG actually have on an overall game today? (With most offenses primary scorers being at the other 4 positions)

In other words, if the average opposing SG is only taking a small % of his teams shots anyways, whether he makes 40% or 60% isn't making a big difference in the overall boxscore. Whereas if a PG gives up 40% or 60%, its going to make a huge difference on the game, with so many taking the bulk of their teams shots today, for example.

Drummond is 3rd in the league, and while he isn't as good of an individual defender as Pope, with Centers being so important to team defense (especially w/ rebounding), his overall effect on the defense ends up being greater than the better defending SG. Perhaps that is why KCP's score is so low, but ultimately team defense is most important, which makes me wonder if having a great defender at that position is even necessary today. Would opposing SGs be putting 25 on us every night if we just had an average defender there instead? I tend to think no, because most just don't score that much today no matter who is guarding them. So would we be better with a shooter/spacer there instead, even if only average defensively? I don't think it would have as much effect on our team defense as people think, but the improvement to the team offense with better spacing could result in a bigger point differential for the team overall.

[Todd3]

I agree...The 2 Big system is as good as dead in todays NBA if both can't defend and shoot bc spacing is key and ball movement.

The more is see KCP and Stanley play I could see the Pistons trying to snag Harrison barnes from GS if he doesn't resign. They'd have to overpay but that would be a great fit with move Stanley to the 2.

Stanley at the 2, no thanks.

What do so many people have against Stanley as a 2?

[Cowology]

Kcp. This dude is supposed to be Detroits 6man. We can't have this skinny dude with no ball handle and no triple threat our starting shooting guard. Khris middleton is a bum when you look at every starting sg league round and he's better than kcp. Kcp doesnt bring any type of threat to oppsing players. All kcp does is chuck 3's and long 2s. He only drives to the basket in stride and cant faceup his defender to make a move. This messes up reggies flow because the sg is supposed to be able to mix it up with scoring and kcp is only looking to chuck jumpers. Alot of times when kcp gets the ball, you see him pass it back to reggie within 3 or 4 seconds of having the ball. Then reggie ends up waiting/over-dribbling for a p&r with couple seconds left on the clock

.

AGain you ignoring defense. KCP is our stopper and is assigned to the best player most nights. Playing good D is really quite exerting. What i do agree with is that he needs to be more assertive and imposing. KCP seems to be gettign what he wants when he's confident enough to try it. When he's not confident he dissappears. Rj's responsibility is to get players like him going(to a certain extent) i really think RJ has failed in that aspect of getting the offense going. I think most nights he's trying to get his first

Good stuff.

KCP is apparently 226th in the league in defensive real plus/minus.
http://espn.go.com/nba/statistics/rpm/_/page/6/sort/DRPM

He is obviously a great defender and better than 226th from an individual perspective, but with this stat measuring more from a team perspective, it does make you wonder how valuable his individual defense really is to the team.

Opponents shoot 41% FG against him which is awesome, but with so few superstars at the SG position anymore, how much of an effect does a shutdown SG actually have on an overall game today? (With most offenses primary scorers being at the other 4 positions)

In other words, if the average opposing SG is only taking a small % of his teams shots anyways, whether he makes 40% or 60% isn't making a big difference in the overall boxscore. Whereas if a PG gives up 40% or 60%, its going to make a huge difference on the game, with so many taking the bulk of their teams shots today, for example.

Drummond is 3rd in the league, and while he isn't as good of an individual defender as Pope, with Centers being so important to team defense (especially w/ rebounding), his overall effect on the defense ends up being greater than the better defending SG. Perhaps that is why KCP's score is so low, but ultimately team defense is most important, which makes me wonder if having a great defender at that position is even necessary today. Would opposing SGs be putting 25 on us every night if we just had an average defender there instead? I tend to think no, because most just don't score that much today no matter who is guarding them. So would we be better with a shooter/spacer there instead, even if only average defensively? I don't think it would have as much effect on our team defense as people think, but the improvement to the team offense with better spacing could result in a bigger point differential for the team overall.

[ImHeisenberg]

We are set at the 1, 2, 3 and 5 spots.

Set to accomplish what? Barely make the playoffs?

Drummond is the only untouchable in my opinion. Reggie is probably sticking around with his contract size, but KCP is a one way player, how many championships did Tony Allen win as a starter? And KCP is half the defender Allen was at his peak.

Not sure if you're referencing Morris or Johnson at the 3. Time will tell on Johnson, I think he could be a Jimmy Butler in a few years- I think all the parts are there, he just needs the experience. Morris is a bench player on a legit team.

This team is improving, as at least the pieces make sense, even if they're not exceptionally talented. But, we still have some huge strides to make to even be a middle of the pack playoff team.