RealGM

Science and the rest of the world is catching on to what we already know, dude is a FREAK with a capital FREAK.

http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/15292921/science-andre-drummond-explosive-athleticism

What Drummond has, and others near-300 pounders lack, is freakish athleticism that allows him to reach towering heights faster than anybody. But that's only the beginning of it. More to the point: What Drummond has worked to develop -- including terrific reaction time and elite neuroprocessing -- might be the most mechanically perfect body in the NBA

I've always thought his neuroprocessing was elite, glad everyone else is catching on.

This gives him zero excuse not to be elite on defense then.

mattao313 wrote:This gives him zero excuse not to be elite on defense then.

Science says he is elite on defense too, according to advanced stats.

Todd3 wrote:

mattao313 wrote:This gives him zero excuse not to be elite on defense then.

Science says he is elite on defense too, according to advanced stats.

Coach and I don't agree so who is right?

He might not be a defensive juggernaut all 4 quarters,but he does show flashes ,and shows he has the tools and instincts, just hasant put it together.Guarantee he could avg 4 blocks a game if he wanted and it wouldn't even be the big of feat for him and people would start saying he was one of the better centers in the game( even tho we all know blocks are a small part of it all).

I am not worried if he has the tools,only if he will developed his maturity and will for the game to become elite on that end of the floor.If he does,we will witness something special that has any been seen in some years.

mattao313 wrote:

Todd3 wrote:

mattao313 wrote:This gives him zero excuse not to be elite on defense then.

Science says he is elite on defense too, according to advanced stats.

Coach and I don't agree so who is right?

If you're talking about Stan, I've never heard him dispute those numbers, but even if he did I'd take with a grain of salt. He rarely calls any of his players elite because he wants them to keep striving for more.

Todd3 wrote:

mattao313 wrote:

Todd3 wrote:

Science says he is elite on defense too, according to advanced stats.

Coach and I don't agree so who is right?

If you're talking about Stan, I've never heard him dispute those numbers, but even if he did I'd take with a grain of salt. He rarely calls any of his players elite because he wants them to keep striving for more.

Stan always says he needs to on defense. Almost anyone who watches him regularly sees he needs to improve. If he was elite on defense this team would be elite defensively.

No stat can tell me he is elite on defense he has one great defensive skill which is rebounding other than that he is below average 1 on 1 and isnt a good rim protector. This shows that all these defensive stats aren't all that accurate.

mattao313 wrote:

Todd3 wrote:

mattao313 wrote:This gives him zero excuse not to be elite on defense then.

Science says he is elite on defense too, according to advanced stats.

Coach and I don't agree so who is right?

Science is a LIAR... sometimes!
[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VwLACpzGnFw[/youtube]

mattao313 wrote:

Todd3 wrote:

mattao313 wrote:Coach and I don't agree so who is right?

If you're talking about Stan, I've never heard him dispute those numbers, but even if he did I'd take with a grain of salt. He rarely calls any of his players elite because he wants them to keep striving for more.

Stan always says he needs to on defense. Almost anyone who watches him regularly sees he needs to improve. If he was elite on defense this team would be elite defensively.

No stat can tell me he is elite on defense he has one great defensive skill which is rebounding other than that he is below average 1 on 1 and isnt a good rim protector. This shows that all these defensive stats aren't all that accurate.

You can be elite at something and still have room for improvement. Where I think you're misinformed is your undervaluing of defensive rebounding and steals. 2 specific areas he is elite at that have a major effect on team defense, as he is literally ending the possession of the offense by himself, and doing so at an elite rate.

A team can force the opponent to 35% FG and still give up 110 pts because of poor rebounding. It matters a lot more than you are acknowledging. Steals are more valuable than blocks too, as not all blocks end possessions, but all steals do, and steals are more likely to lead to easy points at the other end in transition.

So even though he may only average 1.4 blocks, when you add in the 1.5 steals, he is one of only 5 players in the league with at least 1.4/1.5 in both (Draymond, Millsap, Noel, Cousins being the other 4).

When you add his league leading 10 defensive rpg, you get a clearer idea of just how elite he actually is. That's from raw stats too, not analytics.

Yes he has room to improve as an individual defender and rim protector, but that doesn't discredit how elite he is at the other aspects that still count just as much towards the ultimate purpose of defense - stopping the other team from scoring.

And for the record, the Pistons have been the 3rd best paint defense in the playoffs with Drummond as their rim protector - vs the team with best paint scorer in the league. So his rim protection is better than you're giving him credit for as well. However, we are 15th of 16 teams in DRTG because of our perimeter defense giving up 3s at a record pace. Which is partly due to Drummond's presence in the paint forcing them to move the ball to the perimeter.

Really hope they change the hack rule. Andre gets down on himself because he knows he's hurting the team. With that out of the way he'll be such a beast!

Since his rookie season I've thought that he was a freak, he's just so fast and so explosive, and so massive!!! He really could be Shaq-esque in his impact on the game. I just don't know if he's got the ability to master the little nuances of the game, the drop step, the foot work, the positioning, all the little things holding him back from dominating. It would be sweet if he could figure all that out, because there would be no one to check him in today's game.

Todd3 wrote:

mattao313 wrote:

Todd3 wrote:
If you're talking about Stan, I've never heard him dispute those numbers, but even if he did I'd take with a grain of salt. He rarely calls any of his players elite because he wants them to keep striving for more.

Stan always says he needs to on defense. Almost anyone who watches him regularly sees he needs to improve. If he was elite on defense this team would be elite defensively.

No stat can tell me he is elite on defense he has one great defensive skill which is rebounding other than that he is below average 1 on 1 and isnt a good rim protector. This shows that all these defensive stats aren't all that accurate.

You can be elite at something and still have room for improvement. Where I think you're misinformed is your undervaluing of defensive rebounding and steals. 2 specific areas he is elite at that have a major effect on team defense, as he is literally ending the possession of the offense by himself, and doing so at an elite rate.

A team can force the opponent to 35% FG and still give up 110 pts because of poor rebounding. It matters a lot more than you are acknowledging. Steals are more valuable than blocks too, as not all blocks end possessions, but all steals do, and steals are more likely to lead to easy points at the other end in transition.

So even though he may only average 1.4 blocks, when you add in the 1.5 steals, he is one of only 5 players in the league with at least 1.4/1.5 in both (Draymond, Millsap, Noel, Cousins being the other 4).

When you add his league leading 10 defensive rpg, you get a clearer idea of just how elite he actually is. That's from raw stats too, not analytics.

Yes he has room to improve as an individual defender and rim protector, but that doesn't discredit how elite he is at the other aspects that still count just as much towards the ultimate purpose of defense - stopping the other team from scoring.

And for the record, the Pistons have been the 3rd best paint defense in the playoffs with Drummond as their rim protector - vs the team with best paint scorer in the league. So his rim protection is better than you're giving him credit for as well. However, we are 15th of 16 teams in DRTG because of our perimeter defense giving up 3s at a record pace. Which is partly due to Drummond's presence in the paint forcing them to move the ball to the perimeter.

I really don't want to have this debate with you because its pointless, but forget the stats and answer this. When you watch Drummond you see a elite defensive player? I can't no matter how much I try to trick myself by looking at the stats.

**** penetration defense by wings = Andre having to play 2 v 1 80% of the time. That's why've we've been giving out so many o-boards lately.

What advanced stat has Drummond as an elite defender? I thought most stats labeled him as average or slightly above average (which I assume mostly has to do with his elite rebounding/steal rate). For example, ESPN's RPM has him as the 12 best defensive center.

how could he be that letarelly quick, but bad pick and roll defender

drummond is an elite defender? give me a break.

pistontr wrote:how could he be that letarelly quick, but bad pick and roll defender

What, you mean this isn't good p & r defense?

https://vine.co/v/iUW5X0AuUDX

His feet may be stuck in cement, but that elbow sure is quick.