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[bballnmike]

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[buzzkilloton]

The rap werent going anywhere with DDR. Now they get a shot at going to the finals and then possibly resigning Kiwi. Sure people say now Kiwi is going to the lakers but thats what they said about PG13. I fhey do lose him Lowrys gone soon and they can rebuild. Being stuck with DDR for the next 5 seasons wasnt good anyways. Great move for the raps they cant lose on it.

so instead of doing what they've been doing and doing well in the playoffs with that very average lineup... they fire the coach of the year cause they can't get past LeBron and once he leaves they blow the team up so they can rebuild?

no free agents are coming there..they never did. they were successful through the draft and got lucky a journeyman pg finally figured it out with the right coach. if I'm a raps fan I'm pissed that my team will be in the lottery for atleast 3 seasons if kawhi doesn't stay. this is literally a team lost and moving backwards in a way I've never seen before.

The raptors havent been doing well in the playoff. They've been a regular season team. They had one ECF final trips in a awful east with this core. Sure they win alot of reg season games but they never woudl actually compete with the elite teams in basketball in the post season. Lowry and DDR arent playoff players their regular season player. This has been proven for many many years.

2015 Lose in 1st round to wiz 4-0
2016 7game series vs the 7 seed pacers, 7 game series win vs the heat, lose 4-2 to the cavs
2017 4-2 bucks lose 4-0 cavs
2018 4-2 vs wiz get smoked by a bad cavs team 4-0. This same cavs team almost lost to a celtics team in a 7 game series who were without their 2 best players and had other injuries.

Its obv to everybody that the celtics are the team to beat in the east. They almost beat Lebron without their 2 best guys. This is a really young team whos core is going to get alot better while their two best players return from injury. No way the raptors could of competed with them without adding a guy like Kiwi. The sixers are also on the rise. Sitting around and trying to be a 3rd place team isnt what your competing for,

Masai is one of the best GMs in basketball. He realizes DDR and Lowry are getting older and will never win a title. This move gives them a shot at a player whos top 3 ITL if healthy. This gives them at least a one year title window which wasnt open before the trade. He may stay and if he doesnt they unload that huge DDR contract that gets them no where and can actually rebuild from the bottom up. Hes keeping them off the treadmill completely with this trade. This is what a smart GM does.

[coordinator0]

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[Son Goku 25]

Yeah. I think the Raptors had a massive payroll for a core that wasn’t a serious contender despite 59 wins, likely to be passed by Boston and Philly.

Best case: Kawhi puts them over the top and stays. Worst case: They get a leg up on a rebuild without Demar’s large contract

It’s a risk, but I don’t hate it.

If a fruitful trade with LA was feasible the Spurs would have done it. I find the assumption the Raptors plan is to flip him strange.

100%

[dVs33]

Jennings just got waived. I don't know if he could ever replicate how he was playing on that great run he had here, but I'd like to give him another shot here.

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[MotownMadness]

Jennings just got waived. I don't know if he could ever replicate how he was playing on that great run he had here, but I'd like to give him another shot here.

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I don’t think he has it in him to play at the NBA level anymore.

[dVs33]

Jennings just got waived. I don't know if he could ever replicate how he was playing on that great run he had here, but I'd like to give him another shot here.

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I don’t think he has it in him to play at the NBA level anymore.

You're probably right. Its a shame because that small run was the most fun I've had as a pistons fan in a very long time

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[Canadafan]

Jennings just got waived. I don't know if he could ever replicate how he was playing on that great run he had here, but I'd like to give him another shot here.

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I'd do it. Have Jennings and Calderon as our backups. Allows us to use the expiring of Ish along with our amazing young promising players of Luke, Henry, Stanley and Bullock to trade for Jimmy Butler! Oh wait I forgot I retired from trade ideas

[dVs33]

Terrico white has signed in Australia haha I'll have to check him out when he comes to Melbourne. See if he looks any good.

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[djsunyc]

The rap werent going anywhere with DDR. Now they get a shot at going to the finals and then possibly resigning Kiwi. Sure people say now Kiwi is going to the lakers but thats what they said about PG13. I fhey do lose him Lowrys gone soon and they can rebuild. Being stuck with DDR for the next 5 seasons wasnt good anyways. Great move for the raps they cant lose on it.

so instead of doing what they've been doing and doing well in the playoffs with that very average lineup... they fire the coach of the year cause they can't get past LeBron and once he leaves they blow the team up so they can rebuild?

no free agents are coming there..they never did. they were successful through the draft and got lucky a journeyman pg finally figured it out with the right coach. if I'm a raps fan I'm pissed that my team will be in the lottery for atleast 3 seasons if kawhi doesn't stay. this is literally a team lost and moving backwards in a way I've never seen before.

The raptors havent been doing well in the playoff. They've been a regular season team. They had one ECF final trips in a awful east with this core. Sure they win alot of reg season games but they never woudl actually compete with the elite teams in basketball in the post season. Lowry and DDR arent playoff players their regular season player. This has been proven for many many years.

2015 Lose in 1st round to wiz 4-0
2016 7game series vs the 7 seed pacers, 7 game series win vs the heat, lose 4-2 to the cavs
2017 4-2 bucks lose 4-0 cavs
2018 4-2 vs wiz get smoked by a bad cavs team 4-0. This same cavs team almost lost to a celtics team in a 7 game series who were without their 2 best players and had other injuries.

Its obv to everybody that the celtics are the team to beat in the east. They almost beat Lebron without their 2 best guys. This is a really young team whos core is going to get alot better while their two best players return from injury. No way the raptors could of competed with them without adding a guy like Kiwi. The sixers are also on the rise. Sitting around and trying to be a 3rd place team isnt what your competing for,

Masai is one of the best GMs in basketball. He realizes DDR and Lowry are getting older and will never win a title. This move gives them a shot at a player whos top 3 ITL if healthy. This gives them at least a one year title window which wasnt open before the trade. He may stay and if he doesnt they unload that huge DDR contract that gets them no where and can actually rebuild from the bottom up. Hes keeping them off the treadmill completely with this trade. This is what a smart GM does.

i'm a raptor fan that believes the deal is a no-lose one for us b/c we have 2 paths we can possibly go after this season and either path is perfectly fine.

as for dd, he was absolutely garbage in the playoffs.

regular season net rtg / playoff net rtg

14/15: 2.6/-19.2 = -21.8
15/16: 3.0/-8.3 = -11.3
16/17: 3.3/-10.6 = -13.9
17:18: 6.9/-7.0 = -13.9

a huge drop off in production. so it really depends on how much you value the regular season vs. the playoffs.

and here's kyle's to show he's been bad in the playoffs as well:

14/15: 3.0/-12.3 = -15.3
15/16: 6.0/-0.7 = -6.7
16/17: 8.2/-1.9 = -10.1
17:18: 7.5/-0.7 = -8.2

but kyle's net playoff rtg with derozan on/off:

14/15: -12.3/-13.5
15/16: -1.9/3.3
16/17: -5.2/8.6
17/18: -3.8/16.7

so if you want to argue that kyle could be a better playoff performer w/o derozan, there would be stats to back it up.

[Invictus88]

I don't have a big issue with trading DD. As djsunyc mentions, the Raptors truly were at a crossroads: try to remain in contention despite lack of playoff success or rebuild.

However, I just don't think they got the right return. A move for Kawhi (especially one including future picks) is a step towards contention and away from a rebuild.

The rebuild path would have entailed trading Derozan for a younger prospect with less development but high potential -- or for a first round pick which is basically the same thing.

Losing Kawhi in a year to the Lakers (which all behavior up to now points to) basically means the Raptors divert again to Rebuilding mode next year instead of now; but with a lot less tools to work with.

The 1st you would net from DD plus either the first you dealt or 2 second rounders is a big difference.

Also, I don't take much stock in the good reports of Kawhi meeting with Raptors staff. These happened after the trade was complete when Kawhi had escaped the Spurs and can see the light at the end of the tunnel. There's no reason for him whatsoever to rock the boat now and jeopardize next season's plans.

[Kilo]

Minnesota wants to use Butler deal to get rid of Dieng three more years (including this one). I think LAC look likely if that is the case and the Minnesota owner wants to move Butler now.

Butler
Dieng

for

Harris (expiring, turned down $18M/season)
Gortat
Robinson (#13th overall in past draft)

[Freakyman]

"Big Ben" mix

Watch on YouTube

[lebron stopper]

I don't have a big issue with trading DD. As djsunyc mentions, the Raptors truly were at a crossroads: try to remain in contention despite lack of playoff success or rebuild.

However, I just don't think they got the right return. A move for Kawhi (especially one including future picks) is a step towards contention and away from a rebuild.

The rebuild path would have entailed trading Derozan for a younger prospect with less development but high potential -- or for a first round pick which is basically the same thing.

Losing Kawhi in a year to the Lakers (which all behavior up to now points to) basically means the Raptors divert again to Rebuilding mode next year instead of now; but with a lot less tools to work with.

The 1st you would net from DD plus either the first you dealt or 2 second rounders is a big difference.

Also, I don't take much stock in the good reports of Kawhi meeting with Raptors staff. These happened after the trade was complete when Kawhi had escaped the Spurs and can see the light at the end of the tunnel. There's no reason for him whatsoever to rock the boat now and jeopardize next season's plans.

I always ask people what legitimate/high-end prospects and picks the Raptors could have gotten for DeRozan (a ball-dominant guard who can't shoot threes, defend, or even play off the ball). Like, which team was willing to give up really good or high-potential young guys for DeRozan?

No one has been able to give me a satisfactory answer to that question.

[Invictus88]

I don't have a big issue with trading DD. As djsunyc mentions, the Raptors truly were at a crossroads: try to remain in contention despite lack of playoff success or rebuild.

However, I just don't think they got the right return. A move for Kawhi (especially one including future picks) is a step towards contention and away from a rebuild.

The rebuild path would have entailed trading Derozan for a younger prospect with less development but high potential -- or for a first round pick which is basically the same thing.

Losing Kawhi in a year to the Lakers (which all behavior up to now points to) basically means the Raptors divert again to Rebuilding mode next year instead of now; but with a lot less tools to work with.

The 1st you would net from DD plus either the first you dealt or 2 second rounders is a big difference.

Also, I don't take much stock in the good reports of Kawhi meeting with Raptors staff. These happened after the trade was complete when Kawhi had escaped the Spurs and can see the light at the end of the tunnel. There's no reason for him whatsoever to rock the boat now and jeopardize next season's plans.

I always ask people what legitimate/high-end prospects and picks the Raptors could have gotten for DeRozan (a ball-dominant guard who can't shoot threes, defend, or even play off the ball). Like, which team was willing to give up really good or high-potential young guys for DeRozan?

No one has been able to give me a satisfactory answer to that question.

Well yeah. And you never will. Because none of us are in an NBA front office.

Here's an ESPN article for you though that mentions 4 different hypothetical returns -- 3 containing firsts and the 4th with Kawhi: http://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/23445260/four-toronto-raptors-trades-see-demar-derozan-more-nba It took me all but 2 minutes to Google to find it.

If Kawhi leaves you effectively just did a salary dump for him. Nothing else. Do you really think that DD's value is so low where a salary dump is a justifiable return?

[rmfc]

Season opener - Celtics vs 76ers:
Man, these two teams have so much top, young talent on tier respective rosters. Just amazing.

[vege]

Malik Monk is looking good since summer league, Luke didn't play in summer league but he is looking kinda the same, an efficient low volume/passive shooter

[ElectricMayhem]

Watch on YouTube

Doc said he dominates during scrimmages and that he's going to get regular minutes this year. He's deserved it for a long time. He was great for us whenever SVG played him. But then he would be stapled back to the bench for a month. Go get 'em, Boban.

[MrBigShot]

No surprise that Boban is receiving praise from Doc, he is legitimately skilled and although he poses some problems for his team defensively he poses problems for the opposing team as well.

[DETermination]

KCP with 5 points in 27 minutes in the Lakers loss to the Blazers