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Andre's Improvement

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Andre's Improvement 

Post#1 » by Blkbrd671 » Mon Nov 7, 2016 1:11 am

So was watching some game film and noticed a couple things we really didn't see a lot last year from Dre, or should i say consistently on a possession basis. I mentioned that i don't think i've seen Dre be this locked in for that long period of a time in game. Other observations as follows.

1.) Probably the most obvious is that Dre's ability to put the ball on the floor has improved in that ,for now, it normally results in a positive play as no center has the first step and size dre does. The biggest difference is Dre seems to be in control, particularly with his spin move, he also has a Dream Shake that i think he'll slowly bring out or develop. I think he's put the ball on the floor more times this season than his past season's combined. Its a net positive play for now because

2.) Dre seems to at least make 1 of 2 free throws. Which has a large part to do with his confidence going back to the same move. He is rewarded and when Dre thinks he's doing good and confident, he becomes a dominant player.

3.) Rebounding wise, the biggest difference i see is his positioning, he's fighting for it every time. Allowing him to rebound the ball a lot easier, prior years he almost goes over the back, and tips the ball to himself, through the first games of the season he's between his man and the rim, leaving there no chance .

4.) Defensively he's actually contesting shots and making use of his quick hands. Any guard with a lose handle hates Dre in the PnR as he has a knack for poke aways. He's also actually altering shots and contesting without fouling. honestly, i have no clue what the difference between Dre contesting in the air last season and this season, but for whatever reason, they aren't calling him for fouls.

5.) An area where i don't think gets a lot of attention but makes a dramatic impact is setting picks. Dre in seasons past sets lazy a* , piece of sh* picks. The only reason it had any success is because Dre rolling to the rim regardless of any pick draws attention. This season, he's making a effort to get out and actually pick off the defender before rolling letting the player with the ball free and forcing the defense to react and pick whom to leave open. When they cover the roll man and ball properly it leaves our shooters open, and our team has seemed to recognize that and find the shooters.

Its a small sample size, but it encouraging to see the development in these areas as it is steps to him becoming elite consistently. While we like to focus on the "fun stats" like points and rebounds, these improvements are just as if not more important to the team
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Re: Andre's Improvement 

Post#2 » by DBC10 » Mon Nov 7, 2016 1:17 am

I really wish Dre had a small baseline jumper to accommodate his potential for a face up game. His face up game looks natural, driving like a PF, he'd have even more to work with if he had a semblance of an outside shot.

As for the defense, he's starting to use his size and wingspan intellectually. He's using verticality to contest shots instead of reaching go for fancy blocks all of which are good on the stat sheet, but suck for overall team defense. I'm loving the effort in his verticality abilities, he's starting to look like prime Hibbert (before the implosion).

Hopefully his mental make up can be sustained though. I really don't want a repeat of the Nets game, which was mostly nothing good could be taken from there.
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Re: Andre's Improvement 

Post#3 » by Liqourish » Mon Nov 7, 2016 1:20 am

Excellent post. Unfortunately, I think it'll fall on alot of deaf ears since people perceive him as a player that "pouts" and "has no heart". Therefore they will not acknowledge his growth.

People forget Dre just turned 23 yrs old. Let me repeat, he just turned 23 yrs old. He will be 23 this entire season. And he's putting up comparable numbers to guys 4/5 years older than him. He hasn't even entered his prime yet and he's expanding his game so much in such a short time. His footwork has improved. His strength as improved. He's added his left hand in the post. His free throw form is consistent for the very first time in his career. He's at 49% right now. Once he sees consistency with it, it'll go up, I'm sure.

If we can get Reggie in there and set up Andre for some offensive possessions, it seems to get him going defensively. With shooting 50+% at the charity stripe, he could average 18/16 this season. At just 23 yrs old. The same age as some of these 2nd year players.
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Re: Andre's Improvement 

Post#4 » by MotownMadness » Mon Nov 7, 2016 1:26 am

Drummond is capable of being one of the most impactful players in the league. It's just a matter if he wants to give it his all every night. Even defensively he should be awesome. He seemed to acknowledge after the game yesterday how he can't let his effort get like that Brooklyn game again. He's so young though but once he breaks that wall of coming out everynight overpowering his opponents the way he can the sky is the limit.
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Re: Andre's Improvement 

Post#5 » by Blkbrd671 » Mon Nov 7, 2016 1:44 am

DBC10 wrote:I really wish Dre had a small baseline jumper to accommodate his potential for a face up game. His face up game looks natural, driving like a PF, he'd have even more to work with if he had a semblance of an outside shot.


honestly its not entirely out of the realm of reach. Dre's got a nice touch on his shots and he's shown some floaters in season past. A floater is essentially a shot with just one hand. If dre can develop almost like a JEfferson type shot based on that floater motion, goign to be really hard for defenses. I think once his footwork becomes second nature, SVG will try to work in some face up offense.

As for the defense, he's starting to use his size and wingspan intellectually. He's using verticality to contest shots instead of reaching go for fancy blocks all of which are good on the stat sheet, but suck for overall team defense. I'm loving the effort in his verticality abilities, he's starting to look like prime Hibbert (before the implosion).

Hopefully his mental make up can be sustained though. I really don't want a repeat of the Nets game, which was mostly nothing good could be taken from there.


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Re: Andre's Improvement 

Post#6 » by Blkbrd671 » Mon Nov 7, 2016 1:46 am

Liqourish wrote:Excellent post. Unfortunately, I think it'll fall on alot of deaf ears since people perceive him as a player that "pouts" and "has no heart". Therefore they will not acknowledge his growth.

People forget Dre just turned 23 yrs old. Let me repeat, he just turned 23 yrs old. He will be 23 this entire season. And he's putting up comparable numbers to guys 4/5 years older than him. He hasn't even entered his prime yet and he's expanding his game so much in such a short time. His footwork has improved. His strength as improved. He's added his left hand in the post. His free throw form is consistent for the very first time in his career. He's at 49% right now. Once he sees consistency with it, it'll go up, I'm sure.

If we can get Reggie in there and set up Andre for some offensive possessions, it seems to get him going defensively. With shooting 50+% at the charity stripe, he could average 18/16 this season. At just 23 yrs old. The same age as some of these 2nd year players.


His footwork is so much cleaner and controlled. He actually looks leaner but plays a lot stronger, and he does not get enough credit for the development of his left hand. Think about how different yesterdays game would have been if dre went 1-4 from the stride in those first possessions. I think his ability to make em impacts his game and out teams momentum more than we care to admit
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Re: Andre's Improvement 

Post#7 » by Blkbrd671 » Mon Nov 7, 2016 1:48 am

MotownMadness wrote:Drummond is capable of being one of the most impactful players in the league. It's just a matter if he wants to give it his all every night. Even defensively he should be awesome. He seemed to acknowledge after the game yesterday how he can't let his effort get like that Brooklyn game again. He's so young though but once he breaks that wall of coming out everynight overpowering his opponents the way he can the sky is the limit.


SVG mentioned that he told the players something to the effect "Whatever you did to get ready for this game and come out ready to play the way you did, remember that feeling , that preperation because that is what you need to bring every night if you really want to win".


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Re: Andre's Improvement 

Post#8 » by MotownMadness » Mon Nov 7, 2016 1:51 am

Thing with Drummond is his real basketball journey of learning the game has started with SVG. From highschool through college and even his first couple seasons in the NBA he's gotten away with just playing off of his size and athleticism. His instincts defensively have always been to reach for a steal or try and block everything. Now he's starting to learn how to play basketball. He's learning to pass, defend and spread his offense out from what used to be dunking. He was just so raw when we got him and has actually come along way since drafting him.
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Re: Andre's Improvement 

Post#9 » by mattao313 » Mon Nov 7, 2016 1:59 am

Eh the only thing I see improvement in is maybe his rim protection and FT. Post game looks the same, same inconsistent play, and a clear drop in offensive rebounds.
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Re: Andre's Improvement 

Post#10 » by Blkbrd671 » Mon Nov 7, 2016 2:13 am

MotownMadness wrote:Thing with Drummond is his real basketball journey of learning the game has started with SVG. From highschool through college and even his first couple seasons in the NBA he's gotten away with just playing off of his size and athleticism. His instincts defensively have always been to reach for a steal or try and block everything. Now he's starting to learn how to play basketball. He's learning to pass, defend and spread his offense out from what used to be dunking. He was just so raw when we got him and has actually come along way since drafting him.


i think there is no better evidence of that then when he snuffed out the play against denver that lead to his FB dunk. That was pure recognition of what the other team was trying to do. He also did a much better job of cutting off the passing lanes or making the pass difficult which he normally doesn't do.
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Re: Andre's Improvement 

Post#11 » by Pharaoh » Mon Nov 7, 2016 2:39 am

I think the game is startiny to become more mental than physical for him now, which is natural after a few years in the league.

Physically we all know he can do but SVG is far more interested in what he can become.

We're gonna see nights where we force feed him in the post even when it's not working. We're gonna see **** games on D too

But those are part of the process, part of developing him to be more than just an athletic freak.

As blkbrd mentioned you see subtle differences in a lot of his game & long term that's great for the team

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Re: Andre's Improvement 

Post#12 » by BadMofoPimp » Mon Nov 7, 2016 3:35 pm

DBC10 wrote:I really wish Dre had a small baseline jumper to accommodate his potential for a face up game. His face up game looks natural, driving like a PF, he'd have even more to work with if he had a semblance of an outside shot.

As for the defense, he's starting to use his size and wingspan intellectually. He's using verticality to contest shots instead of reaching go for fancy blocks all of which are good on the stat sheet, but suck for overall team defense. I'm loving the effort in his verticality abilities, he's starting to look like prime Hibbert (before the implosion).

Hopefully his mental make up can be sustained though. I really don't want a repeat of the Nets game, which was mostly nothing good could be taken from there.


Dwight had virtual no offensive game as well and was still able to be one of the most dominate players in the league. Same with Ben Wallace. I reckon Dre will be unique in his own level of domination.
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Re: Andre's Improvement 

Post#13 » by El Chivo » Wed Nov 30, 2016 1:33 pm

Read on Twitter
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Re: Andre's Improvement 

Post#14 » by zeebneeb » Wed Nov 30, 2016 1:58 pm

El Chivo wrote:
Read on Twitter
Shallow assesment at best. Andre has, learned to play off his PG(reggie) and him having to play with Ish has changed the game for him.

This does not change the fact that his defensive awareness is much better this year, and the things he has added take time to fit properly.

Im going to take a wild stab at this and believe this will be a minor footnote no one will remember by the end of the season as Reggie will be back. Ill keep track of this "stat" and see how it does when reggie gets back.

Also notice how this qoute has two seperate things.

Development-team better without him

That should be a sign its crap right there.
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Re: Andre's Improvement 

Post#15 » by MotownMadness » Wed Nov 30, 2016 1:58 pm

El Chivo wrote:
Read on Twitter

He's just gone stupid or something with thinking he's a offensive player and taking nights off defensively. It's not really a development thing as he's still one of the best players in the league when engaged it's just he's hardly ever engaged and playing to strengths now.
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Re: Andre's Improvement 

Post#16 » by JohnReese » Wed Nov 30, 2016 2:41 pm

The biggest problem is his IQ. He is dumb as hell and he doesn't realize.
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Re: RE: Re: Andre's Improvement 

Post#17 » by Pharaoh » Wed Nov 30, 2016 3:21 pm

MotownMadness wrote:
El Chivo wrote:
Read on Twitter

He's just gone stupid or something with thinking he's a offensive player and taking nights off defensively. It's not really a development thing as he's still one of the best players in the league when engaged it's just he's hardly ever engaged and playing to strengths now.


Does that stem from not having RJ?

How much of Dre's offensive struggles can we pin on the system with Ish and not RJ?

You see all kinds of subtle improvements with Dre:

1 - post ups. He has nights he struggles and shoots stupid **** but he's much better at getting position this year

2 - defensively he's improved by going straight up as opposed to just trying to swat everything into the 10th row.

3 - I believe him sagging into the paint on PnRs is a directive that's come from SVG. A ton of teams defend the PnR this way! The thinking behind it is "it's better to give up a long 2 or a 3 than a lay up or dunk"

People don't realise that by sagging into the paint and stopping penetration also means your corner defenders don't help on that drive so the opposing PG can't dish for a corner 3!

THAT is why you sag on PnRs!

It seems a lot of people view things in a vacuum - it's 5 man chess out there and one more leads to another which leads to another

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Re: RE: Re: Andre's Improvement 

Post#18 » by In SVG We Trust » Wed Nov 30, 2016 3:50 pm

Pharaoh wrote:THAT is why you sag on PnRs!

You sag because you're not good enough defender to stay in front of your man and deny the drive.
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Re: Andre's Improvement 

Post#19 » by MrBigShot » Thu Dec 1, 2016 12:33 am

I seem to remember Dre being incredibly impressive in the low post at the very end of his 3rd season. He looked really comfortable, and even though he was mostly using the jump hook to score he was very patient and started to learn how to use his strength to create space for himself.

Since then he's really regressed in that regard, not really sure why. I feel like he may end up remaining a garbage man & pick and roll finisher mostly, only posting up when he gets super deep position.
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Re: Andre's Improvement 

Post#20 » by JD43320 » Thu Dec 1, 2016 12:40 am

His focus on post ups has hurt his offensive rebounding. If he gets decent position but doesn't get the ball he completely gives up on the play.

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