RealGM

Posted: **Wed Jan 25, 2017 12:34 am**

Are Tobias KCP and Leuer? Andre our best defensive player but worst offensive player?

Posted: **Wed Jan 25, 2017 12:36 am**

How are calculated those metrics?

Posted: **Wed Jan 25, 2017 12:38 am**

So, most of the team leands in the bad offense/bad defense. No surprise there. According to this, KCP is the closest thing we have to a franchise player.

Posted: **Wed Jan 25, 2017 6:04 pm**

That graph actually seems fairly accurate, albeit with Drummond's high defensive placement being fool's gold of course.

Posted: **Wed Jan 25, 2017 6:21 pm**

I don't need a graph to tell me that, I think that's been pretty obvious. Cool visualization though

Posted: **Wed Jan 25, 2017 6:32 pm**

I don''t see how the Boban is considered a below-average offensive player.

Posted: **Wed Jan 25, 2017 6:38 pm**

Do the metrics consider the skill level of the players or team the player is competing against? Because, I am sure some players who are on the court playing against another teams best player is not going to have the same fair metrics against a player who plays 10-15mpg against opposing teams 2nd or 3rd unit scrubs.

Posted: **Wed Jan 25, 2017 7:03 pm**

Here's the original Tweet for that graph:

Read on Twitter

And here's how the TPA values are calculated:

http://nbamath.com/tpa-model/

For what it's worth:

Read on Twitter

Posted: **Wed Jan 25, 2017 8:10 pm**

When you tell me that the Cavaliers are bad at both offense and defense i want to question the graph but also this is my first time seeing a tpa or whatever it is called.

Posted: **Wed Jan 25, 2017 8:23 pm**

Another ridiculous metric. I would only trust defensive metrics when it doesn't count blocks, rebounds and steals.

Posted: **Wed Jan 25, 2017 8:53 pm**

In SVG We Trust wrote:Another ridiculous metric. I would only trust defensive metrics when it doesn't count blocks, rebounds and steals.

Yeah, a lot of defensive metrics are flawed and there isn't really a good way to make them better. Here's a good description for box plus/minus which TPA is derived from:

http://www.basketball-reference.com/about/bpm.html

There are limitations on all box score stats – if the box score doesn't measure a particular contribution, a box-score-based metric can only approximate that contribution. This is not a great hindrance on the offensive side, as nearly everything of importance on offense is captured by the box score (only missing things like screen-setting), but on defense the box score is quite limited. Blocks, steals, and rebounds, along with minutes and what little information offensive numbers yield about defensive performance are all that is available. Such critical components of defense as positioning, communication, and the other factors that make Kevin Garnett and Tim Duncan elite on defense can't be captured, unfortunately.

What does this mean? Box Plus/Minus is good at measuring offense and solid overall, but the defensive numbers in particular should not be considered definitive. Look at the defensive values as a guide, but don't hesitate to discount them when a player is well known as a good or bad defender.

And defensive rating isn't much better.

Posted: **Wed Jan 25, 2017 9:12 pm**

I have been reminded repeatedly that Marcus Morris is a good defender. Um... where's he at?

RealGM

So does this graph mean our 3 best players....

So does this graph mean our 3 best players....

Re: So does this graph mean our 3 best players....

Re: So does this graph mean our 3 best players....

Re: So does this graph mean our 3 best players....

Re: So does this graph mean our 3 best players....

Re: So does this graph mean our 3 best players....

Re: So does this graph mean our 3 best players....

Re: So does this graph mean our 3 best players....

Re: So does this graph mean our 3 best players....

Re: So does this graph mean our 3 best players....

Re: So does this graph mean our 3 best players....

Re: So does this graph mean our 3 best players....