We have zero direction

[Han Solo]

Pistons need to breathe some life into this team. Blake Griffin is playing twice as good as any of us thought he would. If we are choosing to keep him, trading Drummond right now is a must because they don’t work together. The Drummond era is over. He was exciting and I still think he will be very good somewhere else. I’d bet the farm he’d have success with another team. His time here is just over. We can get something to make our team work now with Blake.

Or.. we trade Blake and Drummond and tear it down completely. Something I can’t see Gores doing. The truth is, Blake is a legit star. Something we haven’t had in a long time. I’d be fine trying to put a team around him, but it has to happen now. While there is still time to get into the playoffs as a 5-7 seed.

[DETermination]

Haven't had a direction for the past decade

[Spider156]

The only direction we have is gambling at this point. Seeing the Nets are sitting at the 6th spot, I don't believe in tanking. They haven't had a pick in 3 years lol. I believe in tanking for one year for a sure star player. Past that and you've developed a losing environment. We have a bunch of losers on the team. Blake is the only winner on the roster. Why get rid of the only winner? Because he's getting paid? He deserves it. I believe Gores understands everyone should be on the trading block. I believe he'll keep Blake for another 2 years trying to build around him. I think Drummond is closer to leaving the team than we think, I'm hoping this is the case. We don't have a direction, even if we tanked. I'm waiting for Malik Rose to take over. He's the only one left we have hope for. Outside of him and possibly Casey, we're gonna need a new owner. Owner has already made 5x on the team. I'm not sure if he'd sell the team. He IS paying so I can't blame him. This is going to take a lot of patience ladies and gentlemen.

[Manocad]

This isn't a case of zero direction. This is a case of bad direction coupled with bad player evaluation.

[7r5ur]

Tear it down. We are not in any position to assemble a team from scratch around well-into-prime Blake. We do not have the assets or the financial flexibility.

It’s time to get a long-term asset while you can for Blake (and Dre).

[vege]

We have a direction, we just been having terrible people trying to execute that direction. We've been having issues with PG injuries the past 3 seasons. SVG signed Galloway to an absurd contract to fix that issue (yeah I wish this was a joke but SVG signed Galloway because in his head Galloway could play PG if Reggie get injured) and this FO signed Calderon and they said they would be comfortable if Calderon needed to play substantial minutes.

Our FO is a complete joke. They're hiding and blaming the last FO so they can cash their salaries for 1 extra year, but they're bad.

[DTP]

I'm not sure how anyone can say that the Dre/Griffin pairing hasn't and won't work....those two guys actually seem to be fine and that specific pairing has worked way better than anyone could have expected it. The issue is the roster completely sucks outside of those two. The main problem is you have a coaching staff that can't put their players in the best position to succeed....a sign of a great coach is adjusting their "system" to the personnel but instead Casey tries to make the personnel adjust to his "system" and it hasnt worked at all. On top of that, your perimeter talent absolutely sucks. No one on the team has trade value at all and your point guard is no longer a starting quality guard anymore, not that his head coach has done any favors for him at all this season.

For the first time ever I am actually on board with tearing it down completely. Valenti kinda sold me on there are tons of teams that will have cap space this summer and when teams miss out on Durant and Leonard, there absolutely will be someone willing to take on Griffin as long as he can remain healthy the rest of this season and keep playing the way he has. Need to go into asset protection mode right now and make the focus keeping him healthy....I'm even fine with a couple more Rest DNPs. Deal Blake and deal Dre. If you can draft a point guard, I'm even okay with swallowing Jackson's salary for a year and just waiving him. Suck it up next year but there at least has to be someone that we're developing....someone that this fan base can believe in. Tear it down because your head coach cant do anything with this roster.

[Spider156]

We have a direction, we just been having terrible people trying to execute that direction. We've been having issues with PG injuries the past 3 seasons. SVG signed Galloway to an absurd contract to fix that issue (yeah I wish this was a joke but SVG signed Galloway because in his head Galloway could play PG if Reggie get injured) and this FO signed Calderon and they said they would be comfortable if Calderon needed to play substantial minutes.

Our FO is a complete joke. They're hiding and blaming the last FO so they can cash their salaries for 1 extra year, but they're bad.

I agree. This FO can't get called bad because they haven't made a move which is bad. But has anyone in the league made a trade yet? Their moves have been Casey, Zaza, Robinson, Brown, Thomas, and Calderon. Two of those players have been good role players, coach is still coaching. No trades have been made. Basically they're sitting on their hands because our cap situation sucks. Next offseason we'll be much better positioned. I say we keep tanking just the way we have been.

[DTP]

We have a direction, we just been having terrible people trying to execute that direction. We've been having issues with PG injuries the past 3 seasons. SVG signed Galloway to an absurd contract to fix that issue (yeah I wish this was a joke but SVG signed Galloway because in his head Galloway could play PG if Reggie get injured) and this FO signed Calderon and they said they would be comfortable if Calderon needed to play substantial minutes.

Our FO is a complete joke. They're hiding and blaming the last FO so they can cash their salaries for 1 extra year, but they're bad.

I agree. This FO can't get called bad because they haven't made a move which is bad. But has anyone in the league made a trade yet? Their moves have been Casey, Zaza, Robinson, Brown, Thomas, and Calderon. Two of those players have been good role players, coach is still coaching. No trades have been made. Basically they're sitting on their hands because our cap situation sucks. Next offseason we'll be much better positioned. I say we keep tanking just the way we have been.

If they're going to keep tanking like this, they better go get something for Ish. I'm okay with keeping Bullock if you can't get a FRP (which I doubt any team is giving up one for Ish & Bullock), because Bullock would be a nice piece to keep around next year regardless of the direction. Not trying to spend $6-8M to re-sign a 31 year old Ish Smith....just wont fit the timeline.

[Spider156]

I'm not sure how anyone can say that the Dre/Griffin pairing hasn't and won't work....those two guys actually seem to be fine and that specific pairing has worked way better than anyone could have expected it. The issue is the roster completely sucks outside of those two. The main problem is you have a coaching staff that can't put their players in the best position to succeed....a sign of a great coach is adjusting their "system" to the personnel but instead Casey tries to make the personnel adjust to his "system" and it hasnt worked at all. On top of that, your perimeter talent absolutely sucks. No one on the team has trade value at all and your point guard is no longer a starting quality guard anymore, not that his head coach has done any favors for him at all this season.

For the first time ever I am actually on board with tearing it down completely. Valenti kinda sold me on there are tons of teams that will have cap space this summer and when teams miss out on Durant and Leonard, there absolutely will be someone willing to take on Griffin as long as he can remain healthy the rest of this season and keep playing the way he has. Need to go into asset protection mode right now and make the focus keeping him healthy....I'm even fine with a couple more Rest DNPs. Deal Blake and deal Dre. If you can draft a point guard, I'm even okay with swallowing Jackson's salary for a year and just waiving him. Suck it up next year but there at least has to be someone that we're developing....someone that this fan base can believe in. Tear it down because your head coach cant do anything with this roster.

It's really hard to assess NBA teams anymore. I don't believe there's any right way to build a team. The only way is to get as much talent as possible on GOOD contracts. That's the key. Whether drafting, trading, signing. Whoever you're getting needs to be a good contract. Because when the Nets are above 500, don't you scratch your head over that? They haven't had a pick in 3 years. It tells you you don't need to tank. Pacers never tanked. Not even Bucks. Parker is the only player they tanked for and he's the only player that left the team. If we tank, we need to do it for one player only. The reason I want Drummond gone now is because he's peaking. This is the best we'll ever see him. In two years his legs are gonna slow down and he'll get out of the league as quickly as Hibbert did. So flip him! Here's what we need to do in my opinion. Trade Smith and Drummond. Why? Smith gets us wins, he needs to go so we can tank for Barrett. Drummond is at the peak of his career, he's done in Detroit. He talks, walks, and plays like a loser. He needs to gtfo. I like Smith but I think he's gonna give us wins. I like Bullock, I'd resign him but he can get us a first round pick from a team like Utah or Philly. I don't like Jackson but his contract is gonna be looking great next offseason, same with leuer and galloway.

[chrbal]

I feel like the problem is you have practically two plans going on. Gores Drummond and R.J. vs Griffin Casey and such. 1st group is ok with just showing up and hoping for any playoffs. Not even winning just making the playoffs. 2nd group wants actual improvement. We aren’t going anywhere until real changes are made

[DBC10]

I'm not sure how anyone can say that the Dre/Griffin pairing hasn't and won't work....those two guys actually seem to be fine and that specific pairing has worked way better than anyone could have expected it. The issue is the roster completely sucks outside of those two. The main problem is you have a coaching staff that can't put their players in the best position to succeed....a sign of a great coach is adjusting their "system" to the personnel but instead Casey tries to make the personnel adjust to his "system" and it hasnt worked at all. On top of that, your perimeter talent absolutely sucks. No one on the team has trade value at all and your point guard is no longer a starting quality guard anymore, not that his head coach has done any favors for him at all this season.

For the first time ever I am actually on board with tearing it down completely. Valenti kinda sold me on there are tons of teams that will have cap space this summer and when teams miss out on Durant and Leonard, there absolutely will be someone willing to take on Griffin as long as he can remain healthy the rest of this season and keep playing the way he has. Need to go into asset protection mode right now and make the focus keeping him healthy....I'm even fine with a couple more Rest DNPs. Deal Blake and deal Dre. If you can draft a point guard, I'm even okay with swallowing Jackson's salary for a year and just waiving him. Suck it up next year but there at least has to be someone that we're developing....someone that this fan base can believe in. Tear it down because your head coach cant do anything with this roster.

Drummond and Griffin pairing doesn't work because there's something just off about the two of them sharing the floor. There's no spacing, and Dre doesn't play off pnRs with Griffin all that well as you expect he should. I think Zach Lowe mentioned our fit issues as well. That and Griffin's talents and floor spacing ability would be maximized with a center that can shoot like Embiid or Vucevic. I'm almost in favor of trading for Marc Gasol, since he'll almost be an expiring next year depending on that player option and he still has life left in him.

But I agree with tearing it down. Blake Griffin has value around the league now I believe, and a desperate play off team will make inquiries about him sooner rather than later. Someone like POR, Charlotte, the Knicks if they luck out on FAs, SAC, maybe even OKC, etc etc. HOU somehow is a dark horse among them too because Morey needs a third star.

I think I'd rather deal BG sooner than later because he's going to become disgruntled if we continue like this and just request a trade thereby his value plummeting. Once Kawhi and A. Davis make their decisions next off season, all eyes will be on BG and the other stars.

[Snakebites]

2 players both putting up big numbers at the same time doesn't mean they're working well together.

[DTP]

I'm not sure how anyone can say that the Dre/Griffin pairing hasn't and won't work....those two guys actually seem to be fine and that specific pairing has worked way better than anyone could have expected it. The issue is the roster completely sucks outside of those two. The main problem is you have a coaching staff that can't put their players in the best position to succeed....a sign of a great coach is adjusting their "system" to the personnel but instead Casey tries to make the personnel adjust to his "system" and it hasnt worked at all. On top of that, your perimeter talent absolutely sucks. No one on the team has trade value at all and your point guard is no longer a starting quality guard anymore, not that his head coach has done any favors for him at all this season.

For the first time ever I am actually on board with tearing it down completely. Valenti kinda sold me on there are tons of teams that will have cap space this summer and when teams miss out on Durant and Leonard, there absolutely will be someone willing to take on Griffin as long as he can remain healthy the rest of this season and keep playing the way he has. Need to go into asset protection mode right now and make the focus keeping him healthy....I'm even fine with a couple more Rest DNPs. Deal Blake and deal Dre. If you can draft a point guard, I'm even okay with swallowing Jackson's salary for a year and just waiving him. Suck it up next year but there at least has to be someone that we're developing....someone that this fan base can believe in. Tear it down because your head coach cant do anything with this roster.

It's really hard to assess NBA teams anymore. I don't believe there's any right way to build a team. The only way is to get as much talent as possible on GOOD contracts. That's the key. Whether drafting, trading, signing. Whoever you're getting needs to be a good contract. Because when the Nets are above 500, don't you scratch your head over that? They haven't had a pick in 3 years. It tells you you don't need to tank. Pacers never tanked. Not even Bucks. Parker is the only player they tanked for and he's the only player that left the team. If we tank, we need to do it for one player only. The reason I want Drummond gone now is because he's peaking. This is the best we'll ever see him. In two years his legs are gonna slow down and he'll get out of the league as quickly as Hibbert did. So flip him! Here's what we need to do in my opinion. Trade Smith and Drummond. Why? Smith gets us wins, he needs to go so we can tank for Barrett. Drummond is at the peak of his career, he's done in Detroit. He talks, walks, and plays like a loser. He needs to gtfo. I like Smith but I think he's gonna give us wins. I like Bullock, I'd resign him but he can get us a first round pick from a team like Utah or Philly. I don't like Jackson but his contract is gonna be looking great next offseason, same with leuer and galloway.

What about Drummond's game make you think he's going to have a drastic fall off in two years? You know he's only 25 years old right? He's way more agile and athletic than Hibbert ever was, that's such a horrible comparison....Hibbert was a 7'2 center that couldnt move side to side very well, was never a great rebounder (Drummond is best in the league), and had a very limited offensive game. Drummond has a very limited offensive game too but his athleticism around the rim alone makes him better than Hibbert. Dre just needs to be put in the correct position to play within his strengths....you watch Dre post up once and you can tell he's horrible at it but yet that's where most of his offense has come from this season. That's on Casey. Calling Dre a loser is a bit harsh too...really don't understand that.

Everyone is so in love with Ish right now, are we forgetting that he's the reason we haven't made the post season the last two years? Not solely the reason but he's not a starter in this league, he's a good veteran point guard that can provide a spark off the bench. I highly doubt any team is giving up a first round pick for him. Bullock had a very good season last year but he isn't good enough to fetch a first either. Maybe both of them together for a team like Philly or New Orleans that's desperate, but even then I only see them pulling the trigger at the 11th hour on deadline day.

I'm personally against tanking too tbh but this team has been in such a hole the past decade, I'm almost ready to try anything. If I'm ownership I ask Blake if he wants out and if he does you ship him in the off season and tear it completely down. Otherwise stop being cheap, use their trade exception before it expires and get some perimeter shooting. Turn Ish Smith into any good asset you can.

[Spider156]

I'm not sure how anyone can say that the Dre/Griffin pairing hasn't and won't work....those two guys actually seem to be fine and that specific pairing has worked way better than anyone could have expected it. The issue is the roster completely sucks outside of those two. The main problem is you have a coaching staff that can't put their players in the best position to succeed....a sign of a great coach is adjusting their "system" to the personnel but instead Casey tries to make the personnel adjust to his "system" and it hasnt worked at all. On top of that, your perimeter talent absolutely sucks. No one on the team has trade value at all and your point guard is no longer a starting quality guard anymore, not that his head coach has done any favors for him at all this season.

For the first time ever I am actually on board with tearing it down completely. Valenti kinda sold me on there are tons of teams that will have cap space this summer and when teams miss out on Durant and Leonard, there absolutely will be someone willing to take on Griffin as long as he can remain healthy the rest of this season and keep playing the way he has. Need to go into asset protection mode right now and make the focus keeping him healthy....I'm even fine with a couple more Rest DNPs. Deal Blake and deal Dre. If you can draft a point guard, I'm even okay with swallowing Jackson's salary for a year and just waiving him. Suck it up next year but there at least has to be someone that we're developing....someone that this fan base can believe in. Tear it down because your head coach cant do anything with this roster.

It's really hard to assess NBA teams anymore. I don't believe there's any right way to build a team. The only way is to get as much talent as possible on GOOD contracts. That's the key. Whether drafting, trading, signing. Whoever you're getting needs to be a good contract. Because when the Nets are above 500, don't you scratch your head over that? They haven't had a pick in 3 years. It tells you you don't need to tank. Pacers never tanked. Not even Bucks. Parker is the only player they tanked for and he's the only player that left the team. If we tank, we need to do it for one player only. The reason I want Drummond gone now is because he's peaking. This is the best we'll ever see him. In two years his legs are gonna slow down and he'll get out of the league as quickly as Hibbert did. So flip him! Here's what we need to do in my opinion. Trade Smith and Drummond. Why? Smith gets us wins, he needs to go so we can tank for Barrett. Drummond is at the peak of his career, he's done in Detroit. He talks, walks, and plays like a loser. He needs to gtfo. I like Smith but I think he's gonna give us wins. I like Bullock, I'd resign him but he can get us a first round pick from a team like Utah or Philly. I don't like Jackson but his contract is gonna be looking great next offseason, same with leuer and galloway.

What about Drummond's game make you think he's going to have a drastic fall off in two years? You know he's only 25 years old right? He's way more agile and athletic than Hibbert ever was, that's such a horrible comparison....Hibbert was a 7'2 center that couldnt move side to side very well, was never a great rebounder (Drummond is best in the league), and had a very limited offensive game. Drummond has a very limited offensive game too but his athleticism around the rim alone makes him better than Hibbert. Dre just needs to be put in the correct position to play within his strengths....you watch Dre post up once and you can tell he's horrible at it but yet that's where most of his offense has come from this season. That's on Casey. Calling Dre a loser is a bit harsh too...really don't understand that.

Everyone is so in love with Ish right now, are we forgetting that he's the reason we haven't made the post season the last two years? Not solely the reason but he's not a starter in this league, he's a good veteran point guard that can provide a spark off the bench. I highly doubt any team is giving up a first round pick for him. Bullock had a very good season last year but he isn't good enough to fetch a first either. Maybe both of them together for a team like Philly or New Orleans that's desperate, but even then I only see them pulling the trigger at the 11th hour on deadline day.

I'm personally against tanking too tbh but this team has been in such a hole the past decade, I'm almost ready to try anything. If I'm ownership I ask Blake if he wants out and if he does you ship him in the off season and tear it completely down. Otherwise stop being cheap, use their trade exception before it expires and get some perimeter shooting. Turn Ish Smith into any good asset you can.

I think Drummond is a loser because he doesn't have the drive a winner has. It's simple, just look at how Gobert plays vs how Drummond plays. Drummond is better than Gobert but I'd say they're similar in their limitations offensively. The difference is the drive, the commitment to winning, the attitude about losing. After we lost last night all Drummond had to say was, "They made their shots and we didn't." No. We lost because he kept getting dunked on by Jordan. I don't care what the stats say, we lost. It really doesn't deserve much explanation. Compare him to Ben Wallace, end of discussion. He's a loser. I don't think he's the main problem. Our point guard is the problem. Just watch how Jackson dribbles in the 4th quarter like a little kid. It's embarrassing. If you're a winner you have to respond to bad wins and losses like how Blake responded before Jackson fooled around on camera. I'd give Drummond another year but it seems like he's the only one that'll get us any value back in trades and he's peaking right now in my opinion.

I think Ish can net us Fultz because Fultz is a lost cause. Philly completely broke his shot and the only way to progress in his career is if he goes to a new team. They're not gonna get more than a role player for him. He's not worth a pick. The longer they keep him the worse his value will get.

I think Bullock can net us a late first from Utah or Philly. He's 2.5m, if Utah doesn't gamble their first this season they're not gonna get any better than they already are. It's all about Mitchell's development.

Personally I'd resign both of them. Give Smith a similar contract and sign Bullock to 10m a year. He's no Danny Green worth 15m. He's not that good. Just watch him play. Spot up shooter, dribble left or right for an elbow jumpshot off a pick. He cuts. Past that and he's not that good. The issue with resigning both of them is Smith actually makes our team better. He's gonna ruin our fantastic tanking we've been doing. It's the same story every year. That's why I liked the Blake trade, we're gambling and that's what it takes to win. We have to shake it up. I think the best thing we can do is tank hard only this season to get Barrett. Then go for a guy like Conley. All of the sudden our team looks completely different. We're much better positioned to make a move in the offseason this is another issue. We'll see what happens. The Blake trade was good but only if they can replicate it again.

[Laimbeer]

Posted this in the trade thread, but it might go better here -

Maybe I'm in my denial stage, but I'm not sure our position is so hopeless. Blake has proven to be a better deal than we feared and all of our bad contracts are expirings next season. Blake, Dre (if he opts in), Kennard, Brown, and Thomas are our only commitments in 2020-21. We still have all our firsts.

I doubt we'll move Blake or Dre or tank, but If we don't do something dumb like take on a THJ or Batum type deal there's a light at the end of the tunnel.

[vic]

If Blake is still healthy By 20/21, I'm all for keeping him.

The main thing Im happy about is:
1. they keep losing
2. Stefanski drafts good 2-way players

As long as they dont trade any first rounders there's nowhere to go but up. This is rock bottom.

The direction is up. (Provided Ed doesn't trade any first rounders.)

[MotownMadness]

Posted this in the trade thread, but it might go better here -

Maybe I'm in my denial stage, but I'm not sure our position is so hopeless. Blake has proven to be a better deal than we feared and all of our bad contracts are expirings next season. Blake, Dre (if he opts in), Kennard, Brown, and Thomas are our only commitments in 2020-21. We still have all our firsts.

I doubt we'll move Blake or Dre or tank, but If we don't do something dumb like take on a THJ or Batum type deal there's a light at the end of the tunnel.

Yeah we could be pretty good next year if we can find another scoring option next to Blake. He needs another guy who can create his own shot to help take the pressure off at times.

[Canadafan]

Read on Twitter

[Canadafan]

Read on Twitter